Who is responible ...?

[loki09789]

I'm still amaazed at how well the flip flop thing caught. Also how much BS it is.
Kerry may not be the best but Bush is worse.

I am not alone in my "lesser of two evils" view on this years vote!

Hi, my names Paul and this is my first session with the "Disillusioned voters Survivors group".

"Hi, Paul!"

But, honestly, regardless of who was POTUS in the past 4 years, wouldn't there be all kinds of heat bout what he did/didnt' do when there is just as much 'beyond his control' issues that are being blamed on Bush?

It was the same with Carter and the Iranian hostage issue, the gas prices and such.... the price of being the leader.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Hey, Flatlander ... did you know the Kerry's own FIVE MANSIONS???

I wonder if any of those belong to the Heinz estate and if Kerry and his wife have a prenup? Ah, well, it's none of my business anyway, right?

Actually , there is a Prenuputial agreement. History Channel special, I saw after, the Democratic primaries.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Do you own an American made car? Chances are that you don't and if you do, most of the parts are from Japan.

Check the VIN ** Vehicle Identiification number ** of the vehicle. If the vehicle can get a license plate then it has one.

If it does not have a "1" as the first character then it was assembled outside the US.

Also check the new "stickers" on vehicles as they list the contentof the parts made in the USA.

Some of the Japanese manufacturers have assembly plants here in the USA and they have as much if not more content from the US in thse vehicles.

Some might say this is good publicity. It is good business, to move jobs and business around, with the fluctuation of markets, you can adjust volumes of vehicles built, depending upon the value of the local currency of assembly of manufacturer.

 

[michaeledward]

Rich, doesn't a 1 in the first position of the VIN indicate the vehicle was assembled inside the United States?

Of course, the Maroni sticker must indicate the proportion of components manufactured in the United States, and not in the United States. So, even vehicles with a '1' VIN could have a significant quantaty of components from overseas.

Mike

 

[Rich Parsons]

I left out abortion & same sex marriage on purpose

Yes, a local Republican group was caught calling people in a strong Democratic areas, making stements such as: "Vote for Kerry, becase he supports Gay Marriages"

This type of tactics, is poor at best, and only inflames the non issues.
Congress shall make no law about religion. Well, if the only arguement about this is relgion then Congress cannot make a law about it. Besides the other admendments that grant equal rights vote sufferage and such are sufficient in my mind to grant everyone in this country equal rights.

John Jay ( this nation's FIRST Supreme Court Justice ) " We should appoint only Christians as Judges "

Yes, this guy absolutely was afraid of Atheists. If you were a confirmed Atheists you could not be appointed as a Judge, even in the Western territories when judges faced being shoot, as they traveled from area to area.

Go back to the second admentment of the US Constitution.

Kerry is a Catholic which is against Abortion & Same sex marriage

I know a lot of Catholics in the USA who are against the Rome Pope and the College of Cardinals decisions to be against Abortion. I know of those who have had them, and or paid for their teenage children to have them. It will exists either legally or illegally. Legally you can have safe conditions that are sanitary.

As to same sex Marriage. I agree that Marriage was originally a religous term. Well most States have laws or clauses in their Constitution about Marriages. See second admendment. This word Marriage no longer is religous meaning only. It has civil meaning as well. I agree that a religous entity does not have to allow a marriage in their church or recognize it. I respect that. The government(s) of this country need to recognize civil unions, or marriages for medical care, as well as for rights of survivors. You can accomplish much of the same with about $8,000 to $12,000 USD, yet you can get the same for $30, in most cities. This is discrimination.

Once again if your only arguement is religous, then go read the US Constitution, and not just the public rhetoric. You yourself told some else to do the research. I ask the same of you.

So if it doesn't fit our lifestyle or opinion , " We can just delete it "

Some people can have private opinions or public opinions yet are being elected to represent a larger whole, and therefore realize that the larger whole he is representing those who elected him.

Nevermind the moral consequences of the Immediate Future .
j lee

Yes Moral Consequences. Of a convicted Drunk Driver. Who someone who abused drugs. Of someone who used his money and influence to get out of all trouble.

*** Personal Statment and Opinion ***
I liked Ex President G. H. W. Bush.

I do not like President G. W. Bush. And I did not vote for in this election.

I do not like Senator Kerry, and I did not vote for him.

So, my replies are not based upon by political views and or way I am going to vote or trying to get others to vote.

:asian:

 

[Rich Parsons]

Rich, doesn't a 1 in the first position of the VIN indicate the vehicle was assembled inside the United States?

Mike,

That is correct.

I thought I used the negative upfront, and then the "outside", hence a double negative.

I could have said for simplicity I see now, that if the Vehicle has a "1" then it was assembled inside the USA.

As opposed to :

If it does not have a "1" as the first character then it was assembled outside the US.

Of course, the Maroni sticker must indicate the proportion of components manufactured in the United States, and not in the United States. So, even vehicles with a '1' VIN could have a significant quantaty of components from overseas.

Mike

Yes, if it is assembled here in the USA still can have lots of content outside of the USA. Now there is a catch to this. Let is say car company hires another company to make a sub assembly. The Sub-assembly, may be assembled in the USA and all of its components are from outside the USA. So the location of the Sub Assembly is from within the USA. I think this is used to shift the data. I could be wrong.

 

[Feisty Mouse]

Though I agree with the spirit of your post and attitude toward this thread, to say that it is automatically bigotry if a POTUS appoints 'christian' judges is not totally on. Since the majority of 'faith people' in the USA are "Christian" even now, it is a likelyhood that judges will be Christian.

Now, if the FIRST and ONLY reason people are being appointed is because of Christian practice and issues of balancing the Supreme court so that they are not all 'yes men' or purposely excluding a judge who is Buddhist/Muslim or what ever based on that factor is going to be a very Bigotous practice.

It might be bias to assume that just because a judge is Christian, that is the prime motivator in their selection.

Paul -

This is true, and you phrased it far better than I did. It's not automatically bigotry if Christians *happen* to be appointed, but it is if there is selection based on that criteria.

 

[loki09789]

Paul -

This is true, and you phrased it far better than I did. It's not automatically bigotry if Christians *happen* to be appointed, but it is if there is selection based on that criteria.

Again, I tend to side with your stance/reaction to this whole thread though. I am openly a Bush supporter and have taken offense at the implication that I am duped, stupid, uninformed, a 'white male power machine advocate' or what ever the anti Bush extreme comments have thrown my way. I have tried to maintain that my choice is just as reasoned, sound and valid to me as anyone elses is (and more so than some it seems...even when "ahem" they are voting the same direction as I am) regardless of candidate.

 

[shesulsa]

Paul, please allow me as a registered Democrat to applaud you for approaching your decision with forethought, consideration, education and eloquence rather than what the obvious (I don't count you as "obvious?) Bush supporters resort to. It saddens me whenever parties feel they must stoop to name-calling to defend their candidates and challenge the opposition. You are one who does not do this.

I respect you much for your conduct along these lines as I think you set a fine example for your brethren in support of George W. Bush. Kudos.

:asian: SS

 

[Flatlander]

:asian: Well said, and agreed.

 

[Phoenix44]

Wow, great thread. An illuminating addition to the debate.

 

[Tgace]

I hope this is a sign of "healing" to come. I, as my friend Paul M., am a Bush supporter. However if Kerry wins, I wont be "beside myself". Thats the way our system works. Well played and fairly won.

I have no problem shaking hands with an opponent after he has beaten me, why should my principals be any different here?

I only hope its a decisive win for either side. I dont want a re-run of last elections 3 ring debacle.

 

[loki09789]

I hope this is a sign of "healing" to come. I, as my friend Paul M., am a Bush supporter. However if Kerry wins, I wont be "beside myself". Thats the way our system works. Well played and fairly won.

I have no problem shaking hands with an opponent after he has beaten me, why should my principals be any different here?

I only hope its a decisive win for either side. I dont want a re-run of last elections 3 ring debacle.

In words I know you love (Tom LOVES hip hop/rap talk btw) "tru dat" about the "good win" in this case. Isn't that the signature difference between a 'hard fought battle' and a 'fight?' at the end, when the battle is over (metaphorically in this case) and the outcome is clear, both sides try to behave with dignity and for the over all greater good. Though it wasn't universally shared in the Civil War, Lincoln is suppose to have declined from 'making the south pay' but was motivated by the desire for healing and reunification...still hasn't happened in some minds, but it is a nice sentiment.

 

[J. Lee]

Will this be Senator Kerry's Finest Hour
The country voted & I feel it was based on
Rhetoric vs. Record.
See him speak live at 1pm e.s.t.

Will this be his finest hour of the whole campaign ?

j lee

 

[someguy]

Oh Shall I go say something about Bush and his record of lies.
Nah I won't metion terrorism alquida and iraq.
His seeing and saying the exact opposite of what the CIA and all them folks told him. Then claiming it was from the intelegence comunity.
Nah I'm to nice to mention that...wait..nah

 

[J. Lee]

Oh Shall I go ...record of lies.
Nah I won't metion terrorism alquida and iraq...
...wait..nah

Just go back to the TWO embassy bombings in Africa .
Pres. Clinton BOMBED Iraq with " cruise missiles
WHY ???

I appreciate everyone's participation & input .

j lee

 

[Feisty Mouse]

Just go back to the TWO embassy bombings in Africa .
Pres. Clinton BOMBED Iraq with " cruise missiles
WHY ???

I appreciate everyone's participation & input .

j lee

Were you going to answer your own question? So if Clinton bombed someone, it's got to be OK to wage a war under false pretenses?

 

[someguy]

Umm What I'm saying but not doing a good job saying is Al quida(what is the right spelling for this) and Iraq have no common link.
Yeah I never can done do at thar spellin than right like. Today don't be one of them exeptions. I'm just a Ge..Georg...gerogia boys I guess.

 

[J. Lee]

An underground hangar for terrorist training was found 20 miles South of Baghdad.
Pres. Clinton ordered cruise missiles cause his intelligence told him
of possible terrorist camps .

j lee

Again thanks for input & people willing to protect our borders Abroad,
trying and eliminating attacks on our soil .

 

[Flatlander]

An underground hangar for terrorist training was found 20 miles South of Baghdad.
Pres. Clinton ordered cruise missiles cause his intelligence told him
of possible terrorist camps .

j lee

Again thanks for input & people willing to protect our borders Abroad,
trying and eliminating attacks on our soil .

J. Lee, I'm going to request that you endeavour to pose a more specific question, if there is something that you would care to discuss. When making claims such as you have here, it is generally considered to be more credible if you can provide some type of source or reference for your proposition, that we may be better able to verify the validity, and construct a counter. This is the way of structured debate.