crossing legs?

Grey Eyed Bandit

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We're all learning, and we're all human. No one likes to put up with having to correct the same errors over and over again.
 

Don Roley

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gmunoz said:
I don't care how experienced a person is or how knowledgeable they think they are if their attitude sucks or they make me feel less than. I'm completely open to advice of more experienced folks, but not from those with nasty elitist attitudes. It's all in their attitude - whether they intend it or not - it's the way they're perceived by others.


:-offtopic

But as long as it seems that is ok, let me just state that I have seen pretty bad examples of attitude from people who know nothing- and they are the ones to most often complain about other people's attitude.

If I had a dime for every time some person came across laying down the law, only to have all of his statements shot down with fact and logic and then complain about how the other side is snotty.... I could take a quick trip to the states.

When you talk about opinions, you state your opinions. The opinion of a medical doctor on a patient' condition tends to carry a bit more weight than an intern or a layman. Sometimes the background of a person does make a difference when trying to determine whether to believe their opinions or not.

And then there are facts. And facts are not really as debatable as opinions. And in the case of this thread, cross stepping is not only used for stealth training in the Bujinkan- it is also an important move in techniques from the Koto ryu and the like. And there are other arts that use similar techniques. I have already mentioned, and provided video links, for other arts such as Silat that use cross stepping. This is a fact. Now if you want to say you think that everyone who has ever done cross stepping in all the varied arts it appears in is wrong and you are right then we are dealing with opinion. If there are no facts to bring to the table and let others see for themselves, and people cannot be confinced by the logic of your arguments, then the background of the person may be an issue.
 

Don Roley

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Kalifallen said:
Anyway, isn't this a forum? A place you can go to be corrected and ask questions so you can learn.

But go back to your original statement and you can see that it was not a question, or an opinion. You stated what you did as if it was a fact set in stone. You see the problem?

You may feel that you are being treated like you know nothing, but when you state things that are not true with such conviction, what other response is appropriate?

Sometimes it is best to just to try to listen more than you speak.
 

Kreth

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Kalifallen said:
Kreth,
When can you cross-step in a fight? I sadly don't see any room to.
It would be impossible for me to answer this without knowing more about the type of fight. You might as well ask when you can throw a left jab in a fight.
I mean, I'd just hate it to see people say, "Don't believe the novice's or the lower kyu's. The higher kyu's and the black belts you should listen to because they have been learning that art longer."
I'm not saying people shouldn't listen to you. I'm saying you should avoid phrasing your opinions as fact, especially given your lack of real training.

Jeff
 

gmunoz

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Don Roley said:
:-offtopic

But as long as it seems that is ok, let me just state that I have seen pretty bad examples of attitude from people who know nothing- and they are the ones to most often complain about other people's attitude.

If I had a dime for every time some person came across laying down the law, only to have all of his statements shot down with fact and logic and then complain about how the other side is snotty.... I could take a quick trip to the states.

When you talk about opinions, you state your opinions. The opinion of a medical doctor on a patient' condition tends to carry a bit more weight than an intern or a layman. Sometimes the background of a person does make a difference when trying to determine whether to believe their opinions or not.

And then there are facts. And facts are not really as debatable as opinions. And in the case of this thread, cross stepping is not only used for stealth training in the Bujinkan- it is also an important move in techniques from the Koto ryu and the like. And there are other arts that use similar techniques. I have already mentioned, and provided video links, for other arts such as Silat that use cross stepping. This is a fact. Now if you want to say you think that everyone who has ever done cross stepping in all the varied arts it appears in is wrong and you are right then we are dealing with opinion. If there are no facts to bring to the table and let others see for themselves, and people cannot be confinced by the logic of your arguments, then the background of the person may be an issue.

Fair enough. I've seen and used crossing legs even in a standard Juji no Kata and it all depends, imo, on the positioning of the individual and their opponent. Sometimes it works for me, other times no.
 

gmunoz

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Kreth said:
It would be impossible for me to answer this without knowing more about the type of fight. You might as well ask when you can throw a left jab in a fight.

I'm not saying people shouldn't listen to you. I'm saying you should avoid phrasing your opinions as fact, especially given your lack of real training.

Jeff
Could it be that the lower ranked practitioners aren't intending to state opinions as fact and that the upper ranks have a preconceived notion and tendency to read it as such?
 

Kreth

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gmunoz said:
Could it be that the lower ranked practitioners aren't intending to state opinions as fact and that the upper ranks have a preconceived notion and tendency to read it as such?
Well, I dunno... how does this read to you?:
Kalifallen said:
Cross step technique is ONLY used when stealthing.
To me, it looks like someone speaking as an authority on the subject.

Jeff
 

gmunoz

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Kreth said:
Well, I dunno... how does this read to you?:

To me, it looks like someone speaking as an authority on the subject.

Jeff
Good point. However, when I read his profile and he admits he has no rank, then it helps me filter his statements and not get too "jiggy" when he posts. It's pretty easy. The posts are kinda cute actually.
 

gmunoz

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Nimravus said:
Explanation, please?
Perhaps I'm misunderstanding what everyone is referring to on crossing legs. In Kenjutsu Juji no Kata, a standard downward cut from Dai Jo dan no Kamae, one may cross their legs while taking a forward step and cutting horizontally across the neck. ie. they can evade or block the downward cut and a horizontal cut is followed up in response.

Your opponent strikes downward at you. You evade his strike by taking a right step backward while cutting down on his wrist. If that, for whatever reason, didn't end the fight, then one can use that same right leg they stepped back with and cross their left leg cutting horizontally across the neck.
 

Grey Eyed Bandit

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gmunoz said:
Your opponent strikes downward at you. You evade his strike by taking a right step backward while cutting down on his wrist. If that, for whatever reason, didn't end the fight, then one can use that same right leg they stepped back with and cross their left leg cutting horizontally across the neck.
Sounds to me like kocho gaeshi?:confused:
 

gmunoz

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I forgot to ask An-Shu what the name was for crossing feet like that. I don't know exactly what Enson meant by crossing legs... Perhaps he can clarify his question/inquiry.
 

Moko

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Best thing to do would be for Enson to post the offending photo here that confused him.

Even better would be to seek out a proper qualified teacher who knows how to use cross-stepping. It is not just an Eastern Martial Arts technique either. When I bought my first Fechtenbuch, (Fighting book or manual. It was printed 1471ish) I was excited to see that we had those same technologies in the West.
I think the only difference is we learned better how to kill with firearms while the East retained lower levels of technology.

History aside, crosstepping is a valid technique and people shouldn't let the ignorance of their teachers hold them back.
 

Shogun

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Anyone who has military or police etc experience can tell you with a little practice, the about face becomes very second nature. crossing legs is a huge part of footwork in western fencing. western boxing also has a side step in which the legs are crossed. this is all relative proof that it has value. it just takes some practice.

Kyle
 
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Enson

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after doing some kenjutsu training i saw that there is some crossing legs... it just depens where your feet are in position with your enemy's. not so much a cross step but but almost a body shift while keeping your sword in front of your enemy.

i.e., downward strike (#12) and then "horizontal high" to the head (#2)... upon going to the #2 strike you step across with your lead leg while doing your strike.
now you can also side step with back leg while doing the #2 strike. like i said, just depends how you end up after the #12 strike.
did that make sense?

peace
 
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