Have some martial arts lost their venom?

[thaiboxer]

hi all

Ive heard a lot of stories, lot of big heads, crazy claims etc etc whilst being involved in quite a few martial arts forums.

I just have a few questions for you all. And for you to comment on.

Some people are either making excuses for effectiveness of some martial arts by claiming "they just arent like what they used to be years ago". How the hell can anyone argue that, it makes for a good excuse for ineffective styling as well. Or is it true, have there been certain techniques lost over the years due to miscommunication between many people. This would be highly unfortunate and sad really. Im the kind of person who likes to see things done how they were intended, perhaps with a little tinkering to correct a technique to get a little more power or something. Were some martial arts watered down due to teaching to the masses to prevent extremely violent ways spreading sometime ago?

just a few questions i guess, like to hear your thoughts

 

[Dutch]

If an art isn't about the "beat down" and doing it in an honorable way then it's no good.
:soapbox:

 

[thaiboxer]

Originally posted by Dutch

If an art isn't about the "beat down" and doing it in an honorable way then it's no good.
:soapbox:

well i agree it should be honorable, but realistically on the street who is going to be honorable about things?

 

[Dutch]

Originally posted by thaiboxer



well i agree it should be honorable, but realistically on the street who is going to be honorable about things?

Not Gou, that's for sure. He has no honor.

 

[Rainman]

I think some arts... okay a lot of businesses have watered down contact. People get hurt, can't make any money if the student body doesn't come back. Tag tournes and such are not good because of contact rules. They gut power, on the street it could develope some bad habbits. I think you fight how you train.

 

[tshadowchaser]

Some arts hold certian forms and technques for thoses of high rank (4th black and over) This may be bad because of so few people reaching these ranks and so many dyeing off due to illness and old age.I have wondered if the true teaching in these schools actualy starts at this level.I do know some are this way because so many people studied for a short while then went elsewhere (a few times) or opened their own schools as soon as they had enough material to make it look like they knew whaey where doing.
Other schools have softened their training to stay out of court (here in the "that hurt lets sue them" USA. A few others that I know have softened teaching in the lower ranks (below Black) to keep enough students to keep the place open
All of the above HURTS the arts
IMHO
Shdow

 

[Cthulhu]

I think it's a sad thing that instructors feel the need to 'water down' their art to prevent injuries and lawsuits from same. I get bloody lips every other session, and I don't complain. Okay, I complain a little, but only because I find it funny to make my guro feel guilty (don't tell Al that, arnisandyz! ).

Anyway, in studying a martial art, I understand that it is a physically demanding activity, and the potential for injury is fairly high. However, I understand this, and unless there is gross incompetence involved, I don't mind.

Cthulhu

 

[tshadowchaser]

I fully agree with the that 100%
If I didn't get "dinged" everypractice sometime would be wrong

 

[Toasty]

Dutch,
Really dude. wht the F is the matter with you?
The "beatdown"? what the heck is that how can you learn to beat anything with the crap called Dragon Kenpo, it s damn close to being the original Mcdojo garbage. It was all a scam to make money off of stunted immature wannabes like you.
Grow up.

 

[Battousai]

I know that I get some sort of injury everytime when I practise one on one with a friend. But in class I rarely get hurt. And I think thats good. There are alot of people out there looking for personal improvement, from people in their 70's to mother's. And I don't think its ok for these people to get injured in classes.
And it could be said that this is what we are talking about when we discuss "watered down" martial arts, and thats totally valid. I think martial arts should be for everyone, and the risk of injury should be so low that no one should fear getting hurt. I don't think the risk of injury should be high at all. This may make some things by nesessity watered down, but not in my school. In my school, things that would need to be watered down should not be taught until students have learned enough control not to hurt their uki, (I say should not because sadly sometimes they are when the instructor's (myself included) make the mistake of giving students more then they can handle).
Getting hurt in class speaks more about the lack of control of those involved then it does for the hard core techniques taught. During my last class with my instructor, he did a throw in such a manner that the vertibrae of my neck stretched and felt like my head was being pulled off, but there was so much control in his technique that I felt the power of it without the neck pain that would have followed if someone else like myself would have tryed it.

After stating such, I have to say that I believe that martial arts have undergone major amounts of being watered down and defanged. And its horrible.

 

[Dutch]

Originally posted by Toasty

Dutch,
Really dude. wht the F is the matter with you?
The "beatdown"? what the heck is that how can you learn to beat anything with the crap called Dragon Kenpo, it s damn close to being the original Mcdojo garbage. It was all a scam to make money off of stunted immature wannabes like you.
Grow up.

Please don't be angry with me. It's not my fault you are coming to the realization that my style is greater than yours. I too had to learnt he hard way that there are styles that will always be superior. No one likes to realize that the time they have spent is about as useful as playing withyourself in a snowstorm. It's only natural that you would be angry when confronted with the concept that my style is better than yours. Your projected anger is understandable and I forgive you for your ignorance.

 

[deadhand31]

yeah, don't forget, dutch paid $45 for his video certification! His videos taught him how to fight on the street, as long as it's nothing out of the ordinary.

 

[Toasty]

You really believe that drgon kenpo is superior to Muay Thai?

Oh, oh i get it you are a Troll and all the stuff you have been saying is to make people think you really ever spent more than 1 minute training.

But i gotta tell you that whole dragon kenpo is superior to my "style" is some funny S#!T. (by the way you didnt even know what my style/system was when you wrote that, so obviously you truly believe that the garbage you train in {and it is garbage you know - i've seen the tapes you dolt} is "superior" to all other arts).

Respond or dont, i have to go train now (something you might wanna to check into).

Rob

 

[Dutch]

I doubt that either of you have seen the Dragon kenpo tapes as either of you probably can't read, much less be able to work a VCR.

 

[deadhand31]

So, Dutch, is that where you learned Dragon Kenpo? Through the tapes? Or did you have an instructor there to help? Whichever way you wanna learn is fine.

 

[arnisador]

This thread is now locked.

-Arnisador
-MT Mod-