qigong for asthma

KempoGuy06

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Ive head that qigong exercises can help with asthma. Is this correct? If so which types? This is for a friend who has asthma that is starting to affect his life a lot more than it used to

B
 

JadecloudAlchemist

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Ive head that qigong exercises can help with asthma. Is this correct? If so which types?

Yes it can help or hinder depending on the teacher and Qigong exercise.

There are certain Qigong exercises that open up the chest and lung channels,disperse Phlegm build up. Also the theories on how Asthma comes about in TCM theory. A TCM doctor may be the best approach because of Herbal treatment such as Ma huang which is found in Ephera(ephedrine) and Needle points such as LU1 which opens up the Lungs and ST36 also Points such as Mbw1a and Mbw1b are also useful. It all depends on what the TCM doctor recommends. Your friend can ask him about Qigong and the TCM doctor may recommend a Qigong exercise or what type to practice with a Qigong teacher.
This is from the piece known as Ba duan jin(8 piece of brocade)
http://www.wushuarts.com/images/Shaolin%20Ba%20Duan%20Jin.jpg%20cropped.jpg
It is called drawling a bow to Shoot a Hawk/vulture
It does help to open up the Lungs at least how I practice and teach it.

The Yoga pose known as Cobra also can help open up the Lungs. Dr. Maoshing Ni performs his expanding the chest and on the thumb and index finger in realtions to the Lung channel among his own method of circulation.

http://www.divavillage.com/images/Oct05/cobra_step3_megan307.jpg
 

tellner

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Maybe. I've been very disappointed with the crap that passes for "scientific investigation" of some of these traditional practices. From Randi debunking the Chinese Qi Gong experiments to the evidence that acunpuncture is indistinguishable from the placebo effect in pain reduction science has not been kind to tradition. On the other hand, breath control and mild exercise certainly can't hurt.

You might be better off going to Gambia and running barefoot through the privies. There's evidence that hookworm may protect against asthma.
 

JadecloudAlchemist

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Randi debunked a Charlatan posing as a Qigong master. I have yet to find any Qigong teachers,or writings speaking about acts like this.

I do however find what would be considered religious(immortality,magic and so on) But that requires some sense of belief and has no grounds in science.

Acupuncture studies dismissing it I have yet to see what actual points were being used. So hopefully better studies do come out explaining which points are used so we can see why it does or does not work.

I think questioning Qigong and Chinese medicine is healthy. I also think from the beginning to now there has been a lot of changes and a more complete system with a more scientific approach then before. I think as the future unfolds Qigong,and Chinese medicine will use and adapt even more into western science and medicine.
 
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Xue Sheng

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Maybe. I've been very disappointed with the crap that passes for "scientific investigation" of some of these traditional practices. From Randi debunking the Chinese Qi Gong experiments to the evidence that acunpuncture is indistinguishable from the placebo effect in pain reduction science has not been kind to tradition. On the other hand, breath control and mild exercise certainly can't hurt.

You might be better off going to Gambia and running barefoot through the privies. There's evidence that hookworm may protect against asthma.

My wife saw that about acupuncture and thought it was pretty funny because we all know how backwards and gullible the Chinese are :rolleyes: . You believe whom ever you want to believe I will not argue the point any longer with anyone. All I know is that an awful lot of MDs refer their patients to her and other want her to come work in their office.
 

tellner

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What I'd say is "provide the evidence". The plural of "anecdote" is not "data". If you don't like the results of the acupuncture study come up with a better one. If you want anyone with a functioning brain to take claims about the miraculous effects of qigong seriously then be prepared to back them up in a systematic fashion.

Crying racism is an attempt to divert attention from the substantive criticism by attacking the character of the questioner. Plenty of Western pseudo-science and superstition like Homeopathy, iridology, classic Chiropractic, polarity therapy, directed communication and craniosacral have been debunked. I do not hear Xue Sheng condemning the skeptics' anti-White racism for implying that Europeans and Americans are gullible.

The hookworm therapy at least has some preliminary substantiation and a theoretical basis. Qigong and acupuncture could use a healthy dose of the first. As for the second, good theory has to explain what is observed without contradicting the known facts. I can think of at least a areas where TCM theory falls flat on its face. Consider the spleen. It is absolutely not the governing organ the Classics declare it to be. It can be completely removed without causing the patient to suffer any of the supposed ill-effects that the theory would predict.

Get better data. Fix your theories. Stop using appeals to jingoistic ethnic pride as a substitute for good science. Then we can take start talking seriously.
 

Xue Sheng

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What I'd say is "provide the evidence". The plural of "anecdote" is not "data". If you don't like the results of the acupuncture study come up with a better one. If you want anyone with a functioning brain to take claims about the miraculous effects of qigong seriously then be prepared to back them up in a systematic fashion.

Crying racism is an attempt to divert attention from the substantive criticism by attacking the character of the questioner. Plenty of Western pseudo-science and superstition like Homeopathy, iridology, classic Chiropractic, polarity therapy, directed communication and craniosacral have been debunked. I do not hear Xue Sheng condemning the skeptics' anti-White racism for implying that Europeans and Americans are gullible.

The hookworm therapy at least has some preliminary substantiation and a theoretical basis. Qigong and acupuncture could use a healthy dose of the first. As for the second, good theory has to explain what is observed without contradicting the known facts. I can think of at least a areas where TCM theory falls flat on its face. Consider the spleen. It is absolutely not the governing organ the Classics declare it to be. It can be completely removed without causing the patient to suffer any of the supposed ill-effects that the theory would predict.

Get better data. Fix your theories. Stop using appeals to jingoistic ethnic pride as a substitute for good science. Then we can take start talking seriously.


and what part of

You believe whom ever you want to believe I will not argue the point any longer with anyone.

did you not understand


Get better data. Fix your theories. Stop using appeals to jingoistic ethnic pride as a substitute for good science. Then we can take start talking seriously.

you are of course assuming I take any of this or you seriously
 

JadecloudAlchemist

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If you don't like the results of the acupuncture study come up with a better one. If you want anyone with a functioning brain to take claims about the miraculous effects of qigong seriously then be prepared to back them up in a systematic fashion.
To be fair there are studies with acupuncture that state debunk the study but to be fair I would like them to present the points as well. You can see that any study present as evidence which does not speak wholly about what is being done can not possibly be considered a good example of a study either proving or disproving. I don't find Qigong to be miraculous anymore than someone who follows a healthy diet prevents health problems.

Consider the spleen. It is absolutely not the governing organ the Classics declare it to be.
In its realtionship to TCM it makes sense. To be fair every organ is important. Divided between Fu and Zhang organs we find the Spleen and its counterpart organ the stomach. IMO the spleen may have been chosen to fit the 5 element theory and possible the Chinese may have deemed it responsible for digestive in its Yin charactistic as the stomach is the Yang charactistic for digestive.
So it is not that the Spleen is this governing important organ but as a Yin component and its counter part the Yang stomach that helps make digestive complete harmony that IMO is what is being presented.

It can be completely removed without causing the patient to suffer any of the supposed ill-effects that the theory would predict.
The theory goes that the Spleen's energy still circulates. The Spleen is IMO an important organ as far as Immune support goes though you can live without one I think the immune system suffers over rall.

Also I do not know what theory you are speaking about as far as ill effects so maybe you can provide which text you are refering to.
Get better data. Fix your theories. Stop using appeals to jingoistic ethnic pride as a substitute for good science. Then we can take start talking seriously.
Well Acupuncture and Qigong have been around since 325 B.C. and has worked find in China all these years.
I always wonder why does TCM and Qigong have to try to fit Western medicine or science mold? What makes it so elite as the be all end all to all theories in other cultures?


Removing of the Spleen has been may be linked to diabetes
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/09/health/09diab.html?_r=1&pagewanted=print&position=
 
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