Desperately seeking supplements

[Flea]

I really need to do more reading on nutrition.

For the most part I think I do pretty well by what feels right intuitively for my body. My tastes tend to run toward the healthful anyway, with lots of fresh produce, lean meats, tofu, and whole grains.

During those rare times when there's too much month at the end of the money, I'm down to just eating carbs. They have shelf life, which means they're always dependably in my pantry, and they fill me up. That's the best I can say for it. After a couple days I crash - my energy level drops, I lose focus and get depressed, I stop craving particular foods (I always crave something.) Because I lose focus it can become a vicious cycle pretty quickly because I run out of ideas for cooking too.

What to do? I double up on my multivitamin and hope for the best. Much as I hate canned meat and veggies, I reach deeper into my pantry for the lesser evil and gag my way through some casserole or other. Today I'm soaking dried black beans to throw into the crockpot with cans of corn, green beans, and tomatoes. I do have some cheese in the freezer.

At any rate, my point with all this is ... why does a too-high-carb diet have this soporific effect? Especially considering that so much of the world gets by on rice with a handful of beans, fish, or meat. I'm sure the entire third world doesn't got as logy as I do. Either that, or they're just used to eating that way.

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

Lots of possible reasons. Much has to do with blood type. I'm guessing the carbs you're eating are heavily wheat based, and you're blood type O. Wheat and corn -- especially now after genetic modification for crop size & production -- contain protiens that are

1. Almost impossible for the body to break down, but it gives iot the old college try anyway, depleting enzyme reserves in the gut...so they aren't as readily available to extract energy from food eaten at later meals...meaning you eat for energy, but get tired anyways, and;

2. act as allergens to certain blood types, causing the body to go into an inflammatory reaction, sapping your energy reserves. Your body thinks it's sick & starving (cuz it can't get at the foods you eat), and is closing down non-essential functions to conserve energy.

My ex-wife is Type O -- feed her a pasta dinner or a coupla corn chips, and the next day she couldn't get rings off fingers, had bags under her eyes, and would feel hungover. We switched to Rice and Spelt pasta products (gotta read the label...many rice pastas also include wheat, or wheat glutens), and the problem stopped. If we want to induce inflammation in her, all we gotta do is feed her a croissant, bagel, piece of wheat toast, whatever.

My mother is Type O -- was going through about a year of crippling back and organ pain of unidentified origin -- drag for me as a Chiro to not be able to help her. This goes on for a year; some buncha special tests get ordered, and Pops asks if I can help get here there in the AM, as she is unable to walk. So I stay the night at their house...where Mom proceeds -- in a drug-induced stupor -- to eat bags and bags of wheat and corn chips. I ask pops if this is new; Nope. Common. Been doing it for (guesses anybody?) about a year, starting just before the onset of the pain syndrome. We cut her off cold turkey, replace her foods with lean meats and rice-based carb sources, and the pain stops.

I'm Type A -- no such reactions. I have other foods I have to avoid; I will predictably feel flu-ish if I eat them. So I don't.

As for nuts and beans...there are a few foods we simply don't digest well, particularly in large doses...and when is the last time you saw someone have only a couple nuts, and not handfuls and handfuls? Nuts, corn, beans, etc., look the same going out as they did coming in for a reason. Our enzymes will attach to them in a best-effort to break them down, but they will fail. Either cut them out of your food chain, or pick up a bottle of some digestive enzymes, and take them with your meals; it will help access the nutrition in the foodstuffs, so you get at least some of the benefit you're looking for. On that same note, stay away from nuts and nut-butters, even though they are convenient and cheap. In some GI tract experiments where it was desirable to deplete the gastrointestinal tracts of digestive enzymes, animals get fed nothing but nuts for 3 days straight. The resident enzymes all ride out of the body on the indigestable nut protiens, trying like hell as they go.

Good ideas to preserve energy when that end-of-month stretch hits:

1. Get some Flax seed oil, and pour liberally on your carb dishes. Helps trigger satiety center in the brain so you feel full...carbs alone don;t do that, and you end up eating alot before you feel full. Meaning you're spiking your insulin levels, causing a body-wide energy crisis, and dealing with the energy let-downs that follow heavy carb consumption.

2. Get a protien powder supplement; drink a shake in the AM, and a shake in the PM. Get jiggy with it, and add some flax oil to the mixture. Forms a damn-near perfect food, nutrient rich. I generallt prefer Muscle Milk.

3. Finally, buy a Green drink powder. Locally, we have a store called Trader Joes. They sell a pretty decent one, dirt cheap. 8 bucks for approx 1.5 to 2 week supply. Drink in AM and PM with your shake. If you don't live near a Trader Joes, any super green drink will do. Don;t have to get the all-out super-duper expensive ones; even the cheapies are better than nada.

For almost all of my supplemental needs, I use iherb.com. Even with shipping and handling, they are almost always 40 to 50 percent cheaper than buying it at the stores.

D.

Great green product (Jarrow consistently makes good, affordable stuff)
http://www.iherb.com/Jarrow-Formulas-Green-Defense-6-35-oz-180-g-Powder/128?at=0

Flax oil
http://www.iherb.com/Now-Foods-Certified-Organic-High-Lignan-Flax-Seed-Oil-12-fl-oz-355-ml/1134?at=0

Protien options:
http://www.iherb.com/MRM-Whey-Pumped-100-All-Natural-Dutch-Chocolate-2-02-lbs-917-08-g/7025?at=0

and if you need one not based in milk products:
http://www.iherb.com/NutriBiotic-Vanilla-Rice-Protein-3lb-1-36-kg/4218?at=0 for rice, and
http://www.iherb.com/Now-Foods-Eggwhite-Protein-1-lb-454-g/547?at=0 for egg. Love this NOW brand egg one, personally...great stuff.

Digestive enzymes:
http://www.iherb.com/Jarro-Zymes-Plus-470-mg-100-Capsules/257?at=0
Jarrow again -- cuz I trust them for quality at a fair price.

 

[Ken Morgan]

Hey Dave, the blood typing sounds interesting, have you got a link to some research on it? I’d love to read it.

Flea, I’d add in the protein powers as Dave says. Watch what you buy, there is some nasty stuff out there.

I don’t know your tolerance level but I would add in egg whites and some dairy for extra protein too. Try different carb sources, whole wheat, spelt and the like, see how it works for you, some are easier on the body and some have higher nutritional value.

I know times are hard, but what about a food bank or something to help you get by?

 

[Flea]

Kembudo-Kai, you are a marvel as always. :asian:

After my OP I opened my fridge and laughed - a little pancake batter, half a loaf of bread, some rice. It explains a few things, eh? Frugality is usually a good thing, but sometimes it's asking for trouble. I think this is a prime example. (I will, however, still make the black-beans-and-canned veggie goop.) Payday, blessedly, is tomorrow. I also remember from my college days as an anthropology student reading about the Cahokia metropolis. Authorities say that the corn-based diet was a major factor leading to their demise. I don't doubt it.

Can you recommend some good books for me to read up on this stuff? Clearly I need the help.

Edit ---> Ken, I hear you on the food bank, and I've thought about it. The thing is that they only offer canned food, and my body doesn't get anything out of that. Beyond that though, it's embarrassing. I've volunteered at just about every social service agency in town, so the odds of someone behind the counter recognizing me are pretty good. I'm sure they wouldn't stigmatize me, but ... I'm just not comfortable with it.

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

http://www.dadamo.com/science.htm

There's an ongoing battle btw medico's and nutrition folk. For me, the proof is in the dozens of patients, friends, and family who have improved significantly when eating according to their type. I'll stick with individual results as the best evidence...but then, I'm that kinda guy.

D.

 

[girlbug2]

I'm also a practicioner of the blood type o diet, and what the above poster said makes a lot of sense. Type Os weren't meant for an agricultural diet, generally. Eventually it makes us arthritic and type 2 diabetic. We do best with lots of meat.

Having said that, if the price of fresh meats and Omega 3 supplements are out of the question, get the same benefit from canned fish, especially--surprise--sardines, with or without oil. If you can find the olive oil type, that's the best. It's cheap, it'll fill you up and keep you satisfied for 5 to 6 hours. That's the magic of proteins and fats.

Cheap carbs aren't really a solution to poverty, as they come with hidden costs.

 

[Carol]

* picks my jaw up off the floor *

Ummm...OK. I thought this diet was a bunch of unprovable hooey.

But, I think I just went from skeptic to converted.

I've had to completely rework my eating habits after the (pre?)diabetes scare. Biggest thing the doc was trying to impress upon me was to reduce my portion size.

What I had to manage was getting everything to work for my night shift schedule. I'm terrible at cooking for myself before I go to work, I usually grab dinner at a local Greek or Italian place. Instead I've been going to the local grocery store.

The grocery store near me has a wide variety of prepared meals for sale, in addition to options such as frozen dinners. I've been trying to force my self to pick something that would be satisfying (to me) in smaller quantities.

Green salads, plain yogurt, fruit-flavored goat's milk yogurt, miso soup, sushi from the seafood department, a box of berries or peaches. With few exceptions, thatss pretty much what I have been eating for the last 6 weeks. It was a welcome break from the chicken and eggplant parm that doesn't really seem to suit me well anyway. I don't really miss the lack of variety.

So when I saw this....

http://www.drlam.com/blood_type_diet/blood_a_chart.asp

Uh, OK. Well, that's pretty much what I'm doing. This isn't unusual for me, either. My mom even mentioned (to a friend joining us for dinner) that I've alsways been more of a vegetarian. Sidebar comment: I'm the only A in a family of Os.

A couple of criticisms.

I think the benefits of the diet are a overhyped. Its being promoted as a magic pill. Its not. What I do see happening with me is that my body feels better with the kind of food I'm eating. I'm feeling satisfied with less food. This has a benefit, but it is not a cure for the challenges that I have to face. I KNOW I am not going to lose much weight unless I exercise more, perhaps this is one of the stepping stones that helps me get there...if I stick with it.

Which brings me to my second criticism...sticking with it.

This is a tough diet to follow if you have to eat on the run. I don't like to eat that way but....it happens. Also, I am enjoying the food choices that I am making now because it is summer and there are so many wonderful produce choices available. Will I have the same enthusiasm come fall or winter, when the cherries, apricots, peaches, and berries that I love to eat are no longer available, or available at an exhorbitant price?

Sooo....I dunno. Whether its bunk or not, I think my body is telling me that it likes salad and a plate of sushi better than it likes chicken parm. Whatever the reason why, I don't plan on ignorning that

 

[Ken Morgan]

I’m with you Carol,

I’m blood type A too and am the biggest skeptic going on everything, so I really need hard scientific evidence before I believe anything. In reading the information provided, I’m not yet convinced, but honestly? From what I’m reading, it doesn’t matter, just eat a well balanced diet, keep processed food to a minimum and exercise. Maybe there is something to it.

Coming from, 30, (damn!! Really that long??!!) years of serious weight training and running, plus 10 years of MA, I know what my body needs to work at its best. High protein and complex carbs, with fruit, veggies and chocolate thrown into the mix works best for me. The vegetarian thing would simply not work for me. I have never, ever had any type digestive problems with what I do.

 

[Carol]

I think what really opened my eyes was that a lot of the foods on the "avoid" list were foods that were my "trigger foods" for lack of a better word. I love eating them but after eating a normal sized portion I still feel hungry.

I really like that the overall diet is based on eating fresh stuff and not processed junk....or even worse, processed junk you have to buy to be part of a weight-loss plan, lol. I think I'm going to use this as a guideline for awhile and see what kind of success I have with it. It certainly can't hurt.

 

[Tez3]

One of the trainers at the gym I go to put me onto foods that I should avoid with having an underactive thyroid. I've also gone onto eating far more protein and cutting back a lot on carbohydrates eating frankly only a little now. I changed from eating white bread to wholemeal, cut out pasta,potatoes, rice and anything with white flour in plus other things. the change has been wonderful, more energy, the weight is starting to come off slowly but it's coming off which I despaired it ever would. I have more energy to execise which is the key I think. I work shifts which are lousy for maintaining any healthy diet. I'm blood type O as well and seem to have graduated towards food as described as being good for O types, I agree on the meat thing though am trying to keep it to white meat at the moment.

 

[Jade Tigress]

http://www.dadamo.com/science.htm

There's an ongoing battle btw medico's and nutrition folk. For me, the proof is in the dozens of patients, friends, and family who have improved significantly when eating according to their type. I'll stick with individual results as the best evidence...but then, I'm that kinda guy.

D.

This is fascinating. I'm blood type B and the accuracies I read on the link, and know about myself, are astonishing. I'm gonna have to do more research on this. :asian:

 

[Ian]

The blood group diet is well worth looking into. As part of some Naturopathic study I did here in the UK we were advised that (depending on your preference for nutritional models) the blood group diet can be a good starting point. However it was noted that there was always a percentage of people who did not fit with their particular suggested blood group diet. I do seem to benefit if I stick to my suggested diet.
There are of course other nutritional models that valid.

 

[teekin]

Flea Baby, what you need is a Roomy to share the cost of housing. A nice, OK maybe "nice" isn't the right word, uummmm lets try sweet, kind, tough and fiscally responsible woman to share the bills with while she finishes her nursing schooling and specialties. ( I live on frozen fruit, soy milk and protein powder. My dog food costs more than my food).
That's my solution. I do know that carbs, simple carbs are never ever the answer. You may as well just pour raw sugar into your mouth. Once your salivary amalyse touch any single chain carbohydrate it becomes a monosacharide, aka glucose, aka sugar. neat huh?

lori

 

[Flea]

I'm reviving this thread to ask a quickie question. Kembudo-kai, you mentioned green drink powder. Would this be a good equivalent for someone without a blender? Since shoveling out my condo for staging I'm loath to bring in any more stuff, no matter how pragmatic.

I tried your suggestion with the flax oil and I was a bit shocked at how suddenly and completely it shut down my hunger. It was almost a little scary. I could see the potential for abuse in something like that.

In any case, I've made a few simple no-nonsense changes to my diet that are paying off beautifully. Multis and fish oil have also made a huge difference for me. Thanks again for your help everyone!

 

[Skippy]

With my students I also offer personal training. When somebody first comes to me I find out their health history, what their goals are, etc ... Being healthy & being fit are two different things. I learned this concept years ago from team Doctors' while playing football in Europe or as it's call here in the States soccer. That old saying ... You are what you eat is quite true. It's like buying a nice sports car if all you do is wash & wax it & fill it with fuel once a week without checking under the hood you will end up with a nice looking car that doesn't run. Same goes for the human body.


Fruits, veggies, grains all good for you. Five small meals a day include these items. Do this for six day on. While on this six day routine if you crave meat have chicken or fish. Then give yourself one cheat day. You will never be hungry this way or have the desire to binge eat & varry your workouts with training. You will end up with more energy & good results. Also drink lots of water. If you need more details just send me a message & I will help you out.:uhyeah:

 

[Xinglu]

I'm reviving this thread to ask a quickie question. Kembudo-kai, you mentioned green drink powder. Would this be a good equivalent for someone without a blender? Since shoveling out my condo for staging I'm loath to bring in any more stuff, no matter how pragmatic.

I tried your suggestion with the flax oil and I was a bit shocked at how suddenly and completely it shut down my hunger. It was almost a little scary. I could see the potential for abuse in something like that.

In any case, I've made a few simple no-nonsense changes to my diet that are paying off beautifully. Multis and fish oil have also made a huge difference for me. Thanks again for your help everyone!

Blender? Blender?! We don't need no stinking blender!

Try shaking your drinks... Blending adds heat that may damage nutrients.

And no, that supplement doesn't touch the Green Defense as that has probiotics, enzymes, fructooligosaccharides (prebiotics), and herbs that will help with organ function (take the milk thistle for example, it helps purify and protect the liver). Also, the Green defense offers a substantial amount of antioxidant support measured at >2100 ORAC rating, the Swanson one fails to list such a rating. I am also very familiar with Jarrow and the high quality they provide.

 

[Flea]

My concern with the blender is that when I've bought these things before they tend to ball up and get pasty without the appliance. Then it's like drinking a boba tea ... without the tea, the boba, the flavor ... plegh.

So what is the difference between the stuff I linked to and a green drink? I'm very much a supplement virgin.

 

[xJOHNx]

I'm bloodgroup type A. Have been fat and lazy my whole life. I ate tons of meat.

6 or 7 years ago I started being vegan. I went from fat to ripped in 8 weeks. And I really mean losing up to 25 pounds of fat.

Didn't know that until this thread

 

[Xinglu]

So what is the difference between the stuff I linked to and a green drink? I'm very much a supplement virgin.

Swansons:
GREENS
Alfalfa
Broccoli
Spinach
Barley Grass
Cabbage
Kale
Kelp
Wheatgrass

OTHER VEGETABLES
Beets
Carrots

Herbs
Parsley
Celery Seed
Oregano
Oder-controled Garlic (One of garlics greatest benefits [aside from cardiovascular health] is to lung heath. The oder reduction means that you loose that.)

Jarrow:
GREENS
Organic Barley Grass Juice Powder
Organic Quinoa
Organic Spirulina
Organic Oat Grass Juice Powder
Organic Wheat Grass Juice Powder
Spinach
Broccoli (1.2% sulphoraphan)

OTHER VEGETABLES
Beets

FRUIT
Tomato

HERBS/BOTANICALS
Tiger Cane Extract (Polygonum Cuspidatum) (source of Resveratrol)
Quercetin (from Dimorphandra mollis)
Milk Thistle Extract (80% Silymarin) (Silybum marianum)
Citrus Bioflavonoids
Ginger (50:1) (Zingiber officinale)
Green Tea Extract (45% Polyphenols/30% Catechins)(Camellia sinensis)
Grape Seed Extract (90% Polyphenols) (Vitis vinifera)
Ginkgo Biloba Extract (Ginkgo biloba)

FIBERS
Nutra FOS (FructoOligoSaccharide)
Rice Bran Powder
Apple Fiber

PROBIOTICS
Metabolin (Propionibacterium shermani)

_______________________________________________________________

COMPARISON
Swanson :: S, Jarrow :: J

Total Greens and Vegetable Content:
J: 2.41g, S: 800mg (.8g)

Total Herb/Botanical Content:
J: 320mg, S: 290mg (think this is a slim margin, however the Jarrow formula is a better grouping of herbs)

Total Dietary Fiber content:
J: 3g S: Data not disclosed (In this case, Jarrow wins by default, fiber is important when choosing a greens supplement, especially FOS since that will help with intestinal health and maintaining stable/healthy probiotic cultures in your intestines. Swansons claims to have fiber, but doesn't disclose the amount. IMO, that probably indicates low amounts.

Probiotics: Jarrow wins again Swansons has no probiotics.

Total Oxygen Radical Absorbance Capacity (ORAC) Rating (AKA antioxidant potency):

J: >2100, S: Undisclosed data. They claim antioxidant activity, which I don't doubt, however I seriously doubt they even com close to Jarrow's numbers here just by looking at the formulas.

So comparatively, Jarrow offers three times as many greens and veggies than Swansons, has a Better ORAC rating, has more Herbs and a better blend, more fiber, and offers probiotics where Swansons does not.

 

[Xinglu]

I'm bloodgroup type A. Have been fat and lazy my whole life. I ate tons of meat.

6 or 7 years ago I started being vegan. I went from fat to ripped in 8 weeks. And I really mean losing up to 25 pounds of fat.

Didn't know that until this thread

I'm the same bloodtype, and I ate meat my entire life as well and was pushing two hundred pounds. I made a choice to become a vegetarian and I lost twenty pounds in my first two months. When I was finally introduced to the Bloodtype diet and the Genotype diet (the companion to the BT diet) I lost an additional fifteen pounds. In this period of time, the only thing I had change was my eating habits and food choices.