The Red Stripe Revolution.....

Goldendragon7

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A brief historical review of the EPAK "red stripes" actually reveal that he decided to place the stripes on belts back when the system was in the early stages [Late '60's] to let people see and know that there were advanced ranks developing in Kenpo and to distinguish the new {during that time period} Ed Parker System from others. Many Martial Arts Systems believe that the show of rank on belts {stripes of any kind} or sashes are an arrogant and distasteful public "show off" of authority and not a humble attribute that any black belt should demonstrate.

History may be in process of repeating itself. We might be close to reverting back soon, and wear NO rank on belts or face the embarrassment of public ridicule if you do wear a belt full of red as if to say.......
"Hey! ! ! look at me, the Ultimate Great Grandmaster Super Pu Ba Lord High Mocus Mega High Pinnacle Paramount Awesome Stupendous Solitary Instructor of all that have ever breathed on this planet! [did I get them all in?]:rofl:

Whatdayathink?
 

theletch1

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I may be speaking out of place here as I am not yet a black belt but I think it would be a decent idea to "revert". Black Belt, while very important, is still a learning stage, right? I would not have a problem with wearing a plain black belt with no adornment what so ever.
 

KenpoTess

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Originally posted by Goldendragon7



"Hey! ! ! look at me, the Ultimate Great Grandmaster Super Pu Ba Lord High Mocus Mega High Pinnacle Paramount Awesome Stupendous Solitary Instructor of all that have ever breathed on this planet! [did I get them all in?]:rofl:

Whatdayathink?


Isn't that like 15th Degree title?
:eek:
 
K

KenpoGirl

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Seems to me if all the black belts were a solid black belts the only way you'd know if a person had more knowledge skill than another is by example, ie on the mat.

Otherwise, I would like to think everyone would be peers not superiors. Would be nice anywise. (but then again I tend to be pretty naive)

Dot

:asian:
 

True2Kenpo

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Mr. C,

Good afternoon sir! How are you?

For whatever my two cents is worth, I am not sure if I agree or if I disagree to those that wear their stripes and those that do not.

I feel that if you have earned the rank, one should be able to wear the rank with pride. Some might not agree that the person should be of that rank, but it really comes down to personal choice.

I also respect those that do not wear their rank because they do not feel it is needed. Once a Black belt, always a Black belt. However, as an instructor I think the different ranks of Black belt offer further advancement for those that attain the rank of Black Belt. Many people see this attainment as the end and it truly is only the very beginning.

I feel that Mr. Chapel made a great point that we should first look at the man wearing the belt, their skill and knowledge. But no matter what if they are wearing a Black Belt we must give them the respect. I feel that some people have approached me and feel that I should not wear the rank I have, but in turn they still are very respectful and we must realize that some instructors define ranks in many different ways.

On another note, I do think it is cool to see the stripes and so on. It is a sort of personal style and I think it helps us differentate between certain groups, yet also show our common trends.

So if that made any sense...

Anyway, hope all is well Mr. C and I will be sure to see you the next time I have the opportunity!

Respectfully,
Joshua Ryer
UPK Pittsburgh
 
B

brianhunter

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Originally posted by Goldendragon7

"Hey! ! ! look at me, the Ultimate Great Grandmaster Super Pu Ba Lord High Mocus Mega High Pinnacle Paramount Awesome Stupendous Solitary Instructor of all that have ever breathed on this planet! [did I get them all in?]:rofl:

Whatdayathink?

But would that mean you are still Shonuff?? The shogun of Harlem?
 

tarabos

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Originally posted by Goldendragon7
History may be in process of repeating itself. We might be close to reverting back soon, and wear NO rank on belts

how so?...just out of curiosity. is there a group of seniors heading this up to decide that everyone will remove the stripes from their belts?

i'm all for this...but i'd like to hear some more solid information on what and who is involved in this. is there anything relatively definite....or is this more along the lines of the way you believe things should be Mr. Conaster?
 

kenmpoka

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Originally posted by Goldendragon7
A brief historical review of the EPAK "red stripes" actually reveal that he decided to place the stripes on belts back when the system was in the early stages [Late '60's] to let people see and know that there were advanced ranks developing in Kenpo and to distinguish the new {during that time period} Ed Parker System from others. Many Martial Arts Systems believe that the show of rank on belts {stripes of any kind} or sashes are an arrogant and distasteful public "show off" of authority and not a humble attribute that any black belt should demonstrate.

History may be in process of repeating itself. We might be close to reverting back soon, and wear NO rank on belts or face the embarrassment of public ridicule if you do wear a belt full of red as if to say.......
"Hey! ! ! look at me, the Ultimate Great Grandmaster Super Pu Ba Lord High Mocus Mega High Pinnacle Paramount Awesome Stupendous Solitary Instructor of all that have ever breathed on this planet! [did I get them all in?]:rofl:

Whatdayathink?
Not only they are looked down upon, but they also look cheap an ugly.I vote for getting rid of them. And please don't replace them wih stars.

:asian:
 

John Bishop

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It's not just a American thing. About 15 years ago I was attending a aikido seminar a friend was hosting with a visiting instructor from their Japan headquarters.
While we we visiting after the seminar he asked in broken english what the red stripes on my belt meant. I told him third degree or "Sandan".
I asked what the Kanji embrodered on his belt said. He said one side had his name, and the other side said "Yodan" (4th degree) and his organization's name.
Next time you see a Japanese or Korean instuctor with a embroidered belt, ask them what it says.
I think the red stripe system gives us (Kenpo/Kajukenbo) identity as American arts.
 

Michael Billings

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You can always wear a plain black belt at your discretion. I had several black belts, one embroidered (kanji and name), one with stripes, and one plain. Kanji finally shredded with age and use, gave my plain black to someone I promoted to black, passing it on, and I am stuck with stripes ... no bar ... yet.

Not sure if I like the "bar" to start with, but have no problem with those wearing it or with me wearing one should I earn it. I think I actually prefer stripes to bar and stripes esthetically.

-Michael
 
R

Rob_Broad

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I like the stripes, they can sometimes help discern the 10 year wonders who somehow wear a 5th degree.

I also like the stripes and bars because it distinguishes us from other styles. This is something Master Parkr put in his infintie insights books and is there a direct link to our roots.
 
H

hatamotoyoshi

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we all know the story of getting a white belt and it darkening over the years of training to black.
and the stages in between representing the kyu ranks.
the fraying and lightening up to quasi white again for a master.
before i trained in kenpo when the world was still young,
and the beatles were on ed sullivan, i trained in judo(budokan)
with a japanese instructor, very old school.
all he wore was an old frayed blackbelt, even though he was only 5' tall you knew he was dangerous by how he carried himself.
so when i started kenpo i was shocked at all these crests ,flags,
and belt stripes.
i'm used to it now though and i think it should be up to the individual school.
remember a lot of arts don't like the black uniforms either.
(and i think there sooooo, cool!!)
all the best yoshi
 
OP
Goldendragon7

Goldendragon7

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Originally posted by tarabos
how so?...just out of curiosity. is there a group of seniors heading this up to decide that everyone will remove the stripes from their belts?

i'm all for this...but i'd like to hear some more solid information on what and who is involved in this. is there anything relatively definite....or is this more along the lines of the way you believe things should be Mr. Conaster?

LOL, now this is how rumors get started....... lol.... NO there is no organized "movement" towards the removal of the stripes. No Legitimate Seniors are heading this "thought" up or anything.

This is just an observation or possibility that "could" happen if the situation gets worse. Personally I like the stripes, I feel it is a part of our roots and think the lower ranks aspire to earn the ranks and their designations. I just wish there were more authoritive control and respect for the founder of the darn system and its ranks, so that not just everyone and their brother, sister, aunt, uncle, and close neighbor could just strap on the designations and make it ultra confusing for the lower ranks. The legitimate Senior ranks know "who's who in the zoo and what each is capable of {pro and con} or what contributions they have or continue to have on EPAK".



:asian:
 

jfarnsworth

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Originally posted by Goldendragon7
The legitimate Senior ranks know "who's who in the zoo and what each is capable of {pro and con} or what contributions they have or continue to have on EPAK".

Very good point sir!:asian:
 

tarabos

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Originally posted by Goldendragon7
LOL, now this is how rumors get started....... lol.... NO there is no organized "movement" towards the removal of the stripes. No Legitimate Seniors are heading this "thought" up or anything.

This is just an observation or possibility that "could" happen if the situation gets worse. Personally I like the stripes, I feel it is a part of our roots and think the lower ranks aspire to earn the ranks and their designations. I just wish there were more authoritive control and respect for the founder of the darn system and its ranks, so that not just everyone and their brother, sister, aunt, uncle, and close neighbor could just strap on the designations and make it ultra confusing for the lower ranks. The legitimate Senior ranks know "who's who in the zoo and what each is capable of {pro and con} or what contributions they have or continue to have on EPAK".



:asian:

hey...you could have just gone with me and said "april fools!" :D
 
R

roryneil

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I like the stripes. Even at lower levels it kinda split the belts in half to keep a student motivated.
As for someone deservinga rank or not that, is a personal thing and a character issue largely. Just because some egomaniac my don a 10th and call himself Grandmaser of All Everything, that doesn't mean say a 3rd who worked hard to achieve what he has should not be able to wear his 3 stripes with pride. And my instructor is a 7th and usually wears this one plain black belt when he works out with us.
 
K

Kirk

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So it's still up to the one wearing the belt. But the stripes are
earned (or should be) and should be worn proudly. Just like
earning a degree .. people work hard for them, and once they
do, many display thier degree proudly, in an expensive frame.

Also, if you're a school owner, it's damned good marketing.

What I personally don't care for is the one stripe.
 

Rich Parsons

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Originally posted by Kirk
So it's still up to the one wearing the belt. But the stripes are
earned (or should be) and should be worn proudly. Just like
earning a degree .. people work hard for them, and once they
do, many display thier degree proudly, in an expensive frame.

Also, if you're a school owner, it's damned good marketing.

What I personally don't care for is the one stripe.


Kirk,

Excuse the lack of knowledge in Kenpo.

By the one stripe are you referring to First Degree or
to the large bar for Fifth or an even larger bar for Tenth?

I had thought from previous discussions Tenth was to larger Bars?

Thanks!
:asian:
 

Michael Billings

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Rich,

One 5" red bar for 5th, a half inch, or is it inch separation and another 5' bar for 10th. The permutations between 5th and 10th are a 5" bar and appropriate stripes.

-Michael
 

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