Pole Form

[MacPedro]

I am, it has been remarked, cheap. Stingy Aberdonian cheap.

I recently bought a pack of 5 bamboo canes of 9' length from a garden supplier. Around £30.
They're far too light for Dragon Poles. The thick end is about 1.5" going to 3/4" at the thin end. If you use it in reverse, holding the thin end of the taper, it can emulate the energies and bounces of a real/heavier pole. *


I'm significantly more aware of the movements required from the hip, when playing with it or is the hip doing this all itself? The movements are exagerated to get the amplified weight of the end of the pole to shift in accordance with desire. Is this correct? Am I imagining this or is this how it's suppossed to feel?


I read on Gary Lam's site that it is good for the development of internal power.


http://www.garylamwingchun.com/index.php?view=article&catid=34%3Aarticles&id=74%3Awing-chun-dragon-pole-training-got-power-by-daniel-oneill&option=com_content&Itemid=113


I went a stage further and inserted big batteries for extra weight. I sealed them in with a bung of candle wax 3/4" thick. I don't want to be breaking neighbourhood windows


The same article refers to 'Fighting Mind' an expression of Sifu Lams. I wonder if it's a greater understanding of timing. Much of pole practice is visualising* the connection with an opponant as they close on you. Or you on them. The centre of percussion on a nine foot pole doesn't travel instantly along it's length. Is it intrinsic to learning the pole form that you're open to having combat timing programmed into you?

Just throwing these blind fumblings out there for discussion,

Happy New Year Aa'biddy,
Pedro


*it needs to be born in mind that Pedro has never held this type of martial equipment.....but he does think they're really cool

 

[WingChunIan]

for me the primary purpose of the pole is to develop precise control of your movements.What appears precise in the empty hand forms is shown up when repeated using the knives. Someone who looks exemplary using the knives suddenly looks wobbly when asked to move their position with speed, force and accuracy such that the tip of a pole 8-9 ft away moves by exactly the right amount, in exactly the right direction between exactly the right start and end points.
At the same time a secondary purpose is to project energy along the weapon. The knives are made to hum, so too should the pole vibrate at the tip. For the more esoteric, the internal arts almost all use weapons as a form of weight training for internal energy development so there is no reason to believe that the wing chun weapons are any different.

 

[Domino]

I agree the pole form can help with timing but for me it helps strengthen my wrists and arms, like rocks.

 

[wushuguy]

Pole training is great for teaching the body to act in unison. It is more obvious if one isn't physically strong, as myself, because to get the movement of the pole and because of the weight, one has to unify the motions of the pole, stance, energy, in order to get the technique right. If everything isn't right, the pole "owns" the person and it is quite obvious. Anyways, it's one of the best helps to develop powerful empty hand techniques, not to mention good weapon skill.

In empty hand and with lighter weapons, perhaps not as much body movement is needed to effect the energy transfer into the weapon, but with heavier weapon, definitely need to know and feel how the transfer must change. This in effect helps to understand fighting opponents with superior strength and even technique. Rules/principles bend a bit to match the environment.

On my pole, i added the words "Yao Ma Yi Zhi" which means "waist, stance, unified", just to decorate it and remind me what I'm training.

 

[WingChunIan]

as an exercise in addition to the form try getting a a table tennis ball or something of similar size, thread it onto a piece of string and hang it in the air at chin height. Stand side on to it about 8 ft away and try to hit it with the straight thrust from the form. It sounds really easy but it's frustrating as hell.

 

[mook jong man]

Be careful with the Pole , unless you've put in a few years doing Bil Gee there's a good chance you may strain your back.

Best to stick with the preparation exercises like "Chair Gwun" for a few years.

People who try to handle the knives or pole in real combat without having a solid base of years of training behind them will not have the resistance to deflect a heavy strike and will simply have the weapons knocked out of their hands.

There's a good reason that they are usually at the end of the curriculum in most lineages because you need a solid stance and damn strong wrists to hold on to the buggers when deflecting heavy strikes .

 

[bully]

Whats chair gwun MJM?

 

[mook jong man]

Whats chair gwun MJM?

Basically it's just an exercise where you go into a low horse stance and practice taking several steps to the side as you thrust out a punch to the side in time with step.

It basically mimics the action of thrusting the pole as you step , but without actually holding the pole , I guarantee your legs will be screaming after a few minutes of doing that.

It lays the foundation in strengthening the legs for when you start the pole training proper.

 

[bully]

Basically it's just an exercise where you go into a low horse stance and practice taking several steps to the side as you thrust out a punch to the side in time with step.

It basically mimics the action of thrusting the pole as you step , but without actually holding the pole , I guarantee your legs will be screaming after a few minutes of doing that.

It lays the foundation in strengthening the legs for when you start the pole training proper.

Cheers, I think I get what you mean. Always good to have more exercises to practice.

 

[mook jong man]

Cheers, I think I get what you mean. Always good to have more exercises to practice.

I could go into more detail but it's probably just easier to tell you to get the pole , go into a low horse stance and start thrusting the pole forwards from the normal side on position.

Make sure you time the thrust of the pole with the step of your front foot and time the retraction of the pole with the dragging up of your back foot.

Go up and down your hallway like that until your quads give out or your missus tells you stop being a silly bugger and come and watch "Neighbours" with her.

 

[yak sao]

Another good reason to practice the punches from the horse as MJM described, is it teaches you the trajectory of the pole when thrusted out.
And when you do use the pole, instead of thinking about this long pole in your hands, focus on the punching motion ( obviously though, with the pole, both hands are now going out) and you will find the pole much easier to manipulate.

Similar to empty hand, how you focus on the elbow instaed of the fist when punching.

 

[WCman1976]

as an exercise in addition to the form try getting a a table tennis ball or something of similar size, thread it onto a piece of string and hang it in the air at chin height. Stand side on to it about 8 ft away and try to hit it with the straight thrust from the form. It sounds really easy but it's frustrating as hell.

They did something similiar to this in a kung fu flick called WARRIORS 2. It looks like something that can get irritating very fast! At any rate, one thing I love about the pole form is the low stance training.

 

[Twin Fist]

thats how we practiced point control and thrusting accuracy in fencing, on the tennis ball

 

[mook jong man]

In training with my guys I get them to use a five foot staff , because it's most applicable to the length of a broom or mop etc.

I then get a bit of that foam pool noodle that kids use in swimming I cut a length off that and jam pack half the centre of it with small chunks of pool noodle and then tape the top of it with duct tape , make sure you've got a good buffer zone of pool noodle chunks in there to absorb the force from the tip of the pole .

I then shove the bit of pool noodle over the top of the pole which fits on perfectly and then I put a small square of duct tape on the focus mitt as a target .

Then I move around flashing the focus mitt at various heights and they can hit it as hard as they want without damaging the focus mitt , they can also use it on the kicking shield , makes the whole thing a bit more dynamic.

It just gives them more of a feeling of hitting a heavier object and being able to transfer their mass through the pole and into the object.
Makes it a little bit safer all round too when you got someone thrusting a pole about who might not be all that accurate in their shots.