TLC Top 10 Martial Arts

[LeeKrol]

Alright, for those of you who didn't catch it, TLC had an hour long show called "Top 10 Ultimate Martial Arts". Here is the arts they listed as the Top 10, in order :

1) Shaolin Kung Fu
2) Karate
3) Muay Thai Kickboxing
4) Ninjutsu
5) Juko-Kai (Combat Ki)
6) Aikido
7) Tae Kwon Do
8) Krav Maga
9) Kali
10) Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

Hrmmmmm........Muay Thai looks to me like the only one that is even CLOSE to being in the right spot. I am not sure what the criteria is for this list, but if the criteria is combat applications, this list is dead wrong, and we can thank the UFC and Pride for proving this.

Think I'm wrong? Royce Gracie vs. Minoki Ichihara. The Karateka was quickly dismantled by the BJJ master. Number 2 vs Number 10 according to the TLC list, and Number 2 was destroyed. Does the name Fred Ettish ring a bell? Johnny Rhodes sure rung his bell in the UFC. I could pull out a flurry of other matches to list, but I think I proved my point. Anyone that thinks a top Karate or Tae Kwon Do practitioner would beat any quality Muay Thai or BJJ practitioner is living in a fantasy world.

I am wondering what the criteria are? Influence of the arts? If that is the case, where is JKD? Where is Pankration? Can anyone really make a real case for Juko-Kai being more influential than JKD, wrestling, Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu? Please do, I would love to hear it.

Is the criteria popularity? Again, where is JKD? Is Juko-Kai more popular than Tae Kwon Do? BJJ is gaining mass popularity all over the world. What about American Boxing?

Is the criteria toughness? Kali would be much higher than ninth I can promise you that. Muay Thai and BJJ would be right up there too. These are some of the toughest fighters on the planet, physically a lot tougher than an Aikido practitioner. To nip the ensuing ripping from the Aiki-marks right in the bud, name me an Aikido practitioner who would beat Vanderlei Silva, Mirko Cro-Cop, or Ernesto Hoost on the street before you call me ignorant. When you name some guy no one has ever heard of, answer me this: Why aren't they rolling in Pride or UFC then?

Is the criteria "the gift of the art to the world"? Where is wrestling or JKD? What about boxing?

Is the criteria beauty of the art? Where is Capoeira? Where is Wushu? Where is Tai Chi?

What I am ranting about is really very simple : What criteria does this list follow? I would love to hear what people have to say about this list, defend your arts if you want, and make a Top Ten of your own if so inclined.

I don't like Top Ten lists personally. How you can take all the different arts, with all of their different theories and contributions to the martial arts world, throw them all together and say which is the best is ridiculous. I'd love to hear what everyone has to say about this.

Thanks.

Lee M. Krol

 

[Kirk]

Check out this thread
where this discussion has already taken place.

 

[ace]

This List is like a bad Joke!!!

:miffer: :barf:
:barf:
:barf:
:barf:

TLC has no Clue &^%^&*&&&&^^%#%#$^$^$%^%^%&^&^&%^%%&^&^%&*&$$@$@#@#!@#@$#%$%#$TYTHGFHJJHG$#@$#%$^%^%^%$#$$#$#$$$$$%#%%^^^$%^%&^&^%&^&^&*^%&*%%^$%&^*&*&*(^&(&&^&^&%^&^%&^&^&^&^&^%^&

If u trans late that
it makes about as much as that list.l

 

[LeeKrol]

Thanks Kirk, I didnt realize there was a thread already up.

Maybe this one can spark some more interest, or a new set of viewpoints

 

[JDenz]

Have any you guys seen Rockey 2? You know the scene where Mic is eating the soup and see's Apollo talking junk about Rockey? That is the scene that happened in my living room. Insted of soup Dr. Pepper and Stirfry were on the floor. A great waste of Dr. Pepper. But seriously that list is way out of wack.

 

[ace]

That show was Bul **it

Were was the Shoot Fighting
BJJ #10

When & Who conduted this List??????????????????????/

 

[muayThaiPerson]

Thanks Kirk, I didnt realize there was a thread already up.

but u posted on that thread, how could u not kno. u even stated that u made one and gave the link to it.
well...watever

 

[JDenz]

no he didn't kirk did

 

[ace]

After Kirk showed that there was another discustion

Any way U look at it it was awful

TLC has either been mis lead
or someone is geting paid $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

[Angus]

Lee Krol,

I disagree with the list, but most of your arguments are BS. To say that top Karate or TKD couldn't beat quality BJJ or MT guys is crap. It's not the art, it's the fighter. Most Karate and TKD guys don't train to fight in Pride and UFC style fighting. If they did, who knows? There have been plenty of really successful fighters that have come from Karate that have won those types of tournaments. Look at guys like Hug and Filho from K-1 (among others). Both were Karatekas. It's simply that both MT and BJJ focus ALL their training on competition (generally), while most other arts do not. Not all have to, you know.

Not only that, not everyone has to have the desire to fight in UFC and Pride matches to prove the worth of their art. Aikido is NOT a martial sport nor a martial art that lends itself to competition. UFC and Pride ISN'T the street, don't get them confused with it. Just because they don't have the desire to go fight them doesn't mean it's because their art isn't worthy.

I'm sorry to sound so harsh, but grow up. MMA, MT, and BJJ aren't the be all and end all of martial arts. Pride and UFC aren't the ultimate test of a martial art, not NEARLY. I hate to see this kind of attitude.

 

[MartialArtist]

Originally posted by Angus

Lee Krol,

I disagree with the list, but most of your arguments are BS. To say that top Karate or TKD couldn't beat quality BJJ or MT guys is crap. It's not the art, it's the fighter. Most Karate and TKD guys don't train to fight in Pride and UFC style fighting. If they did, who knows? There have been plenty of really successful fighters that have come from Karate that have won those types of tournaments. Look at guys like Hug and Filho from K-1 (among others). Both were Karatekas. It's simply that both MT and BJJ focus ALL their training on competition (generally), while most other arts do not. Not all have to, you know.

Not only that, not everyone has to have the desire to fight in UFC and Pride matches to prove the worth of their art. Aikido is NOT a martial sport nor a martial art that lends itself to competition. UFC and Pride ISN'T the street, don't get them confused with it. Just because they don't have the desire to go fight them doesn't mean it's because their art isn't worthy.

I'm sorry to sound so harsh, but grow up. MMA, MT, and BJJ aren't the be all and end all of martial arts. Pride and UFC aren't the ultimate test of a martial art, not NEARLY. I hate to see this kind of attitude.

I agree

And people, you also have to take into account the environment and the situation. The fighting style evolved specifically for the UFC. If you look in the early episodes, it was a mess. Now, people's styles are more defined. The reason it that it is the BEST for THAT environment. Being with judges, time, rules, a soft mattress they call a ring, etc.

For instance, take the limitations that strikers have. So obviously, a grappler would have some sort of advantage and that is why it's become such a grappling/takedown/wrestling match-type thing.

 

[RyuShiKan]

Angus,

I agree. Pride, UFC etc. are NOT street fights. I for one would not want to be rolling on the ground in a street fight while his buddies jump on top of me.

If someone thinks a certain art can beat another art they have an immature outlook on fighting...............it's the person not the art.

Case in point:
As for BJJ beating Karate........refer to the above.
I have worked out with several guys that do BJJ and "claim" to have trained with the Gracies............I beat them........in fact I never lost to them.
What does it mean? Nothing. Is Karate better than BJJ nope............ was I better than the BJJ guys I went against........at that time yes. Who knows how it would turn out today.

Another case in point..........Bob Sapp.

The guy has poor technique in any art.........he wins because he is just big and mean and bulldozes his opponents.

 

[ace]

I f U could not hak it
U got gone.

The styels that remained were
ones that could hack it.

Fighters found out what worked & what didn't
And other than UFC 1 & 9

The shows wear not a mess.

The palotitions made a mess of UFC 9

Lee Krol made some realy good points.
Some people have a hard time faceing
The Facts.

 

[RyuShiKan]

The UFC didn't prove anything except it is sometimes fun to watch...........other than that.........

 

[Marginal]

What are the
facts?

Only
real
fact U
should know is
t
h
a
t

When one says there is no top ten, then there is probably not a top two either. The call is largely subjective, and situational to boot. You really can't get by with one MA in a mixed venue anymore. That's about all Pride etc have proven at this point. The BJJ types have had to learn striking, the others needed to learn groundfighting and so on. (Of course, that's not something it took Pride or the UFC to prove either)

 

[ace]

Point Blank!
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[RyuShiKan]

I think the "Bob Sapp" style of MA is #1.......better living through chemistry.

Inject enough roids and you can beat anyone.........

 

[Kenpo Wolf]

Originally posted by RyuShiKan

The UFC didn't prove anything except it is sometimes fun to watch...........other than that.........

I very much agree with this comment. All the UFC amounted to was an event that favored grapplers. This is why they had padded mats, a chain linked fence, and not much area to move around in. What they should have had was a solid floor, a thick plexiglass wall so no one would be able to use it and a larger ring. I like watching the UFC but I'm not obsessed with it. I see it as entertainment rather then a true application of martial arts

 

[Damian Mavis]

Primo... what can I tell ya man.... you're spouting the same ol crap that every martial artist says at one point in their career. All martial artists have egos and want to believe that what they are doing in particular and how they train is somewhat superior to everyone else. I too believed this, but I matured in the martial arts and am a little wiser now. I've met fools and killers in all walks of life when it comes to martial arts and I've learned that although some styles better prepare a person for certain situations it all comes down to if a person is dedicated/talented enough to use whatever they have to win. I know a couple of TKD guys that are tougher than anyone I've ever met, I've also met a couple of MMA guys that could be beaten by my Grandma (both these cases are the extreme and rare but completely true)... it all has to do with the individual. Beleiving a style or form of training is the easy answer to everything is silly and delusional. It's all about dedication, ability and heart. You can find that rare combo in a few people in all martial arts.

You got to humble yourself and realise that there's more to combat then what you might know. I realise this every single day. Honestly the only reason I'm telling you all this is because your a little younger than me and I'm thinking in 15 to 20 years your going to be a seasoned martial artist that is much wiser and more knowledgeable in ALL forms of martial arts.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

 

[ace]

True application of Submissons
Where defenitly shown.

Survival was defintly showen.

Back to TLC i still would like to know who
Did a serva or how they came up with this list.

Now im no Medic or Doctor
So if Bob Sapp is Using steroids i don't know.
But i won't acuse any one of drug use
with out proof.
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