TKD Spread & Development (Flame on)

[Earl Weiss]

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Subject: Lest we forget! 92 Years ago today!

​

General Choi Hong Hi was born on November 9th, 1918 in the rugged and harsh area of Hwa Dae, Myong Chun District in what is now D.P.R of Korea. In his youth, he was frail and quite sickly, a constant source of worry for his parents.

Even at an early age, however, the future general showed a strong and independent spirit. At the age of twelve he was expelled from school for agitating against the Japanese authorities who were in control of Korea.
This was the beginning of what would be a long association with the Kwang Ju Students’ Independence Movement.

After his expulsion, young Choi’s father sent him to study calligraphy under one of the most famous teachers in Korea, Mr. Han II Dong. Han, in addition to his skills as a calligrapher, was also a master of Taek Kyon, the ancient Korean art of foot fighting. The teacher, concerned over the frail condition of his new student, began teaching him the rigorous exercises of Taek Kyon to help build up his body.

In 1937, Choi was sent to Japan to further his education. Shortly before leaving , however, the youth had the misfortune to engage in a rather heated argument with a massive professional wrestler who promised to literally tear the youth limb from limb at their next encounter. This threat seemed to give a new impetus to young Choi’s training in the martial arts.

In Kyoto, Choi met a fellow Korean, Mr. Him, who was engaged in teaching the Japanese martial art, Karate. With two years of concentrated training, Choi attained the rank of first degree black belt. These techniques, together with Taek Kyon (foot techniques), were the forerunners of modern Taekwon-Do.

There followed a period of both mental and physical training, preparatory school, high school, and finally the University in Tokyo. During this time, training and experimentation in his new fighting techniques were intensified until, with attainment of his second degree black belt, he began teaching at a YMCA in Tokyo, Japan.

Choi recounts a particular experience from this period of time. There was no lamp-post in the city that he didn't strike or kick to see if the copper wires ahead were vibrating in protest.

"I would imagine that these were the techniques I would use to defend myself against the wrestler, Mr. Hu if he did attempt to carry out his promise to tear me limb from limb when I eventually returned to Korea."

With the outbreak of World War II, the author was forced to enlist in the Japanese army through no volition of his own. While at his post in Pyongyang, North Korea, the author was implicated as the planner of the Korean Independence Movement and interned at a Japanese prison during his eight month pretrial examination.

While in prison, to alleviate the boredom and keep physically fit, Choi began practicing this art in the solitude of his cell. In a short time, his cellmate and jailer became students of his. Eventually, the whole prison courtyard became one gigantic gymnasium.

The liberation in August 1945 spared Choi from an imposed seven year prison sentence. Following his release, the ex-prisoner journeyed to Seoul where he organized a student soldier’s party. In January of the following year, Choi was commissioned as a second lieutenant in the new south Korean army, the "Launching Pad" for putting Taekwon-Do into a new orbit.

Soon after, he made company commander in Kwang-Ju where the young second lieutenant lighted the torch of this art by teaching his entire company and was then promoted to first lieutenant and transferred to Tae Jon in charge of the Second Infantry Regiment. While at his new post, Choi began spreading the art not only to Korean soldiers but also to the Americans stationed there. This was the first introduction to Americans of what would eventually become known as Taekwon-Do.

1947 was a year of fast promotion. Choi was promoted to captain and then major. In 1948, he was posted to Seoul as the head of logistics and became Taekwon-Do instructor for the American Military Police School there. In late 1948, Choi became a lieutenant colonel.

In 1949, Choi was promoted to full colonel and visited the United States for the first time, attending the Fort Riley Ground General School. While there, this art was introduced to the American public. And in 1951, brigadier general. During this time, he organized the Ground General School in Pusan as Assistant Commandant and Chief of the Academic Department. Choi was appointed as Chief of Staff of the First Corps in 1952 and was responsible for briefing General MacArthur during the latter’s visits to Kang Nung. At the time of armistice, Choi was in command of the 5th Infantry Division.

The year 1953 was an eventful one for the General, in both his military career and in the progress of the new martial art. He became the author of the first authoritative book on military intelligence in Korea. He organized and activated the crack 29th Infantry Division at Cheju Island, which eventually became the spearhead of Taekwon-Do in the military and established the Oh Do Kwan (Gym of My Way) where he succeeded not only in training the cadre instructors for the entire military but also developing the Taek Kyon and Karate techniques into a modern system of Taekwon-Do, with the help of Mr. Nam Tae Hi, his right hand man in 1954.

In the latter part of that year, he commanded Chong Do Kwan (Gym of the Blue Wave), the largest civilian gym in Korea; Choi was also promoted to major general.

Technically, 1955 signaled the beginning of Taekwon-Do as a formally recognized art in Korea. During that year, a special board was formed which included leading master instructors, historians, and prominent leaders of society. A number of names for the new martial art were submitted. On the 11th of April, the board summoned by Gen. Choi, decided on the name of Taekwon-Do which had been submitted by him. This single unified name of Taekwon-Do replaced the different and confusing terms; Dang Soo, Gong Soo, Taek Kyon, Kwon Bup, etc.

In 1959, Taekwon-Do spread beyond its national boundaries. The father of Taekwon-Do and nineteen of his top black belt holders toured the Far East.
The tour was a major success, astounding all spectators with the excellence of the Taekwon-Do techniques. Many of these black belt holders such as Nam Tae Hi, President of the Asia Taekwon-Do Federation; Colonel Ko Jae Chun, the 5th Chief of Taekwon-Do instructors in Vietnam; Colonel Baek Joon Gi, the 2nd Chief instructor in Vietnam; Brigadier Gen. Woo Jong Lim; Mr. Han Cha Kyo, the Head Instructor in Singapore and Mr. Cha Soo Young, presently an international instructor in Washington D.C. eventually went on to spread the art to the world.

In this year, Choi was elevated to two illustrious posts; President of his newly formed Korea Taekwon-Do Association and deputy commander of the 2nd Army in Tae Gu.

The Korean Ambassador to Vietnam, General Choi Duk Shin was instrumental in helping to promote Taekwon-Do in this nation locked in a death struggle with the communists. That same year General Choi Hong Hi published his first Korean text on Taekwon-Do which became the model for the 1965 edition.

In the year of 1960, the General attended the Modern Weapons Familiarization Course in Texas followed by a visit to Jhoon Rhees Karate Club in San Antonio, where the author convinced the students to use the name Taekwon-Do instead of Karate. Thus Jhoon Rhee is known as the first Taekwon-Do instructor in America.

This marked the beginning of Taekwon-Do in the United States of America.
Choi returned to Korea as the Director of Intelligence of the Korean Army.
Later that same year, he assumed command of the Combat Armed Command with direction of the infantry, artillery, armored, signal and aviation schools.

The Year 1961, incidentally, was the year of maturation for both Choi’s military career and Taekwon-Do, with the command of the largest training centers in Korea and the newly assigned command of the 6th Army Corps.

Taekwon-Do spread like wildfire, not only to the Korean civilian and military population but to the U.S. soldiers of the 7th Infantry Division which was under his operational control. Through his students, Taekwon-Do was even introduced to the greatest military academy in the world. West Point, In the same year, he also made Taekwon-Do a compulsory subject for the entire armed and police forces in south Korea.

1962, Choi was appointed as Ambassador to Malaysia, where, as a dedicated missionary of Taekwon-Do, the art was spread. In 1963, the Taekwon-Do Association of Malaysia was formed and reached national acceptance when the art was demonstrated at the Merdeka Stadium at the request of the Prime Minister, Tunku Abdul Rhaman.

The same year, two important milestones took place; the famous demonstration at the United Nations building in New York, and the introduction of Taekwon-Do to the Armed Forces of Vietnam under Major Nam Tae Hi, In February of the following year, a Taekwon-Do Association was formed in Singapore, and the groundwork was laid for forming associations in the outer reaches of Brunei.

The same year, Ambassador Choi made a trip to Vietnam with the sole purpose of teaching the advanced Taekwon-Do patterns that he perfected after years of research to the instructors group headed by Lt. Col. Park Joon Gi, in person. This was indeed a new era for Taekwon-Do in that he was able to draw a clear line between Taekwon-Do and Karate by completely eliminating the remaining vestige of Karate.

Late this year, he was re-elected to be the President of the Korea Taekwon-Do Association upon returning home, which gave him a chance to purify the Taekwon-Do society by cleaning up the political circles within its organization.

In 1965 Ambassador Choi, retired two star general, was appointed by the Government of the Republic of Korea to lead a goodwill mission to West Germany, Italy, Turkey, United-Arab Republic, Malaysia, and Singapore. This trip is significant in that the Ambassador, for the first time in Korean history, declared Taekwon-Do as the national martial art of Korea.

This was the basis not only for establishing Taekwon-Do Associations in these countries but also the formation of the International Taekwon-Do Federation as it is known today. In 1966, the dream of the sickly young student of calligraphy, who rose to Ambassador and the Association President of the most respected martial art in the world came true. On the 22nd of March, the International Taekwon-Do Federation was formed with associations in Vietnam, Malaysia, Singapore, West Germany, the United States, Turkey, Italy, Arab Republic of Egypt and Korea.

In 1967, the father of Taekwon-Do received the first Class Distinguished Service medal from the Government of Vietnam and he helped to form the Korea-Vietnam Taekwon-Do Foundation, presided by Gen. Tran van Dong. That same year the Hong Kong Taekwon-Do Association was formed. In August, Choi visited the All American Taekwon-Do tournament held in Chicago, Illinois, where he discussed expansion, unification, and the policy of the United States Taekwon-Do Association with leading instructors. This visit led to the formal establishment of the U.S. Taekwon-Do Association in Washington, D.C. on November 26th, 1967.

During his visit, Choi also met with Robert Walson, fourth degree black belt and one of the foremost American authorities on Taekwon-Do, to lay the ground work for a new edition of a book on Taekwon-Do.

In late 1967, the author invited Master Oyama to the I.T.F. Headquarters in Seoul to continue the discussion they had earlier at Hakone, Japan, whereby Master Oyama would eventually change his techniques to that of Taekwon-Do.

In that same year, the President of the I.T.F. selected five instructors from the Armed Forces for Taiwan, at the request of Generalissimo Chiang Kai-Shek. This request was channeled through General Chung II Kwon, then the Prime Minister of South Korea.

​

In 1968, the author visited France, as the chief delegate of the Korean Government, to attend the Consul International Sports Military Symposium held in Paris. Taekwon-Do was a major topic on the agenda. Delegates from 32 countries witnessed demonstrations of Taekwon-Do by a team of experts. That same year, the United Kingdom Taekwon-Do Association was formed and the author visited Spain, the Netherlands, Canada, Belgium and India with the hope of spreading Taekwon-Do.

When Choi returned to Korea he was presented with the first Sports Research Award from south Korea for his dedicated work on behalf of the Korean martial art.

In 1969, Choi toured Southeast Asia to personally investigate the preparations of each country for the First Asian Taekwon-Do Tournament that was held in September in Hong Kong. Immediately after the tournament, the author undertook a worldwide tour of twenty-nine countries to visit instructors and gather photographs for the first edition of his previous book “Taekwon-Do”. (copyright 1972)

August 1970, the author left for a tour of twenty countries throughout Southeast Asia, Canada, Europe and the Middle East. Choi, of course, held seminars for international instructors every place he went and helped spread and weld the International Taekwon-Do Federation into a cohesive force.

In March 1971, Choi attended the Second Asian Taekwon-Do Tournament, held at Stadium Negara in Malaysia, which was opened with the declaration of Tun Abdul Rhajak, the Prime Minister, and closed with the presence of their Majesties.

Also in this year, the author was asked by Gen. Kim Jong Hyun, head of the Army Martial Art department, to select qualified instructors for the Republic of Iran Armed Forces.

The world tour of 1972 was quite retrospective in that Choi had an opportunity to introduce Taekwon-Do to those heads of state of Bolivia, Dominica, Haiti and Guatemala respectively.

In this year, Choi moved the headquarters of International Taekwon-Do Federation, with the unanimous consent of member countries, to Toronto, Canada, envisaging to spread this art eventually to the countries of Eastern Europe, according to the milestone he set up years before.

During these travels, the author has been especially interested in promoting Taekwon-Do among the youth of the world. The President of the International Taekwon-Do Federation has been instrumental in introducing the art to numerous universities in Europe, America, the Middle East and the Far East.

During the months of November and December 1973, General Choi and a specially selected I.T.F. Demonstration Team, consisting of Kong Young II, Park Jong Soo, Rhee Ki Ha, Pak Sun Jae and Choi Chang Keun, all 7th degree black belts, toured Europe, the Middle East, Africa and the Far East. A total of 13 countries were visited and new I.T.F. branches established in 5 of these countries. The tour was an overwhelming success with a total of more than 100,000 people watching the demonstrations in Egypt alone. At each stop, general Choi and the Demonstration Team were hosted by ranking representatives of the local governments.

1974 was indeed an exuberant and long remembered year for Choi, because the founder of Taekwon-Do was not only able to proudly present the superiority of techniques as well as the competition rules of this art, but also to bring his dream into reality by holding the first World Taekwon-Do Championships in Montreal.

In November and December of this year, he led the 4th International Taekwon-Do Demonstration Team consisting of 10 of the world’s top instructors to Jamaica, Curacao, Costa Rica, Colombia, Venezuela and Surinam.

In 1975, Taekwon-Do alone had the privilege to demonstrate at the Sydney opera house for the first time since its opening. General Choi visited Greece and Sweden to conduct seminars later in this year. In the middle of
1976 he toured Iran, Malaysia, Indonesia, and Europe to inspect Taekwon-Do activities, giving seminars at the same time. In November of the same year, Choi went to Holland to declare the opening of the First European Taekwon-Do Championships held in Amsterdam.

September 1977, the founder of Taekwon-Do visited Malaysia, New Zealand and Australia following the Tokyo meeting in which he publicly denounced the South Korean President Park Jung Hee who had been using Taekwon-Do for his political ends. Later that year he visited Sweden and Denmark to aid in the formation of their National Associations of Taekwon-Do.

In May of 1978, General Choi toured Malaysia, Pakistan, Kenya and South Africa accompanied by Rhee Ki Ha. In this year he led the 5th International Taekwon-Do Demonstration Team consisting of Choi Chang Keun, Rhee Ki Ha, Park Jung Tae and Liong Wai Meng to Sweden, Poland, Hungary and Yugoslavia.
In September of the same year the Second World Taekwon-Do Championships was held in Oklahoma City, U.S.A.

In June 1979, the All Europe Taekwon-Do Federation was formed in Oslo, Norway. After this historic event General Choi toured Sweden, Denmark, West Germany, France and Greenland accompanied by Khang Su Jong and Rhee Ki Ha.
In November of that year he led the 6th International Taekwon-Do demonstration team consisting of Kim Jong Chan, Choi Chang Keun, Rhee Ki Ha, Park Jung Tae, Lee Jong Moon, Chung Kwang Duk, Kim Suk Jun and Michael Cormack to Argentina.

The year 1980 was indeed an unforgettable one for the father of Taekwon-Do, both for himself and the future of his art. He and 15 of his students, including his son Choi Joong Hwa, made a monumental trip to the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea. This was the first time Taekwon-Do was introduced to the people of North Korea, Choi’s birth place. In November of this same year, the first All Europe Taekwon-Do Championships was held in London with 18 countries participating.

In January of 1981, Gen. Choi made a visit to Queensland, Australia, accompanied by Choi Chang Keun, to declare, open the first Pacific Area Taekwon-Do Championships. At this time he helped to form the South Pacific Taekwon-Do Federation as well as the Australian Taekwon-Do Federation.

In June of the same year, the author led the 8th International Taekwon-Do Demonstration Team to Tokyo, Japan. In October, he conducted a seminar for the founding members of Taekwon-Do in the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea, and in November he proudly presented the unified Taekwon-Do demonstration team consisting of North and South Korean instructors to the historic meeting called North and Overseas Korean Christian Leaders, held in Vienna, Austria. In August, President Choi visited Argentina to declare the opening of the Third World Taekwon-Do Championships held in Resitancia, Chaco.

General Choi personally explaining the philosophy of Taekwon-Do
to United States Senators and Congressmen

In January 1982 the President of the International Taekwon-Do Federation formed the North America Taekwon-Do Federation in Toronto, Canada. In this year, the author was finally able to realize his long anticipated dream (since 1967) when a Taekwon-Do gym opened for the first time in Japan under the auspices of patriot Chon Jin Shik. It was indeed a very busy year for the President in that he visited Puerto Rico in July accompanied by Master Park Jung Tae, to conduct seminars.

During the months of October and November he toured Greenland, the United Kingdom, West Germany, Austria, Denmark, Poland, Hungary, Yugoslavia, Czechoslovakia and Finland, accompanied by Master Han Sam Soo, Park Jung Taek and Choi Joong Hwa to promote Taekwon-Do. He also attended the First Intercontinental Taekwon-Do Championships held in December in Naples, Italy.

In October of the same year Gen. Choi met with Mr. Csandi, the Chairman of programming committee of I.O.C. in Budapest, Hungary to discuss the recognition of I.T.F. by the I.O.C. In January 1983, General Choi made a visit to Colorado, U.S.A accompanied by Master Lee Suk Hi, the President of North America Taekwon-Do Federation, to grade Charles E.Sereff, the President of the U.S. Taekwon-Do Federation, for 7th degree.

In February 1983, the author toured Latin America including Argentina, Columbia, Panama and Honduras to conduct a full scale seminar. During his stay in Honduras he helped to activate the Central American Taekwon-Do Federation. During the months of March, April and May he toured Santa Barbara, California, Europe and the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea to conduct last minute preparation of the encyclopedia, the last product of his life-long research.

In October and November of the same year, he made a visit to Yugoslavia and Italy accompanied by Park Jung Taek and Choi Joong Hwa to prepare photographs to be used for the Encyclopedia. In April 1984, President Choi declared the opening of the Fourth World Taekwon-Do Championships held in Glasgow, Scotland. In the same month, he visited Mr. Juan Antonio Samaranch, President of the International Olympic Committee, in Lausanne accompanied by Master Rhee Ki Ha, Charles Sereff and Kim Yong Kyu to prove that only the International Taekwon-Do Federation is the world governing body of true Taekwon-Do.

In September the author invited key instructors such as Lee Suk Hi, Rhee Ki Ha, Park Jung Tae and Choi Joong Hwa to Pyongyang to finalize the publication of the Encyclopedia. In fact, this was the time when the relocation of the I.T.F. to Vienna, Austria was seriously discussed.

In October of the same year, the President made an official visit to Budapest, Hungary to declare the opening of the 3rd All Europe Taekwon-Do Championships. This indeed was of particular importance as it was the first large scale international event held in a socialist country as far as the Taekwon-Do tournament is concerned.

In the following month, General Choi visited New York City along with masters Lee Suk Hi and Park Jung Tae to declare open the 3rd annual General Choi’s Cup in North America. In December the 5th I.T.F Congress meeting was held in Vienna, where it was unanimously decided to relocate the I.T.F. here by March of the next year. Also at the meeting, President Choi Hong Hi was re-elected for another term. Mr. Jun Chin Shik, the President of Japan International Taekwon-Do Federation, masters Lee Suk Hi and Rhee Ki Ha were elected as Vice Presidents with master Park Jung Tae as Secretary-General.

Without doubt, 1985 was one of the most significant years for the founder of Taekwon-Do as he was able to document all of the techniques he had researched for years by publishing the Encyclopedia of Taekwon-Do. He was also able to establish a strong foundation for the spreading of his art to the entire world, especially the socialist as well as the Third World countries by moving the International Taekwon-Do Federation to Vienna, the capital city of Austria.

In April of this year, President Choi visited Puerto Rico accompanied by Tran Trien Quan, the President of the Canadian Taekwon-Do Federation, James Lim and Kim Suk Jun to attend the 1st Latin American General Choi’s Cup. In June, he visited East Berlin to attend the opening ceremony of the 24th I.O.C. Congress.

In November of the same year, Gen. Choi, accompanied by Secretary-General Master Park Jung Tae and Tran Trien Quan, visited Norway to honour the opening of the 1985 Scandinavian Taekwon-Do Championships.

In December, various festivals celebrating the 30th anniversary of Taekwon-Do was held in Quebec, Canada sponsored by the Taekwon-Do Federation of Canada were highlighted with the presence of the Father of Taekwon-Do, Gen. Choi Hong Hi.

In June 1986 the founder took DPRK Taekwon-Do demonstration team to the People’s Republic of China. This visit eventually became the motivation for the Chinese people to adopt the Korean martial art, Taekwon-Do.

1987 was a significant year for General Choi because he showed once again the indomitable spirit as well as perseverance to the Taekwon-Do world by declaring the 5th World Championship in May in Athens, Greece, despite persistent interference of the South Korean dictatorial regime.

In December of the same year, president Choi began to formulate the Promotion and Popularization Foundation of ITF boosted by the pledge given by Mr. Chon Yon Shik, the elder brother of senior vice-president Mr. Chon Jin Shik, in the amount of 100,000,000 Japanese Yen.

The year 1988 was culminated by two important events. In May, the Hungarian government hosted the 6th World Championships in Budapest which was by far, the largest in scale, finest in technique and also for the first time, televised via satellite throughout Europe.

In August, the Father of Taekwon-Do was at last able to realize his ultimate dream of introducing and teaching his art without regard to religion, race, national or ideological boundaries, by leading the I.T.F. demonstration team to Moscow, U.S.S.R.


It is hoped that all instructors will follow his example by devoting part of their time towards introducing the art into the school systems in their respective areas.

Merely introducing the art, however, is not enough. The instructor must also concern himself with imbuing and maintaining a positive influence that will eventually serve as a guiding light to all students. Then and only then, can the instructor consider himself an apostle of Taekwon-Do.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I didn't read this but I agree with that last sentence.:ultracool
Sean

 

[ETinCYQX]

Great read, thanks for taking the time to post it.

 

[miguksaram]

Questions I am left with

Even at an early age, however, the future general showed a strong and independent spirit. At the age of twelve he was expelled from school for agitating against the Japanese authorities who were in control of Korea. This was the beginning of what would be a long association with the Kwang Ju Students’ Independence Movement.

I am going to assume when he says 12 he is talking "Korean" age of 12. The Gwangju Student movement started in 9/3/29 when he was 11 years old. This was also started with University students, not elementary students. How was it that he was not imprisoned, or killed for his act like 54,000 other Gwangju students were? Ironic that being so anti-Japanese that he would allow himself to be sent to Japan to be educated.

After his expulsion, young Choi’s father sent him to study calligraphy under one of the most famous teachers in Korea, Mr. Han II Dong. Han, in addition to his skills as a calligrapher, was also a master of Taek Kyon, the ancient Korean art of foot fighting. The teacher, concerned over the frail condition of his new student, began teaching him the rigorous exercises of Taek Kyon to help build up his body

How is it that you do not see any of the throws or locks that Taekkyon is also known for in any ODK system? Also, how was he able to be taught openly during Japanese occupation when Korean martial arts were not allowed to be practiced?

In the latter part of that year, he commanded Chong Do Kwan (Gym of the Blue Wave), the largest civilian gym in Korea; Choi was also promoted to major general

I don't believe he was ever in "command" of the Chungdokwan.

Anyway, there are more questions, but not enought time to disect this word for word. While I do not deny the huge influence Choi had on Korean martial arts, his background and claims do leave some openings for questions that will most likely never be answered.

 

[StudentCarl]

Thank you sir. That was interesting to read. Please share the source.

 

[dortiz]

General Choi personally explaining the philosophy of Taekwon-Do
to United States Senators and Congressmen
Funny how the guy he is talking to has a uniform with Tae Kwon Do written on it.....


Thats the best I could come up with. Otherwise why flame on?

 

[chrispillertkd]

Questions I am left with [/font]

I am going to assume when he says 12 he is talking "Korean" age of 12. The Gwangju Student movement started in 9/3/29 when he was 11 years old. This was also started with University students, not elementary students. How was it that he was not imprisoned, or killed for his act like 54,000 other Gwangju students were? Ironic that being so anti-Japanese that he would allow himself to be sent to Japan to be educated.

You should get a copy of Gen. Choi's autobiography and read for yourself about his involvement in this episode of Korean history.

As for "allowing himself" to be sent to Japan, he may've been anti-Japanese (and not without reason) he was also Korean, which meant he was profoundly influenced by Neo-Confucianism. Disobeying one's parents wasn't looked upon kindly by the Neo-Confucian Korean culture, as I'm sure you're aware.

How is it that you do not see any of the throws or locks that Taekkyon is also known for in any ODK system? Also, how was he able to be taught openly during Japanese occupation when Korean martial arts were not allowed to be practiced?

Taekkyon's influence on ITF Taekwon-Do is primarily one of favoring foot techniques in combat, IMHO. That being said you seem unfamiliar with the sweeping kicks, checking kicks, twisting kicks, and (especially) foot tackling that is found in Gen. Choi's system of Taekwon-Do. Those techniques bear a striking resemblance to things I've seen in Taekkyon demonstrations. Have you seen these techniques demonstrated by Taekwon-Doin?

(I'd also point out the manner of dropping one's body weight when performing sine wave is akin to the rhythmic motion one sees in Taekkyon's "dance like" movements. I'm not saying this is a direct adaptation, or anything, but again, like with the favoring of foot techniques, it can be viewed as an influence on Gen. Choi.)

As for "throws and locks" if you don't see any in Taekwon-Do you might not be looking very hard. They are there, although most of them that are present in Gen. Choi's system come not from Taekkyon but from Hapkido, as Hapkido Grand Master Chung Kee Tae has attested. You can see photos of him demonstrating hosinsul in early editions of Gen. Choi's textbook.

I don't believe he was ever in "command" of the Chungdokwan.

He was certainly approached by GM Won Kuk Lee about heading the Chung Do Kwan before Lee left Korea because of Gen. Choi's position in the military. Gen. Choi accepted the position of "Honorary Kwan Jang" because of a perceived conflict of interest given his military position.

As he says in his memoirs, "as a soldier I was prohibited from owning any private enterprise, Deok-Sung Sohng had been managing the Chung-Do Kwan under his name, and I had been approving major issues, and placing my stamp on every degree certificate as honorary director."

This was after he describes being approached by GM Won Kuk Lee in 1950 as follows:

"I asked Lee what brought him here [to Gen. Choi's home]. 'To speak frankly, I have to go to Japan. Once I go I probably come back. So, I am here to ask you to do me the favor of taking care of my practice hall and raising my students."

"I asked how on earth he knew that I practiced karate? 'I have herad of you, General, for quite a long time, both about your achievements and who you are. I think no one else could be the right person to direct the Chung Do Kwan. So, I am asking a favor of you, like this.' Due to his sincere request I promised him I would do it. That is how I started to direct the Chung Do Kwan."

Anyway, there are more questions, but not enought time to disect this word for word. While I do not deny the huge influence Choi had on Korean martial arts, his background and claims do leave some openings for questions that will most likely never be answered.

You should really read Gen. Choi's autobiography to get a more detailed picture of what was going on instead of forming your total opinion based on an "About the Author" section (regardless of how extensive it is). Lots of very interesting stuff in his autobiography, as I learned when I read it.

Pax,

Chris

 

[chrispillertkd]

General Choi personally explaining the philosophy of Taekwon-Do
to United States Senators and Congressmen
Funny how the guy he is talking to has a uniform with Tae Kwon Do written on it.....

I'm not sure why that's funny. Jhoon Rhee had been (and maybe still is) teaching U.S. Congressmen Taekwon-Do for quite some time. Rhee was involved with Gen. Choi since at least the late 1950s until perhaps the early 1970s. It wouldn't be surprising for Gen. Choi to do some teaching about Taekwon-Do philosophy to these students in this case. He was, after all, involved in promoting Taekwon-Do and often would do so by spreading it to people who were important or held high office because they would then be able to help him spread it either directly or indirectly (by offering monetary or governmental support). It's part of the reason why the ITF was able to spread Taekwon-Do so quickly and widely in the early days.

Pax,

Chris

 

[dortiz]

Taekwon-Do vs Tae Kwon Do.

For some folks its a big deal and usually the ITFers so its funny to see it in that shot.

Duh on the rest amigo : )

 

[foogz]

i'm only gettin into tkd (itf) just now and obv reading into it and stuff....y dus everybody have to criticise tkd and say "taekwondo sucks and kickboxing is better" i mean get a grip my master (direct pupil from Mr Rhee) teaches tkd and kickboxing, he says kickboxin is just the sport side of tkd, sparring is good but some1 who does patterns and gets them perfect will destroy the opponent on the street....not just give them a beat down.... my 1st post btw :-D

 

[chrispillertkd]

i'm only gettin into tkd (itf) just now and obv reading into it and stuff....y dus everybody have to criticise tkd and say "taekwondo sucks and kickboxing is better" i mean get a grip

Because despite the fact that nearly everyone always says there are no better or worse martial arts just better or worse martial artists when it comes right down to it very few people actually believe this (or at least very few actually act like they believe it).

my master (direct pupil from Mr Rhee) teaches tkd and kickboxing, he says kickboxin is just the sport side of tkd, sparring is good but some1 who does patterns and gets them perfect will destroy the opponent on the street....not just give them a beat down.... my 1st post btw :-D

Welcome to MT.

Out of curiosity, to which Mr. Rhee are you referring? There aren't exactly a ton of Korean names and there have been many quite famous Taekwon-Doin with the name Rhee (GM Rhee, Ki Ha; Jhoon Rhee; and Rhee, Chong Chul to name but a few).

Pax,

Chris

 

[chrispillertkd]

Taekwon-Do vs Tae Kwon Do.

For some folks its a big deal and usually the ITFers so its funny to see it in that shot.

Oh, no biggie on that. You can see lots of people with TAEKWONDO or TAE KWON DO on the back of their doboks back in the day. Official ITF doboks were still some years off. Although by the mid 1960s (At least '65, if not before), Gen. Choi was writing Taekwon-Do in English it can take a while for information to go global, especially before the internet, and even longer before everyone signs on. The picture in question was with Jhoon Rhee so it was probably the late 60s or early 70s.

Pax,

Chris

 

[miguksaram]

You should get a copy of Gen. Choi's autobiography and read for yourself about his involvement in this episode of Korean history.

As for "allowing himself" to be sent to Japan, he may've been anti-Japanese (and not without reason) he was also Korean, which meant he was profoundly influenced by Neo-Confucianism. Disobeying one's parents wasn't looked upon kindly by the Neo-Confucian Korean culture, as I'm sure you're aware.

So by reading the book I will finally see for myself how he was able to be involved in a uprising as an 11 year old? Perhaps you can just point out the page where he explains that so I can just skip to the good stuff. If you are going to use the Neo-Confucianism as an excuse then he wouldn't have been acting up as a young child in elementary school. Such behavior would have been contradictory to the teachings. Even more so he would have shamed his family for such behavior. So he is either a rebellious child or he is not.

I still feel the whole prison story is a farce. A Japanese imperial soldier would not "lower" himself to be communicate with a Korean prisoner much less take lessons from him.

Taekkyon's influence on ITF Taekwon-Do is primarily one of favoring foot techniques in combat, IMHO. That being said you seem unfamiliar with the sweeping kicks, checking kicks, twisting kicks, and (especially) foot tackling that is found in Gen. Choi's system of Taekwon-Do. Those techniques bear a striking resemblance to things I've seen in Taekkyon demonstrations. Have you seen these techniques demonstrated by Taekwon-Doin?

Perhaps you can point me to pictures or videos that show ODK teaching these techniques to the military. Because everything I have seen in the early years look to be just regular Korea Karate. I saw these techniques more prevalent in HKD in the early years before I saw them in TK-D.

(I'd also point out the manner of dropping one's body weight when performing sine wave is akin to the rhythmic motion one sees in Taekkyon's "dance like" movements. I'm not saying this is a direct adaptation, or anything, but again, like with the favoring of foot techniques, it can be viewed as an influence on Gen. Choi.)

It is also akin to rhythmic motion one sees in some traditional Korean dancing...so perhaps Choi took dance instead?

As for "throws and locks" if you don't see any in Taekwon-Do you might not be looking very hard. They are there, although most of them that are present in Gen. Choi's system come not from Taekkyon but from Hapkido, as Hapkido Grand Master Chung Kee Tae has attested. You can see photos of him demonstrating hosinsul in early editions of Gen. Choi's textbook.

Which raises the question of Choi's Taekkyon's connection not being real. Unless you can show me the influence prior to his connection to HKD, it is just hard to believe that he was ever taught Taekkyon especially when it was such a very rare art to begin with.

He was certainly approached by GM Won Kuk Lee about heading the Chung Do Kwan before Lee left Korea because of Gen. Choi's position in the military. Gen. Choi accepted the position of "Honorary Kwan Jang" because of a perceived conflict of interest given his military position.

As he says in his memoirs, "as a soldier I was prohibited from owning any private enterprise, Deok-Sung Sohng had been managing the Chung-Do Kwan under his name, and I had been approving major issues, and placing my stamp on every degree certificate as honorary director."

This was after he describes being approached by GM Won Kuk Lee in 1950 as follows:

"I asked Lee what brought him here [to Gen. Choi's home]. 'To speak frankly, I have to go to Japan. Once I go I probably come back. So, I am here to ask you to do me the favor of taking care of my practice hall and raising my students."

"I asked how on earth he knew that I practiced karate? 'I have herad of you, General, for quite a long time, both about your achievements and who you are. I think no one else could be the right person to direct the Chung Do Kwan. So, I am asking a favor of you, like this.' Due to his sincere request I promised him I would do it. That is how I started to direct the Chung Do Kwan."

With the contradictory story being that It was Lee, Won-kuk gave power to Son, Duk-song. It was Son who was asked by Nam, Tae-hi to give rank to Choi to help spread Chungdokwan due to his position. So Son gave Choi and honorary 4th dan...later taken away.

But my question is why would Lee ask Choi to take over something he was never a part of? Especially since Nam would have been senior to Choi. If Lee would have done something like that it would have been a slap in the face to everyone.

You should really read Gen. Choi's autobiography to get a more detailed picture of what was going on instead of forming your total opinion based on an "About the Author" section (regardless of how extensive it is). Lots of very interesting stuff in his autobiography, as I learned when I read it.

Pax,

Chris

While you may believe everything you read...I question everything that doesn't make sense...even if it is just an introduction page.

 

[Earl Weiss]

Thank you sir. That was interesting to read. Please share the source.

This is an amalgamation from many sources put together by a Mr. Mike Morningstar who was well acquainted with Gneral Choi.

 

[Earl Weiss]

General Choi personally explaining the philosophy of Taekwon-Do
to United States Senators and Congressmen
Funny how the guy he is talking to has a uniform with Tae Kwon Do written on it.....


Thats the best I could come up with. Otherwise why flame on?

The "Flame on" was (although I kinda stole it from a comic book character) a knowing nod to those who would be P' O'd by this info.

I knew some would try to dissect it. Like how a youngster learning Taekyon exercises would have to somehow result in a very prevelant trait in TKD or how learning from a calligraphy teacher would somehow be impossible public instruction prohibited by the Japanese, or how a "jailor" would have to be an imperial soldier who would not lower themself.

 

[StudentCarl]

Foogz, welcome to MT. It's interesting that you wrote : "some1 who does patterns and gets them perfect will destroy the opponent on the street....not just give them a beat down..."

I would be interested to see you start this as a separate discussion topic if you really believe this, since it doesn't relate to the topic of General Choi.

 

[bluewaveschool]

The guy on the right isn't impressed.

 

[chrispillertkd]

[/font]

So by reading the book I will finally see for myself how he was able to be involved in a uprising as an 11 year old?

I don't know what you'll be able to see. You would be able to actually read an extensive memoir of the person we're discussing. What you make of it is up to you.

Perhaps you can just point out the page where he explains that so I can just skip to the good stuff.

Volume 1, pp. 42-45. Always happy to help.

If you are going to use the Neo-Confucianism as an excuse then he wouldn't have been acting up as a young child in elementary school. Such behavior would have been contradictory to the teachings. Even more so he would have shamed his family for such behavior. So he is either a rebellious child or he is not.

And obviously there s no difference between the filial piety preached by Neo-Confucianism, which is why he went to Japan in the first place (at the direction of his parents and to further his education, which are both highly esteemed in that belief system) and being opposed to an invading country (the Japanese), right?

As for Gen. Choi being "either a rebellious child or ... not," well he oviously was. That is apparent to anyone who has read his autobiography. But not in all things, just like the vast majority of people have flaws but aren't completely bad. He is rather forthcoming about pretty much all of his personal shortcomings, which results in a pretty accurate picture of him as a person, I'd say.

But even so, I always find it interesting when people hold others to a standard of "either he is or he isn't" as if there was no room for personal development over time or even no allowance for human nature (which can be quite capricious at times).

I still feel the whole prison story is a farce. A Japanese imperial soldier would not "lower" himself to be communicate with a Korean prisoner much less take lessons from him.

It's possible. Then again I find it more believable than being taught secrets of swordsmanship by mountain goblins like some people claim (although I really do think those are cool stories!). Those sneaky Tengu.

Anyway, you can read about Gen. Choi's internment in a Japanese prison in volume 1, pp. 141-179. The part dealing with him teaching karate while there is on pp. 145-147. It is an interesting episode and, frankly, sheds some light on something I was rather dubious about when I first read about it. It seems more likely to me now.

Perhaps you can point me to pictures or videos that show ODK teaching these techniques to the military. Because everything I have seen in the early years look to be just regular Korea Karate. I saw these techniques more prevalent in HKD in the early years before I saw them in TK-D.

No, I can't point you to video from early ODK training, as I'm not even aware of any existing. Are you? I'd love to see some, that would be pretty cool. I can point out to you that in volume 2 of the Encyclopedia of Taekwon-Do all of the foot techniques I mentioned in my previous post are present and they bear a striking resemblance to things I've seen in Taekkyon demos. But I already basically stated that. No one denies that Gen. Choi's system developed over the years, which is why it's not a surprise that his earlier works didn't have as many techniques as his later one did, or that the execution of some of them changed. But Gen. Choi didn't even publish the first edition of the Encyclopedia until 1985, so it's hardly surprising that he'd continue to devlop and refine techniques for inclusion until that point. I simply pointed out that given the similarity to some techniques found in ITF Taekwon-Do and those found in Taekkyon it seems a bit premature to dismiss any influence of the latter on the former. At least if you have an open mind about things.

It is also akin to rhythmic motion one sees in some traditional Korean dancing...so perhaps Choi took dance instead?

Well, insofar as Taekkyon is similar to trafitional Korean dance, maybe. I mean Taekkyon really was more of a folk-game than a full blown martial art back in the day so it's possible that it was influenced by other forms of traditional Korean culture. But I was specifically talking about the way in which people move to drop their weight into techniques. The presence of dance-like movements accompanied by instrumental music in Taekkyon is an interesting occurance, though.

Or were you just trying to insult Gen. Choi instead of asking a serious question? Just curious.

Which raises the question of Choi's Taekkyon's connection not being real. Unless you can show me the influence prior to his connection to HKD, it is just hard to believe that he was ever taught Taekkyon especially when it was such a very rare art to begin with.

Gen. Choi, unlie some other early kwan founders, never claimed to hav "mastered" Taekkyon. He did claim to have received some training in it from his calligraphy instructor and in a laer interview I read with him he stated that it was pretty basic training, consisting of mostly basic kicks.

But the joint locks and throws in Taekwon-Do, as I already stated, mostly come from Hapkido via Chung Kee Tae (and a couple of others). It was the foot techniques such as foot tackling, etc. that I mentioned looking quite similar to some techniques found in Taekkyon.

As for Taekkyon being a "rare art," well it's rare. But an "art"? Maybe now. But back in the early 1930s when Gen. Choi learned a bit of it? Probably not. More of a strenuous game, if anything.

With the contradictory story being that It was Lee, Won-kuk gave power to Son, Duk-song. It was Son who was asked by Nam, Tae-hi to give rank to Choi to help spread Chungdokwan due to his position. So Son gave Choi and honorary 4th dan...later taken away.

Who is the source for Lee Won Kuk giving the Chung Do Kwan to Son, Duk Sun? I'm curious as I've never really heard this before. I'm nto saying it's not true, I just haven't heard it.

As for Son taking away Gen. Choi's 4th dan and kicking him out of the Chung Do Kwan (let's not forget that), who cares? Seriously, Gen. Choi was the founder and head of his own Kwan. He could've made himself a 17th dan if he wanted. Losing an honorary degree when he was the honorary head of the Chung Do Kwan is akin to someone who received an honorary Ph.D. from a college having it taken away from them; irrelevant except insofar as it is a public embarrassment for them.

GM Son Duk Son is certainly one of the early pioneers of Taekwon-Do but his actions came close on the heels of Gen. Choi denying him a place on the Taekwon-Do demonstration team that was going on an international tour. It was composed totally of Gen. Choi's military students and the Gen. told him that it wasn't for civilians. GM Son's reaction seems to be a bit of sour grapes to me. YMMV.

Interestingly, GM Son also expelled GM Uhm Woon Kyu, Nam Tae Hi and Hyun Jong Myun at the same time. But Gm Uhm ended up as the current head of the Chung Do Kwan and was at one time the President of the Kukkiwon, GM Nam Tae Hi was already a member of the Oh Do Kwan and is still considered very senior in the Chung Do Kwan and Hyun Jong Myun becamse the second Kwan Jang of the Oh Do Kwan. These things just show that not a lot of stock was put into some decisions GM Son made. I don't doubt he was an awesome technician and that his followers have benefitted greatly from his teachings, but saying that his cancellation of an honorary degree to the head of another Kwan means anything is a bit of a stretch.

But my question is why would Lee ask Choi to take over something he was never a part of? Especially since Nam would have been senior to Choi. If Lee would have done something like that it would have been a slap in the face to everyone.

Because Gen. Choi had a ton of political clout in Korea at the time. I mean, a lot. And GM Lee was getting out of dodge because he was being accused of being a communist, IIRC. He and some of his students had already been the recipients of the ROK government's "hospitality" and going to Japan was probably the only way he could escape inprisonment (or worse). Perhaps he though Gen. Choi's politicla power could at least save the Chung Do Kwan from being dissolved by the government (or used for muscle).

GM Nam was already working for Gen. Choi and so was his junior. It wouldn't have been a slight in that sense. Many of the top Oh Do Kwan instructors had a background in the Chung Do Kwan and so there was already a link between the two bodies that way.

While you may believe everything you read...I question everything that doesn't make sense...even if it is just an introduction page.

LOL Spoken like some one who has never met me. I'm an academic, the last thing I do is "believe everything read." What I actually do is read things, multiple things, and try to use all the sources available to come to a conclusion. One of the best sources out there on Gen. Choi life is his autobiography. To simply dismiss it unread, or to say that it's an autobiography and so is automatically inaccurate isn't an example of "question[ing] everything." It's an example of not questioning something in the first place.

Pax,

Chris

 

[chrispillertkd]

The guy on the right isn't impressed.

And if I was the guy on the left (GM Kang, Suh Chong) I might be a bit worried

Pax,

Chris

 

[miguksaram]

The "Flame on" was (although I kinda stole it from a comic book character) a knowing nod to those who would be P' O'd by this info.

I knew some would try to dissect it. Like how a youngster learning Taekyon exercises would have to somehow result in a very prevelant trait in TKD or how learning from a calligraphy teacher would somehow be impossible public instruction prohibited by the Japanese, or how a "jailor" would have to be an imperial soldier who would not lower themself.

Flaming something means I have been insulting or derogatory in my replies to the post. I have done nothing but question the claims of your demi-god (see..that might be flaming). This the same thing I have done when I was presented with claims that TKD was a direct descendant of Hwarang warriors. I have done the same questioning when people made claims that Taekwondo was a direct descendant of Taekkyon.

When someone, anyone, makes claims that don't fit the status quo, such as being a Korea imprisoned in a Japanese jail and being so impressive in martial arts that even the Japanese jailor wanted to learn from you, I am going to question it.

The only people who get PO'd are the those who take everything that has been spoon fed to them and refuse to really dig deep to find the truth. Honestly if you found out Choi lied about everything would it really make your martial art bad? No...it wouldn't. I have already stated that I respect his role in spreading martial arts and that I respect his art. That doesn't mean I am not going to question his claims.