Womens Self Defense Courses

[MJS]

What are your thoughts on these courses that are offered? I feel that they are a good contribution to the arts, and may even spark further interest for the students to enroll in a regular MA class.

However, when we take into consideration some of the things that are taught, the way things are taught, as well as possibly giving the impression that everything taught will always work, we may question whether or not they are nothing more than a way to make a few bucks.

So..thoughts?

Mike

 

[Andrew Green]

99% of the time any physical technique taught is a complete waste of time.

These courses should focus on bringing out aggression and avoidance, not techniques which will not be trained enough to be useful against a larger, stronger, fighting back person and will be forgotten with a week anyways.

The only thing that really should be the goal of the physical side is teaching people that they can and should fight back, and should do so hard, fast and without regret. Beyond that lead them into a longer term program if they want more.

 

[Danny T]

What are your thoughts on these courses that are offered? I feel that they are a good contribution to the arts, and may even spark further interest for the students to enroll in a regular MA class.

However, when we take into consideration some of the things that are taught, the way things are taught, as well as possibly giving the impression that everything taught will always work, we may question whether or not they are nothing more than a way to make a few bucks.

So..thoughts?

Mike,
They do contribute by sparking interest in some however, most courses are very lacking as far as self defense goes. Most of these "Self Defense Courses" are Fight Back courses not self defense. Feeling secure or having a sense of security is simply a feeling, a mind game. Having a sense of being able to defend one's individual self is what the game is about. It isn't about being able to to actually do it and that is what most of these programs do. They enpower the participant to feel good. I'm not knocking them only stating a fact. I simply want to call them what they are. Self defense isn't about fighting, although fighting can be one of many forms of self defense and it should be the absolute last form used. Why is fighting always the first chosen to be taught? Because it makes the participant feel good about themselves quickly. Most people don't want to know real self defense they want to feel secure about themselves and their love ones. That is why most communities don't properly fund their police departments and complain bitterly when somethng happens and the police aren't there. Police do a great job for the most part, AFTER the Crime is committed. Criminals for the most part don't commit the crime if they feel they will get caught. An attacker, for the most part won't attack if they feel they they can't win. The deterent isn't the fact we are secure it is the feeling the bad person has they can't get away with it. The security isn't because we are secure, it is the feeling of being secure. If anyone were to get up to shopping or school or work in the morning with the sense or feeling I am going to be attacked and possiblility die when I get there how many would go? It is that sense of security which allow most of us to go about our lives in the manner we do. Self defense courses allow the participants to feel secure in their abilities to fight back.

If the course doesn't address awearness, conflict resolution, and legalities then it isn't a self defense course. It is an, if you are in trouble - Fight course. Fighting at the wrong time or even at the right time but for too long can cause you even more problems and the great line of "I'd rather be judged by 12 than be carried by 6", attitude can get you just that if you don't know, understand and apply the legalities. You will find your self defense "Fight back" couse doesn't help your court self defense.

Why do these courses quickly come in demand where there is a sudden shift in people's lives? For example, over a three or four week period when there is a serial killer or a child abductor on the loose. We suddenly become insecure and want a way to return to that feeling of security. People will pay hard earned money and will work hard for the feeling. Once the serial killer is caught the sense of security returns and the desire and demand for self defense quicky deminishes. For most it is the Feeling of being Secure they want and need. Therefore many within the martial arts create programs that meet that need.


Danny

 

[arnisador]

99% of the time any physical technique taught is a complete waste of time.

These courses should focus on bringing out aggression and avoidance, not techniques which will not be trained enough to be useful against a larger, stronger, fighting back person and will be forgotten with a week anyways.

As a rule, this has been my experience too.

The only thing that really should be the goal of the physical side is teaching people that they can and should fight back, and should do so hard, fast and without regret.

I wouldn't go quite this far, but physical training should be a small part of it. One can teach some eye gouges, some shove-and-run, etc., that may be retainable and potentially usable without further practice. One can also practice looking for available weapons and keeping objects between oneself and the assailant and things like that. Definitely, encourage them to consider additional training if that's what they are looking for.

 

[jdinca]

I'd say the most valuable point is just what has already been discussed, letting women know that they CAN fight back and get away from the situation. The change in mindset is what really matters. The couple of courses I've been involved in as a dummy (see the sig line) focused on awareness and avoidance. The physical part was minimal, groin kicks, eye gouges, ear slaps etc., some of which was done on a real person. Just watching them go from timid slaps to full power showed that the change in mindset was occurring. I really got tired of being slapped across the ear hole...

 

[arnisador]

If the course doesn't address awearness, conflict resolution, and legalities then it isn't a self defense course.

Many good points in this pots, but this one especially. Awareness is one of the biggest points, but the others mentioned are crucial too.

 

[shesulsa]

I always said that education and awareness come first and are the most powerful self-defense tools anyone could have.

Here's my teacher's four rules to self defense:
Awareness
Evasive maneuvers
Quick Releases
Techniques

 

[DeLamar.J]

What are your thoughts on these courses that are offered? I feel that they are a good contribution to the arts, and may even spark further interest for the students to enroll in a regular MA class.

However, when we take into consideration some of the things that are taught, the way things are taught, as well as possibly giving the impression that everything taught will always work, we may question whether or not they are nothing more than a way to make a few bucks.

So..thoughts?

Mike

I think these quick self defence classes can help with the right teacher. Some techniques can be learned as long as they are not advanced. The main thing that needs to be taught in these classes is the right attitude for fighting. You must beat it into there head that they are the hunter, not the hunted. You must help them psycologicly develop the mind of a never say die fighter.
The phisical side of the training needs to be very basic and easy to remember. Such as, when the oppertunity presents itself, bite. This is one of the most effective/natural weapons in the animal kingdom, including human animals. Next, poke the eyes and scratch.
Next, be aware of your surroundings. Alot of times an observant person can avoid a situation before it starts, and being observant also includes noticing that nice brick laying over there if a situation does arise.

 

[Cthulhu]

I agree with what others have said...those courses often advertise that they'll teach how to fight. What they should be teaching is awareness of surroundings, recognition of potential hazards, etc. Any physical technique taught should be for the sole purpose of getting the hell out of there and getting help.

Gotta find that Jim Carrey self-defense clip.

Cthulhu

 

[MJS]

Mike,
They do contribute by sparking interest in some however, most courses are very lacking as far as self defense goes. Most of these "Self Defense Courses" are Fight Back courses not self defense. Feeling secure or having a sense of security is simply a feeling, a mind game. Having a sense of being able to defend one's individual self is what the game is about. It isn't about being able to to actually do it and that is what most of these programs do. They enpower the participant to feel good. I'm not knocking them only stating a fact. I simply want to call them what they are. Self defense isn't about fighting, although fighting can be one of many forms of self defense and it should be the absolute last form used. Why is fighting always the first chosen to be taught? Because it makes the participant feel good about themselves quickly. Most people don't want to know real self defense they want to feel secure about themselves and their love ones. That is why most communities don't properly fund their police departments and complain bitterly when somethng happens and the police aren't there. Police do a great job for the most part, AFTER the Crime is committed. Criminals for the most part don't commit the crime if they feel they will get caught. An attacker, for the most part won't attack if they feel they they can't win. The deterent isn't the fact we are secure it is the feeling the bad person has they can't get away with it. The security isn't because we are secure, it is the feeling of being secure. If anyone were to get up to shopping or school or work in the morning with the sense or feeling I am going to be attacked and possiblility die when I get there how many would go? It is that sense of security which allow most of us to go about our lives in the manner we do. Self defense courses allow the participants to feel secure in their abilities to fight back.

If the course doesn't address awearness, conflict resolution, and legalities then it isn't a self defense course. It is an, if you are in trouble - Fight course. Fighting at the wrong time or even at the right time but for too long can cause you even more problems and the great line of "I'd rather be judged by 12 than be carried by 6", attitude can get you just that if you don't know, understand and apply the legalities. You will find your self defense "Fight back" couse doesn't help your court self defense.

Why do these courses quickly come in demand where there is a sudden shift in people's lives? For example, over a three or four week period when there is a serial killer or a child abductor on the loose. We suddenly become insecure and want a way to return to that feeling of security. People will pay hard earned money and will work hard for the feeling. Once the serial killer is caught the sense of security returns and the desire and demand for self defense quicky deminishes. For most it is the Feeling of being Secure they want and need. Therefore many within the martial arts create programs that meet that need.


Danny

Danny,

You as well as the others bring up some very good points! Going on the courses that I have seen, I've seen very little of the mindset aspect, very little on the aggression aspect, but alot of focus on techniques such as wrost locks, finger locks, etc., all of which are being done on a fully compliant 'attacker'. This IMO, is what is going to give the participant a false sense of security. I feel that while locks have their place, that under a stressfull situation, ie: a mugging, an attempted rape, that these are not the best tools. I feel that the priority of things being taught is out of order.

Mike

 

[KenpoTess]

I'm sure some SD courses are fine.. but at the University where I teach.. the woman who instructs the WSD is anti men.. she refuses to allow any male into the classroom. The women never know what it's like to have a man put her into a choke or any other submission.. Not sure what her deal is.. but I feel if you're going to teach women how to defend against an assailant.. it better be using men as partners just to have a bit of realism in the attack.

 

[Andrew Green]

Gotta find that Jim Carrey self-defense clip.

Cthulhu

http://innovativema.ca/uploads/Jim Carey - Karate Instructor (In Living Color).mpg

Tadaa!

 

[DeLamar.J]

I'm sure some SD courses are fine.. but at the University where I teach.. the woman who instructs the WSD is anti men.. she refuses to allow any male into the classroom. The women never know what it's like to have a man put her into a choke or any other submission.. Not sure what her deal is.. but I feel if you're going to teach women how to defend against an assailant.. it better be using men as partners just to have a bit of realism in the attack.

I hate instructors like the one you mentioned. A woman must fight men. If I had my way with it, they would fight only men. Some instructors treat women like they are babies that cannot handle fighting men. That type of attitude hurts them more than the attacker in the street, because they are being given the horrible lie of false confidence.
Being harder on a woman is difficult at times for me because I respect the ladies, and they dont understand why Im being hard on them at first. They think I am treating them mean, but not being hard on them hurts them so much more. Some will quit, as do the guys, and the ones that stick it out will thank you for what you gave them. As a martial arts teacher you have an obligation to give people quality training without sexism involved. Mother nature is not sexist, and will not treat a woman any differently than a man.

 

[Lisa]

I worry about the parent's who send their daughters to these kinds of classes and come out with a false sense of security. I have often told my children that the best defense is not to get yourself into situation like that to begin with and if you find yourself in one, fight like hell to get out. Both my daughters train fighting with men/boys. Men are naturally stronger and women have to use their skill to get out of situations. Will their training ultimately save their lives, I don't know, because the man will always be stronger. Could it give them the opportunity to find a way out, buy them some time? I certainly hope so.

 

[MJS]

IMO, this instructor is doing a dis-service to her students by limiting her class to women only. While it is not uncommon for a females to fight, I'd think that there is a much greater chance of getting attacked by a male.

Training with men, women, people that are short, tall, strong, weak, etc., will certainly help your training.

Mike

 

[arnisador]

I have mixed feelings. An all-female class may bring in otehrwise "shy" students, as the all-female gym Curves brings in people, which is good; but it then short-changes them.

 

[Adept]

99% of the time any physical technique taught is a complete waste of time.

These courses should focus on bringing out aggression and avoidance, not techniques which will not be trained enough to be useful against a larger, stronger, fighting back person and will be forgotten with a week anyways.

The only thing that really should be the goal of the physical side is teaching people that they can and should fight back, and should do so hard, fast and without regret. Beyond that lead them into a longer term program if they want more.

I agree 100%.

 

[tshadowchaser]

along with what has been mentioned before the class may allow the women to realize that they may not always get away and that they need to contact the police . I know of a young lady that was in a battered relationship. She was so afraid of the guy that she really didn't dare go to the police knowing that they could not watch and guard her 24-7. It took almost six months of her running from the guy and being battered before she finally called the police and then it was because he threatened suicide not because he hit her. She live with a friend of hers now but every once in a while I can tell he has called or tried to see her again (she gets a certain look and i extremely nervous all day)
A general self defense course may have only got her bat worse once this guy caught up to her if she was able to hurt him and get away from this first attack

 

[bluemtn]

I'm sure some SD courses are fine.. but at the University where I teach.. the woman who instructs the WSD is anti men.. she refuses to allow any male into the classroom. The women never know what it's like to have a man put her into a choke or any other submission.. Not sure what her deal is.. but I feel if you're going to teach women how to defend against an assailant.. it better be using men as partners just to have a bit of realism in the attack.

I've heard about her. When I went there a number of years ago, the lady teaching it then wasn't anti-man, and actually had a co-ed class as well as womens. This was before I started MA training, and gave me more of an idea of other avenues. No, the class wasn't perfect, but it did help with knowing where to strike, increase awareness of surroundings and possible attacks. I think WSD classes are great, but only if taught by the right kind of person. I don't remember her name- I thought she really did a good job, even now as I look back.

 

[KenpoTess]

I've heard about her. When I went there a number of years ago, the lady teaching it then wasn't anti-man, and actually had a co-ed class as well as womens. This was before I started MA training, and gave me more of an idea of other avenues. No, the class wasn't perfect, but it did help with knowing where to strike, increase awareness of surroundings and possible attacks. I think WSD classes are great, but only if taught by the right kind of person. I don't remember her name- I thought she really did a good job, even now as I look back.

I'm glad you didn't get her as a teacher ~! The previous one actually joined our classes til she graduated If you're around Tues or Thursdays next semester- 6:30 starts our class. If you want to stop in the Butcher Center, I would love to meet you~!