Chi Gerk

Domino

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Sifu was kind enough to demonstrate and explain ... but yet I want to know more.
I am not at the level to learn it yet, but am intrigued,
please post any links or share information you may have for techniques and secrets.
 

MattJ

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Some of my friends and I used to practice that occasionally, in an informal manner. An interesting exercise and a good workout, but I didn't see the need to dedicate a whole lot of time to it.
 

geezer

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Some of my friends and I used to practice that occasionally, in an informal manner. An interesting exercise and a good workout, but I didn't see the need to dedicate a whole lot of time to it.

Chi gerk? I think it's invaluable to reach the higher levels. My former sifu, a direct student of Yip Man, once remarked that, "You use the legs to beat the other WC guys. The hands alone are enough for everybody else." And even the hands are, of course, dependent upon a good stance and steps.

Anyway, I've still got enough on my plate polishing the stance and steps before I get too heavily into chi-gerk. So, I guess I'm pretty much in the same boat as Matt. Still, I wouldn't underestimate it's value.
 

wushuguy

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chi gerk is useful for sensitvity, like chi sao for hands, chi gerk for legs.

I like "stance trapping" (I don't remember the chinese name for it, sorry) and yeah, that's how you can get against other WC guys who are good with only hands. Stance trapping works wonders against other arts too.

skillful stances and leg positioning and control is invaluable.
 

mook jong man

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I think the leg sensitivity thing is just one of the benefits derived from its practice.
Aside from training all the hooking , jamming , deflecting techniques etc it is a really good stance exercise in its own right.

It trains the ability to sink down in the stance on one leg , which I might add would improve the muscular endurance of the quads if your doing it for long enough.

But just the sheer fact that you are on one leg trying to maintain your stance and equilibrium against someone who is trying to destabilize you , as well as taking shots at your legs makes it a very practical martial skill in my book.
 

Poor Uke

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I love Chi Gerk it teaches you soooo much about balance (yours and your opponents). We went through a phase of using both chi sua and gerk together, is great fun and IMO invaluable., but done seperatley is just as beneficial.

You need to have built up you leg strength (YGKYM) before being any where near profficient at it.

Some of the people at my old kwoon were just devestating. Your stance would be in pieces for no reason you could work out.

Great stuff!! I like what Geezer said, made total sense to me.
 
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Domino

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Thank you for your input, I enjoyed reading your own experiences of chi gerk and hope to get sifu to show me more in near future.
I know its an advanced technique, so not for me just yet, but I was very curious and agree the exercise improves various aspects.
 

l_uk3y

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We haven't ever covered this in our school!!

Is this a completely different "chi sau" type drill using only legs? Or is it a typical 2 arm chi sau also incorporating leg traps??? Sounds useful.
 

Vajramusti

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First you have to develop one legged stances- to develop the right balancing,
body stability, knee ligaments and flexibility....then you do sticky leg witha partner- holding on to his arms at arm length. Like dan chi sau- there is a timed sequence. Later you can then work on timed switching of legs. Then doing sticky with arms and legs.
Done right -it can add to your joint coordination, flexibility and timing.
Another way of sharpening wing chun tools.Not absolutely necessary-but it helps.
 
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Domino

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We haven't ever covered this in our school!!

Is this a completely different "chi sau" type drill using only legs? Or is it a typical 2 arm chi sau also incorporating leg traps??? Sounds useful.

Like Vajramusti has mentioned, it is useful for stability, strengthening the legs and sensibility of the legs. But as far as I know, its an advanced technique.
Not holding the arms, just shadowing so as to help keep your balance.

From sigungs website.
Chi Gerk

Chi Gerk is Chi Sau but with the legs (Sau is hand Gerk is leg in Cantonese). This is not for beginners. Advanced students can train it on its own by locking arms and trying to control the opponents leg and kick out their supporting leg while they do the same. However students can also simply add kicks and sweeps to Chi Sau. Doing this will add lots of levels of complication and can mean you loose the usefulness of Chi Sau. I would recommend using legs only with advanced students and using it when you end up trapping each other or are in a "stale mate". It can also be used to highlight a weak stance however just standing kicking each other in the legs can be a painful and not very useful process so shin pads and control are also recommended.
 

bully

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I recognised that passage Domino, then realised it was whilst I was on Samuel Kwoks site the other day.

I was going to start a thread to say how good the site is and the training tips. (I will)

I wouldnt mind coming to the seminar in May, but funds are low at the moment.

Watching Samuel Kwok do SLT is like watching the guy who taught me....he is from Kamon lineage and Kevin Chan was taught by a Steve Muir, who was a Kwok student iirc. Very very similar, which is why i would consider coming to seminar.

as for Chi Gerk, I can barely Chi Sau so will wait until I am better. Some clips on the tube of it though.
 

KamonGuy2

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I recognised that passage Domino, then realised it was whilst I was on Samuel Kwoks site the other day.

I was going to start a thread to say how good the site is and the training tips. (I will)

I wouldnt mind coming to the seminar in May, but funds are low at the moment.

Watching Samuel Kwok do SLT is like watching the guy who taught me....he is from Kamon lineage and Kevin Chan was taught by a Steve Muir, who was a Kwok student iirc. Very very similar, which is why i would consider coming to seminar.

as for Chi Gerk, I can barely Chi Sau so will wait until I am better. Some clips on the tube of it though.

Yeah Kevin Chan was part of the Sam Kwok federation (many moons ago!). A lot of the forms are similar in kamon (slight differences)

Kwok students are very skilled but they are a little too fixed for my liking (to set in stance and using traditional techniques). Its not a wrng way of doing it, just a way of training that I dont think is practical. There is actually a Kwok student training at Kamon at the moment and it is interesting seeing the differences in his chi sao

As for chi gerk, it is useful to develop the ability to capture legs and stick close to your opponent, but a lot of schools misunderstand the concept or train it in fixed drills which doesnt work
 
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Domino

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Ah I see Kamon, so is there a mobile form of Chi gerk?

I recognised that passage Domino, then realised it was whilst I was on Samuel Kwoks site the other day.

I was going to start a thread to say how good the site is and the training tips. (I will)

I wouldnt mind coming to the seminar in May, but funds are low at the moment.

Watching Samuel Kwok do SLT is like watching the guy who taught me....he is from Kamon lineage and Kevin Chan was taught by a Steve Muir, who was a Kwok student iirc. Very very similar, which is why i would consider coming to seminar.

as for Chi Gerk, I can barely Chi Sau so will wait until I am better. Some clips on the tube of it though.

I agree sigungs site is excellent and contains regular updates on various information.
You mean the london seminar?
Do not worry about your level, I was considering going to Portugal .... something sigung said about Portugal was
“if you absolutely genuinely want to train and learn, then you are welcome to come and join us. If want to prove yourself or your lineage, then you are not invited.”
 
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Domino

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Me too, I said I didn't want to go to the seminar because I felt I wasn't proficient enough compared to the students who were attending. I was wrong, which is sort of nice in a way. :)
 

Tensei85

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Trouble is that there are a few guys from the Kwok lineage who dont seem to stick by it!


It's a shame but you'll find that in any lineage.

As for Chi Gerk;

We seperated the training into segments the most basic taught around or after completion of Chum Kiu.

1. We started with both hands connected on inside/outside-right/left hands and vice versa. To garner a feeling for Chi Gerk, we would then raise the leg 3 times connected to partners backside of calf and then kick it out after the 3rd time, change stances alongside the drilling legs.

2. We would proceed as before but with one hand but legs still connected to start.

3. Started as before but with no hands still legs being connected to partners at start of drill.

4. We utilized it in the Chi Sau practice by alternating the legs alongside "toi ma".

5. We would use different levels of Chi Gerk & footwork during sparring after training Chi Gerk "drill" with partner for long periods alongside "toi ma" practice.

6. Was pretty much free for all, in more of a controlled environment. (Sparring heavy contact but with safety devices such as mats, sparring gear...) Were a few times we took off the gear to get a feel for more contact from hands & bridging but generally still controlled to a certain extent, no one died.

I would say Chi Gerk is a lot of fun! Definitely essential for Wing Chun practice, but approach it with correct instruction providing you with the proper mechanics needed.

Enjoy!
 
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Domino

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6. Was pretty much free for all, in more of a controlled environment. (Sparring heavy contact but with safety devices such as mats, sparring gear...) Were a few times we took off the gear to get a feel for more contact from hands & bridging but generally still controlled to a certain extent, no one died.

Thanks for the whole explanation!
haha excuse the pun, but you killed me laughing.
 

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