conditioning

[hogstooth]

Ok I was wondering how everyone conditions or if thet condition.
I'd like to see it in this formate. If you don't condition just say no.
If you do list the body part / and the method

For example;

Knuckles / makiwara, knuckle ups, heavy bag
back hand / makiwara, heavy bag
Shin / post makiwara, heavy bag, tire, rolling a frozen bottle up and down it.
Forearm / partner drills, post makiwara
Elbo / post makiwara, heavy bag
Instep / post makiwara, heavy bag, tire
etc and so on.

I thought it would be very interesting to see how many condition and what body parts and how.

 

[terryl965]

Everything you do except we add the 2" by 4" to hit the shins with and also punch while it is laying on the floor. Sounds like a good way of doing your conditioning. Just like us.

 

[7starmarc]

Knuckle pushups, "robots" (kind of like a push up, but you go down to elbows, then back to palms/knuckles)

We probably don't do it often enough, but we have an 11 point partner drill for conditioning:
three forearm regions,
palm slaps,
another forearms region,
elbow,
shoulder,
hip,
kidney shot,
Achilles,
shin.

It's a pattern performed with a partner against their arm, leg, whatever in concert.

We also have iron palm training with a bean bag (progresses to sand).

I think there might be some others as well, but I have not learned them yet.

 

[hogstooth]

We also have iron palm training with a bean bag (progresses to sand).

Could you explain this. I have never taken a CMA before but have read about Iron hand conditioning and have always been curious. How does it progress? I have heard about the sand and beans and steel shot and heating it. But how do you do this and in what stages? Is this superior to Makiwara and other traditional okinawan conditioning in that it conditions faster or safer? Maybe I should make this a new thread.

 

[7starmarc]

We also have iron palm training with a bean bag (progresses to sand).

Could you explain this. I have never taken a CMA before but have read about Iron hand conditioning and have always been curious. How does it progress? I have heard about the sand and beans and steel shot and heating it. But how do you do this and in what stages? Is this superior to Makiwara and other traditional okinawan conditioning in that it conditions faster or safer? Maybe I should make this a new thread.

Unfortunately, I'm far from an expert on the Iron Palm training. We have been told to start with a bag with dried beans (I'm told type is not a huge concern, progressing to smaller beads (again, specifc type is not as important as the relative size tendency to compact), and eventually to sand. The initial process is supposed to go over about a 3 month period, and most use a jow preparation to assist in recovery. I'm sure others can give better details, as I have only been introduced to it, and have not done the formal process myself. To the best of my knowledge, there is no heating involved in our process.

I also cannot compare it to other methods contained in other arts, I simply don't know enough about them.

 

[tshadowchaser]

I have some students carry bricks or stones (large) around with just their finger tips.

The use of the Knuckles on the makiwara is for a few of my students

pulling bark from trees withthe fingers is done by a couple students,
sand training for the fingertips also

I have no one doing true iron palm training at this time but wish I could get one of the students to try it for more than a few days

 

[Deaf Smith]

Conditioning....

Ok, here is what I do. On days that are not Dojo days I work out at the gym. In the dancing room on different days I do different things.

Defesive/offensive day:

I first do blocks. Traditonal blocks (low, high, inside, outside) and boxing blocks. I start with them slow, just one block. I do that block perfect a few times, then I speed it up as fast as I can till my arm is burning alot. Then I slow it back down and do it perfect again. I must do several hundred of them.

I then add combinations of punches and blocks. Again slow then real fast then back to slow. Then add footwork to that. Do this till my arms are about to fall off.

I then do the same thing but start out with punches. Slow-n-perfect to very fast. Backfist, strait punches, upper cuts, tiger paws, overhead hammers, inside chops, etc.... And then I add the blocks to them. Later the footwork. Do this till my arms are about to fall off.

Footwork day:

This is my Gene Kelly day Slides, shuffles, reversals, spins, sidesteps and more. Then add punches and blocks. I spend the whole time doing this. I'll do slides all the away across the floor, do a reversal and slide again, then shuffle. Slow to fast. Shields up (that is raise the hands as if to fight.) Add more as I get into the grove.

Kicking day:

Just as it sounds. Two Centry standing bags. Every kick I know. Slow first, then fast as I can. Add combinations then skipping kicks and hopefully soon I'll be back to jump kicks (both knees healing now quite well.)

Yes that sounds like 3 days a week does it not? A few times it is but usually I do two out of the three each week. And then add regular workouts and weight lifting. I try to get there early so I can do things I feel I need practice on.

The lowest I workout is four days a week. Very often five days and I've actually gone seven once (but man I was a zombie...) Seven is just to much and four is good. Five seems to be the best when I can get away with it (I'm married guys.)

Deaf

 

[hogstooth]

I have no one doing true iron palm training at this time but wish I could get one of the students to try it for more than a few days

Why is it that hard on the hands? I can't believe that a student able to strip bark off a tree would have difficulty with Iron Palm but I don't know anything about it so that is why I am asking. I am really looking for something to do to take it to the next step short of hitting myself with a sledge. I have always trained to try to minimalize the damage to my body but still condition.
The parts of my body I condition are very well conditioned from years of using the makiwara and others but I have been doing the same thing almost every day for 30 years. I really am looking for something new to break the monotany.

 

[hogstooth]

Deafsmith, what are you using to condition when blocking? is it a bag or makiwara. I have two post type makiwara I built that I inserted in the concrete floor of my dojo. One is a 4x4 that is graduated up to a 1-1/2"x4", and the other is a round 6" post that I cut four cuts north to south and east to west which I inserted rubber wedges into. I use the round post to practice my blocks. I just hit it the same way you would in a partner drill with the inside and outside of the arm.

 

[Brandon Fisher]

Makiwara using the knuckles, fingertips, big toe on the post, and every other striking area. I also use a maki stick on the forearms and shins. As well as using chishi and nigiri game.

 

[hogstooth]

Makiwara using the knuckles, fingertips, big toe on the post, and every other striking area. I also use a maki stick on the forearms and shins. As well as using chishi and nigiri game.

I see you study Shorin-ryu also. Do you use partner drills to condition the forearms?

 

[tko4u]

No to everything except knuckle ups, and wavemasters for the shins.

 

[geezer]

Ok I was wondering how everyone conditions or if thet condition.
I'd like to see it in this formate. If you don't condition just say no.

I thought it would be very interesting to see how many condition and what body parts and how.

"Just say no to conditioning! Ha!

Well I like that attitude a lot. When I was a lot younger and was trying out some of the more brutal methods described by others on this thread, a friend asked me, "What's the point?" As he saw it, even if he got mugged once or twice in his life, so long as he lived through it, he would take less of a beating than what I was subjecting myself to, if you tallied it up over time! You know he had a point. Unless you are young and interested in full contact competition, there's no point in going overboard. Some "hard core" training can definately lead to physical problems down the road. In my twenties, that didn't worry me so much. Now that I'm in my mid fifties, my body reminds me of that daily.

OK, that said, I'm not advocating total laziness, I generally try to attend a group workout 3 to 4 times a week (focusing mostly on technique, maybe a little controlled contact sparring), plus some weight training and bag work at home, two to three days a week, and some cardio work, such as hill running or biking twice a week. But being a family guy, a lot of times I have to cut out a day or two. And my wife still ain't thrilled. Apparently, she thinks the core of all training should be housework.

 

[Brandon Fisher]

I see you study Shorin-ryu also. Do you use partner drills to condition the forearms?

Yes we do. Koteaite is essential I think.

 

[hogstooth]

"Just say no to conditioning! Ha!

Now that I'm in my mid fifties, my body reminds me of that daily.

That is exactly why I am looking for alternatives. However I do not have discolored overly large knuckles. Sensei always taught us the proper way and warned against this. But I still have slight tightening in my hands if I skip conditioning for say a couple of weeks especially in the winter. I usually condition at least once a week and usually more because I am demonstrating to my students or correcting bad form.

And my wife still ain't thrilled. Apparently, she thinks the core of all training should be housework.

Deja Vue, My wife is the same way. Lol.

 

[Deaf Smith]

Deafsmith, what are you using to condition when blocking? is it a bag or makiwara. I have two post type makiwara I built that I inserted in the concrete floor of my dojo. One is a 4x4 that is graduated up to a 1-1/2"x4", and the other is a round 6" post that I cut four cuts north to south and east to west which I inserted rubber wedges into. I use the round post to practice my blocks. I just hit it the same way you would in a partner drill with the inside and outside of the arm.

hogstooth,

If I'm working out alone I use a Century stand alone bag. About 100 or so lb of sand in the bottom (that's not much but it's enough to make firm contact.)

If I'm with my workout buddy, we both wear arm guards and we do exercises like face each other in a horse stance and to the blocks mirror image, and we practice attack and defense, again with the forarm guards to take the punishment.

We also found you really need those guards if you block elbows with your forarms!! Unlike the movies, a hard elbow can rock you if you block it with your arms.

Deaf