I'm Not Dude!

[KempoGuy06]

i think the officer was both right and wrong. I cant make a judgement about the physical part because I cant see enough of it. I can however agree with the cop for yelling at the kid.

Im 23 and at 14 I was taught to show respect to everyone older than me. My parents would have busted my *** if I had talked to a cop like that. One of my best friends dad is a cop and everytime i see him in uniform its always 'sir' this and that. Thats how ingrained it is, whats funny is he gets mad at me.

What I dont like is how he tells the kid he is going to get killed if he keeps acting like that.

B

 

[MA-Caver]

What I don't like is how he tells the kid he is going to get killed if he keeps acting like that.

B

Yep, in some circumstances that could be considered a veiled threat.

 

[Touch Of Death]

Watching the video, got this tightening in my stomach. The officer IMO was way out of line. Yelling and screaming and humiliating the kid for one thing.
Good Morning America (can't get the link) was talking about how they don't know how old is the video, and what were circumstances before and then after the video. Granted they're right.
But it seems to me that the kids were enroute to someplace and just didn't want to walk past the building when they could've easily skated past it. Interview with the kid (Bush) indicated that was their intent.
Officer Rivieri probably did see an ordinance violation and was putting the stop to the kids, most likely with the intent to warn them.
However; apparently he didn't like being called "Dude" and went off on that.
Teenagers are still learning the ins and outs of human relations. Knowing when to "shut-up" and when and how to speak to authority figures can be a tough task and must be taught. Officer Rivieri took it upon himself to teach them.
Made me wonder if Rivieri was a parent, because if he is then I'd feel sorry for HIS kids.

I dunno, were this my kid I'd be screaming for Rivieri's head. This is a 14 yr. old boy he was dealing with. That should've been taken in consideration. "Dude" is a word used to refer to EVERYBODY by these kids. I had a friend a few years ago who used "Dude" and even called his own mother "Dude", it is not a disrespectful moniker by any means. True, calling the officer "Officer" or (better yet) "Sir" would've gone over better for the kids but still, I think a little tolerance and understanding of kids would've been helpful here as well.
The site asks for people to vote on the rightness and wrongness of the Officer in question.
Lets do that here with comments from both LEO's on the board and non-LEO's.
DId the cop go too far? Was the kid being disrespectful?
The kid did resist the officer's taking of his skateboard but it was a natural reaction because in a kid's mind (going a thousand miles per second) "how am I gonna get home?" & "I didn't do anything wrong, I was just skating here" and the kid is scared as well with an burly officer yelling at him.
The cop was right in stopping the kids because they were in violation of a city ordinance (no skateboards) but he went beyond (personal) restraint, in yelling and verbally abusing the kid(s).

On the other hand the kid had no business calling that guy, "dude".
Sean

 

[Andy Moynihan]

What I dont like is how he tells the kid he is going to get killed if he keeps acting like that.

B

Frankly-I can think of another participant in the video of whom the SAME can be said. I shudder to think ( well ok maybe I don't) what would happen the first time he tried that Eric Cartman routine on a genuine hardcase or group of same.

 

[Andrew Green]

Yep, in some circumstances that could be considered a veiled threat.

"I'll smack you upside the head"

"Your parents don't put a foot in your butt quite enough"

"I'm not man, I'm not dude, I am Officer Rivieri. Now the sooner you learn that the longer you are gonna live in this world. You go around doing this kind of stuff, someone's going to kill you."

Note he doesn't ask for the skateboard, until he's already manhandling the kid. It's off camera, but pretty clear.

In any circumstances I'd call that a threat.

Well, at least Officer Rivieri has been permanently immortalized as "Dude"

Dude knew damn well he was out of line, if he was acting professionally having a camera on him would be a good thing, saves him from false accusations.

The thing that bothers me most is this:
"Clifford said Rivieri's suspension entails a transfer to administrative duties with pay."

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/bal-te.md.officer12feb12,0,2952754.story

 

[That One Guy]

I will be very dissapointed if this jackass doesnt lose his job. If I lived in the same state I would be writing to the mayor, governer, and senators to demand this guys removal.

 

[AndyM]

I know there is more by way of a screening process for personality disorders than there used to be for potential LEO's.
This guy obviously slipped through the net.
It reflects badly on police everywhere, but all it takes is one bad apple......
Would he talk to an adult like that?
Someone his own size?
Why should kids not be respected by HIM?
Coward and Bully, not fit for the job.

 

[shesulsa]

The thing here is that respect is *so* grossly lacking in our world today and people undervalue that trait in themselves. This officer had the golden opportunity to show this young man the value of respect in a firm but good way - instead, he man-handled him, showing him to be afraid of LEOs rather than respect them.

What a pity for both of them.

 

[thardey]

The thing here is that respect is *so* grossly lacking in our world today and people undervalue that trait in themselves. This officer had the golden opportunity to show this young man the value of respect in a firm but good way - instead, he man-handled him, showing him to be afraid of LEOs rather than respect them.

What a pity for both of them.

I'm guessing "Dude" doesn't have a lot of self-respect, and has to demand it from others.

I'm he doesn't respect himself, he'll never really get it from others.

 

[newGuy12]

All I can say is this: If this guy is such a tough guy, so "in charge", then why doesn't he take charge of his body, loose some of that baby fat?

What a loser, LOL!

 

[Andy Moynihan]

All I can say is this: If this guy is such a tough guy, so "in charge", then why doesn't he take charge of his body, loose some of that baby fat?

What a loser, LOL!

First thing that made me laugh all day. I can't rep you so soon again but wanted to thank you for that.

 

[Doc_Jude]

I don't think the cop overstepped his bounds.....
I want kids to be scared to break the law or disrespect police.....isn't that the idea?

HAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAAA!!!! That's classic, man. If they don't have fear, put it into 'em, huh? :wink2:

 

[thardey]

HAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAAA!!!! That's classic, man. If they don't have fear, put it into 'em, huh? :wink2:

There are ways to put fear and respect of cops into kids -- that wasn't it. Now they respect him less.

 

[MJS]

I don't think the cop overstepped his bounds.....
I want kids to be scared to break the law or disrespect police.....isn't that the idea?

Is yelling at them like a madman the best way to enforce any respect though? What this cop did is no different than some high rank martial artist saying, "You WILL respect me because I'm a 6th degree black belt!" Sorry, but respect is a 2 way street. You need to give it to get it.

I worked in Corrections for a while. These guys could give a rats behind about me, and likewise, I wasn't there to make friends with them. However, I still needed to treat them with a certain amount of respect if I was to ever get them to do anything I directed them to do.

 

[MA-Caver]

All I can say is this: If this guy is such a tough guy, so "in charge", then why doesn't he take charge of his body, loose some of that baby fat?

What a loser, LOL!

That's good... made me recall some of my initial thoughts watching the video for the second time... hard to respect somebody who looks like they shouldn't be wearing shorts and high top black socks. Also had a good giggle at Shesulsa's observation that he was a Meter-Maid after all. Even if he's still a full fledged police officer, it's hard to take a guy seriously who's main job of the day is driving around in that little buggy, checking parking meters, wearing those shorts.

 

[jks9199]

I just finally got a chance to watch the video. There are several issues.

First -- regarding the use of force. I don't have a problem with it. The officer tells the kid to give him the skateboard; I don't blame him. The kid's already showing an attitude; a skateboard can be a great weapon (would you want to take a skateboard to the face?) or provide a means of immediate escape. The officer had every right to control that skateboard during the encounter. When the kid refused to surrender it, he used pretty reasonable force to control the kid, and to keep him seated. A simple takedown, and a push. And, if you can't tell, I feel he had justification.

As to his rant... That could have been handled better. But I don't blame him; I've dealt with that same sort of almost passive aggressive crap from kids. It can be pretty infuriating. And, sometimes, you speak in a language your target is going to understand. I've used language and said things in ways that would very possibly shock many of you used to how I write here -- because the people I'm dealing with aren't going to listen to anything else.

 

[newGuy12]

Well, at the end of the day, anyone knows that IF you go into some kind of law enforcement or security work, this is what you will be doing, more than most people have to. Fuss, fuss, fuss, always trying to tell people what to do, what not to do. That is part of the nature of that business.

And about that car, here they give him that silly looking car. That is a stupid thing to do. There will always be children wanting to ride those skateboards everywhere, no matter what the laws or rules are. That is not going to change.

No, this would not be an easy way to make money. And once you start arguing with people, every day, then that can turn the personality sour. That guy should get another job, one that is easier. For example, technical support, you are only helping people to address problems and overcome them, you do not have to fuss and argue. What a mess. And you know good and well that even now, as this guy is messing with these kids, there are another bunch of people close enough by doing other things that he will have to go and take care of. It just can't be worth the money. He should at least try to get some duty where he can show off, and be a big shot with a fancy police car and so forth. This job here is a mess.

That car is the silliest thing. Some suit wearing moron in the local government came up with that idea. Some idiot.

 

[Tez3]

I just finally got a chance to watch the video. There are several issues.

First -- regarding the use of force. I don't have a problem with it. The officer tells the kid to give him the skateboard; I don't blame him. The kid's already showing an attitude; a skateboard can be a great weapon (would you want to take a skateboard to the face?) or provide a means of immediate escape. The officer had every right to control that skateboard during the encounter. When the kid refused to surrender it, he used pretty reasonable force to control the kid, and to keep him seated. A simple takedown, and a push. And, if you can't tell, I feel he had justification.

As to his rant... That could have been handled better. But I don't blame him; I've dealt with that same sort of almost passive aggressive crap from kids. It can be pretty infuriating. And, sometimes, you speak in a language your target is going to understand. I've used language and said things in ways that would very possibly shock many of you used to how I write here -- because the people I'm dealing with aren't going to listen to anything else.

I think we need a new thread for policing styles as this is way different from how it would be treated over here. For a start people we speak to aren't 'targets' and while I wouldn't want to be complacent the likeihood of been hit by a kid with a skateboard is low here. Kids like this if talked to properely are rarely a problem. One of the things that is taught to us is the "my attitude- your attitude" lesson. How your attitude will affect how someone is going to respond to you. I think British coppers have always been more for chatting to people than from what I've seen of American police, there may be many factors for this, probably worth exploring somewhere else but I have to say I'm a bit shocked by JKS' post!
It should be said though that people shouldn't mistake the British police's more laid back attitude for weakness though.

 

[morph4me]

I imagine those kids called everyone "dude", friends more then anyone else. All I saw was a real life version of Eric Cartman demanding they "Resepect my Authorita!"

They where kids, and in his eyes had no rights and deserved no respect. Just that they obey his every word as if it was the word of God.

I saw the same thing, the officer demanded respect, but didn't give it and did nothing to earn it.

I would want to see the whole thing before I judged too much ... but here are some things that bother me:

1. Fourteen. Male. 'Nuff said. When I was 14, my English teacher took me and a few others to her classroom at lunch for a few days to get us to stop saying "like" every other word, and ya know what? It was hard!

2. "If you were my kid I'd smack you ..." ... really? Lesson #1: Respect and Fear are not the same nor are they necessarily interdependent. There are several other things he said in that video that bother me.

3. Although we can't see the boy when the meter maid ... er, I mean officer ... physically addresses him, I'm wondering why exactly he needed to do this. Let's say the kid told him to **** off and flipped him off - he still could have gone about his job calmly, no? If the kid flashed a knife, gun, fistpack or anything else, the officer *should* have pulled his firearm and ordered him to the ground. So his insistence at going after the kid bothers me.

See, this is a good example of why kids don't and won't respect the law and law enforcement officers - this is not a good example.

AGAIN - caveat being that we did not see the entire incident.

AND - fair enough that this kid clearly did not know how to properly respond to an LEO.

While I agree with the whole post, not understanding the bolded paragraph really seems to be officers biggest issue.. He seems to think that bullying will make the kid respect him, makes me wonder if he treats adults the same way.

 

[jks9199]

I think we need a new thread for policing styles as this is way different from how it would be treated over here. For a start people we speak to aren't 'targets' and while I wouldn't want to be complacent the likeihood of been hit by a kid with a skateboard is low here. Kids like this if talked to properely are rarely a problem. One of the things that is taught to us is the "my attitude- your attitude" lesson. How your attitude will affect how someone is going to respond to you. I think British coppers have always been more for chatting to people than from what I've seen of American police, there may be many factors for this, probably worth exploring somewhere else but I have to say I'm a bit shocked by JKS' post!
It should be said though that people shouldn't mistake the British police's more laid back attitude for weakness though.

A large chunk of the difference is the clientele I've been dealing with for the last few years...

I have to be able to fluidly shift from dealing with gang banging punks who will mistake a "please, you can't skateboard in the park" for weakness to the young parents I interviewed about an offense where their car was described (they were clearly uninvolved) last night.

It's about how you talk to people... but most of the effective cops here have a pretty simple approach. One part can be stolen from the line in Road House; "you be nice until it's time to not be nice." Running in tandem with that is a simple way of handling things: I ask someone one time to do something, then I tell them to do it, and then I make them do it. You have to know when you're making progress with requests and when it's time to stop asking and make them; to distinguish the gripers who'll do it complaining the whole time from the real "no" people, who aren't going to comply until they're forced to.

Like I said -- I'm not giving this officer a blanket pass. His rant was unprofessional, at best. But his use of force, in the situation from what was presented... Not unreasonable. Not great, not particularly wise perhaps, but not unreasonable. That's a separate issue from the rant. The article posted with the video is not a particularly balanced description; it's clear from the video that the officer's actions didn't begin with knocking the kid down. He starts talking to them from a distance; the kid's attitude was not compliant. Even the kid's buddies were telling him to shut up. The officer asks for the skateboard; the kid doesn't give it up. And the officer escalates in response.

He's been suspended during the investigation. He'll probably be reassigned, and likely lose a couple of days (or more) pay. And... he's been publicly humiliated. That's going to affect his job in many ways.

A side comment: Yes, he could stand to lose a few pounds. So could I. (In fact, I could stand to lose more than a few.) But he's also wearing body armor. Kind of says something about your job when "going to the office" involves putting on body armor and carrying multiple weapons. Even in what seems to be a tourist area.