Reverse & Opposite

[Rob_Broad]

I was watching a video tape last nite of SGM Parker teaching a class and he mentioned Reverse & Opposites. I really enjoyed his definition on the 2, I would like to see what other people think.

 

[kenpo3631]

I really enjoyed his definition on the 2

On the 2? Short form 2? I am sooooooooooooo confused:idunno:

 

[Rob_Broad]

For those who need a crayon drawn map to figure out the initial post. I would like to see what you believe the differences are between Reverse and Opposite are in American Kenpo.

 

[kenpo3631]

Crayola I hope...

Just wanted to know what the "2" was....:shrug:


Sometimes I wonder if it is the air up there that make some 10 up and 2 down....

 

[ikenpo]

Originally posted by Rob_Broad

For those who need a crayon drawn map to figure out the initial post. I would like to see what you believe the differences are between Reverse and Opposite are in American Kenpo.

Well,

Based on your response to the other guy I'd say you've killed this good thread with some unnecessary negative energy, but I will say this. One of my favorite aspects of opposites and reverses working together is the double check factor that occurs while blocking from one side to the other. A simple idea that produces amazing results.

jb:asian:

 

[Rob_Broad]

Originally posted by jbkenpo



Well,

Based on your response to the other guy I'd say you've killed this good thread with some unnecessary negative energy, but I will say this. One of my favorite aspects of opposites and reverses working together is the double check factor that occurs while blocking from one side to the other. A simple idea that produces amazing results.

jb:asian:

I response to the other guy was put that way because a simple question was asked and made to seem impossible to understand. To anyone who was offended, I am sorry.

The initial question is what is the difference between Reverse and Opposite. I know where the discussion is going to lead, to double factoring which we will start a proper thread for in a sort while. Would love to see what people think the differences between the Reverse and Opposites are. I had even asked GoldenDragon not to answer yet so some of the less experienced people could take a stab at it. There is a very valuable lesson in here that many people have yet not learned.

 

[kenpo_cory]

Ah yes, opposite and reverse. Well, since I consider myself to be one of the less experienced in kenpo being only a second brown, I'll take a stab at this. I'm going to do this on a very elementary level. Reverse motion by definition would be returning along the same path that was previously traveled. Example: from a horse stance step back with the left foot into a right neutral bow. Reverse of this would be sliding the left foot forward back into a horse stance. Opposite motion is a little more involved and has more choices of motion. Example: step back with the left foot into a right neutral bow. Some of the opposites of this motion would be stepping forward with the left foot into a left neutral bow, (opposite direction) stepping back with the right foot into a left neutral bow, (opposite foot) or stepping forward with the right foot into a right neutral bow, (opposite foot and opposite direction). Opposite and reverse motion gets a lot more involved that the simple explanation I gave.

 

[kenpo3631]

Opposite:

To be situated in pairs on an axis with each member being separated from the other by half the circumference of the axis

Example: Right and Left inward blocks.

Reverse:

Effecting reverse movement

Example: Backhammerfist strike and forward underhand reverse hammerfist strike.

Simple enough?:asian:

 

[Klondike93]

Originally posted by kenpo3631

Opposite:

To be situated in pairs on an axis with each member being separated from the other by half the circumference of the axis

Example: Right and Left inward blocks.

Reverse:

Effecting reverse movement

Example: Backhammerfist strike and forward underhand reverse hammerfist strike.

Simple enough?:asian:

Yes, now a question for you from a kenpo rookie.

What would be the reverse of the Inward blocks and what's the opposite of a back hammerfist strike?

 

[satans.barber]

Originally posted by Klondike93



Yes, now a question for you from a kenpo rookie.

What would be the reverse of the Inward blocks and what's the opposite of a back hammerfist strike?

Reverse of an inwards block is an outwards extended block (think Shielding Hammer), the opposite of a back hammerfist strike is a back hammerfirst strike with the other hand.

Ian.

 

[ikenpo]

Originally posted by satans.barber



Reverse of an inwards block is an outwards extended block (think Shielding Hammer), the opposite of a back hammerfist strike is a back hammerfirst strike with the other hand.

Ian.

Since he wasn't specific here's a thought, what if the inward block wasn't a hammering inward block (as taught to beginners to teach the phonetics of motion), but was a thrusting inward block? Then what would be the reverse motion?

jb:asian:

 

[satans.barber]

Originally posted by jbkenpo



Since he wasn't specific here's a thought, what if the inward block wasn't a hammering inward block (as taught to beginners to teach the phonetics of motion), but was a thrusting inward block? Then what would be the reverse motion?

jb:asian:

Good question!

I suppose you could do a thrusting outwards block, although I can't think of a time where I've ever seen one used.

With an inwards block you cover your center line as you block, with an outwards block you don't, so generally I don't think thrusting one out a long way would be a good idea, it's wasted motion. Better to use the opposite arm with an inwards block.

Maybe this is what Mr. Parker was saying about opposites and reverses in the first place?

Ian.

 

[kenpo_cory]

Originally posted by satans.barber



Reverse of an inwards block is an outwards extended block (think Shielding Hammer), the opposite of a back hammerfist strike is a back hammerfirst strike with the other hand.

Ian.

But there is always more that one opposite. Opposite hand, opposite direction, opposite hand and direction.

 

[kenpo_cory]

Wooooo, Hoooooo! I'm an orange belt now!

 

[kenpo_cory]

Originally posted by jbkenpo



Since he wasn't specific here's a thought, what if the inward block wasn't a hammering inward block (as taught to beginners to teach the phonetics of motion), but was a thrusting inward block? Then what would be the reverse motion?

jb:asian:

Yeah, I don't think I'm familiar with a thrusting inward block. I understood an inward block to start from the outside and diagonally move inward. So would a thrusting inward block be like a punch crossing your body or something? Forgive my ignorance.

 

[ikenpo]

Originally posted by satans.barber



Good question!

I suppose you could do a thrusting outwards block, although I can't think of a time where I've ever seen one used.

With an inwards block you cover your center line as you block, with an outwards block you don't, so generally I don't think thrusting one out a long way would be a good idea, it's wasted motion. Better to use the opposite arm with an inwards block.

Maybe this is what Mr. Parker was saying about opposites and reverses in the first place?

Ian.

When you get your infinite insights books look at vol 3, pg 16..

From a training horse the reverse motion of the thrusting inward would a rear elbow strike.

jb:asian:

 

[kenpo_cory]

Originally posted by jbkenpo



When you get your infinite insights books look at vol 3, pg 16..

From a training horse the reverse motion of the thrusting inward would a rear elbow strike.

jb:asian:

Wouldn't that be a punch you're describing?

 

[ikenpo]

Originally posted by KENPO_CORY



Wouldn't that be a punch you're describing?

It is very similar, but with a punch the hand rotates CCW 180 degrees and ends at the center of the body. With the thrusting inward block the hand rotates CW when I do it (the book says CCW and it can be done that way...a discussion GD7 and I have had in the past) and moves in a straight thrusting motion from the back corner of the box to the front cross corner of the box (if you know what I mean) and ends up where a hammering inward block would.

jb:asian:

 

[kenpo_cory]

Originally posted by jbkenpo



It is very similar, but with a punch the hand rotates CCW 180 degrees and ends at the center of the body. With the thrusting inward block the hand rotates CW when I do it (the book says CCW and it can be done that way...a discussion GD7 and I have had in the past) and moves in a straight thrusting motion from the back corner of the box to the front cross corner of the box (if you know what I mean) and ends up where a hammering inward block would.

jb:asian:

OK, makes since. Thanks

 

[Rob_Broad]

I started this thread to see the diversity of the answers. I have seen some very insightful answers. The definition SGM Parker gave was very simplistic. Reverse is following the same path in the opposite direction. Opposite is the other hand.

I intentionally left the question a little vague but not so vague that nobody had any idea of what was wanted. I wanted to see everyone's interpretations. I also wanted to see how complicated we would make this these 2 simplistic aspects.