Other Martial Art Teaching Taekwondo

[kiwi]

Is it a big deal if another martial artist (karate, tangsoodo, etc) starts teaching at a taekwondo school? Is there a grace period in order for them to learn new forms, holding pads, etc?

 

[dvcochran]

Is it a big deal if another martial artist (karate, tangsoodo, etc) starts teaching at a taekwondo school? Is there a grace period in order for them to learn new forms, holding pads, etc?

Are you saying a completely new school/system/instructor is now using the same physical location that a former TKD school used or that a TKD school and another style are sharing the same location?

Neither is unheard of and the latter is not uncommon. Sometimes the overhead and profit margins of a brick & mortar location force some creative companions just to stay out of the red. Especially when first starting up.
Most long time Martial Artists agree it is more about the quality of the instructor and the location than the style.

 

[kiwi]

No, an instructor who doesn’t have a taekwondo background or black belt in taekwondo teaching taekwondo. Black belt in another martial art.

 

[mrt2]

No, an instructor who doesn’t have a taekwondo background or black belt in taekwondo teaching taekwondo. Black belt in another martial art.

I don't understand how someone trained in another martial art can be teaching Tae Kwon Do. How can he teach something he doesn't know? It makes no sense to me.

 

[kiwi]

I don't understand how someone trained in another martial art can be teaching Tae Kwon Do. How can he teach something he doesn't know? It makes no sense to me.

I was wondering if this is common or I’m just being picky! I didn’t know if some were closely related that I was unaware like tangsoodo.

 

[mrt2]

I was wondering if this is common or I’m just being picky! I didn’t know if some were closely related that I was unaware like tangsoodo.

Tang Soo Do is pretty close to Tae Kwon Do, and I could see a practitioner in that, or another art advancing quickly through the ranks, possibly even starting at an advanced belt (red belt, or brown belt?) and eventually teaching, but not just walking in not knowing anything about TKD.

 

[Christopher Adamchek]

Tang Soo Do is pretty close to Tae Kwon Do, and I could see a practitioner in that, or another art advancing quickly through the ranks, possibly even starting at an advanced belt (red belt, or brown belt?) and eventually teaching, but not just walking in not knowing anything about TKD.

pretty much but at the same time there is so much overlap that they could teach on techniques, punches, kicks, stances, dynamics and fight strategies

 

[pdg]

pretty much but at the same time there is so much overlap that they could teach on techniques, punches, kicks, stances, dynamics and fight strategies

Is there so much overlap though?

We've had a 1st kup kkw tkd person come to our ITF school before.

Some techniques (punches, kicks and blocks) they knew were superficially similar, but the stances, transitions, dynamics and strategies (especially sparring) were so different that it negated most of the similarities.

That didn't make their insights useless (at least not to those of us who were willing to use them), but it did mean that them teaching (irrespective of rank) just wouldn't be compatible with the syllabus - unless they effectively started over.


And that's between two arts with almost the same name and a partially intertwined history...

 

[dvcochran]

No, an instructor who doesn’t have a taekwondo background or black belt in taekwondo teaching taekwondo. Black belt in another martial art.

That fact that they are being forthright about it is a positive, meaning they seem to be honest. But there are areas where many 'holes' could surface.
First, if you have ZERO interest in style, lineage, history, competing under certain circumstances, certification integrity, transferal of skills if you ever change schools …, the list can go on, then it may not matter at all. I would liken this to the guy teaching out of his basement because he loves teaching but doesn't have the time or resources to open up a commercial location. In other words: not for profit. There is absolutely nothing wrong with this as long as a false bill of goods are claimed and expectations are managed.
In the typical traditional MA setting style/lineage/history are intertwined and overt by nature. You will just learn it by attrition. If say you take classes from this non BB in TKD who is teaching TKD I would expect much of this information would be lacking or at the very least have no lineage to back up any claims made.
If you wish to get into higher levels of competing than just the tourneys in you local town, sanctioning often becomes a problem and limits your opportunities.

 

[dvcochran]

Tang Soo Do is pretty close to Tae Kwon Do, and I could see a practitioner in that, or another art advancing quickly through the ranks, possibly even starting at an advanced belt (red belt, or brown belt?) and eventually teaching, but not just walking in not knowing anything about TKD.

TSD is very similar to Moo Duk Kwan TKD. But not so much for WT or ITF TKD. If you were a low Gup rank who was rooted in WT, the TSD and ITF stances would be awkward for a while, for example.
Still, the benefits of having worked out in a MA would help make the transition. I think it has as much to do with the persons willingness to 'start over' on a few things.

 

[Flying Crane]

It would be weird if the owner/head instructor claimed to be teaching a system in which he has no background. Blatantly fraudulent if he opened a school and put up a sign and advertising making such claims.

It would not be weird if someone joined the teaching staff and taught skills from another system that blend or cross over well into the main system, as kind of a supplementary program. And I would expect the school to be transparent about it. But the primary system that the school claims to teach is still taught by those with that background.

 

[skribs]

Is there so much overlap though?

We've had a 1st kup kkw tkd person come to our ITF school before.

Some techniques (punches, kicks and blocks) they knew were superficially similar, but the stances, transitions, dynamics and strategies (especially sparring) were so different that it negated most of the similarities.

That didn't make their insights useless (at least not to those of us who were willing to use them), but it did mean that them teaching (irrespective of rank) just wouldn't be compatible with the syllabus - unless they effectively started over.


And that's between two arts with almost the same name and a partially intertwined history...

The thing is, you'll find the same problem going from one KKW school to another.

For example, my first school put a huge emphasis on stances and learning the correct foundation from the get-go, where my current school the strategy is to "learn by doing" and for students to just get used to the stances over time. Another difference is a lot of schools drill the spin-hook kick with placing your foot forward after the kick, we drill to spin all the way back around.

 

[skribs]

Is it a big deal if another martial artist (karate, tangsoodo, etc) starts teaching at a taekwondo school? Is there a grace period in order for them to learn new forms, holding pads, etc?

Teaching Taekwondo, or "Taekwondo" is one of the search terms that gets you to their website? There's a difference between claiming to teach something you don't know, vs. optimizing web searches.

 

[pdg]

The thing is, you'll find the same problem going from one KKW school to another.

For example, my first school put a huge emphasis on stances and learning the correct foundation from the get-go, where my current school the strategy is to "learn by doing" and for students to just get used to the stances over time. Another difference is a lot of schools drill the spin-hook kick with placing your foot forward after the kick, we drill to spin all the way back around.

It was a bit more than just a different focus though.

From what I've seen, the ITF stances are wider, longer and lower than those in kkw, even with the same name.

For instance, an image search for "walking stance" gives me:

Which to us is more like "standing around not taking any notice stance". At a push, it's almost a vertical stance, sort of.

And:

Which is a "correct" walking stance - for us.


If I went into a kkw school and started teaching a walking stance as in the second pic?

 

[skribs]

It was a bit more than just a different focus though.

From what I've seen, the ITF stances are wider, longer and lower than those in kkw, even with the same name.

For instance, an image search for "walking stance" gives me:

View attachment 22620

Which to us is more like "standing around not taking any notice stance". At a push, it's almost a vertical stance, sort of.

And:

View attachment 22621

Which is a "correct" walking stance - for us.


If I went into a kkw school and started teaching a walking stance as in the second pic?

Do you have a "front stance"? Your walking stance looks like our front stance, except our knee would be more bent.

Personally, I'm not particularly fond of the amount of high walking stances in the Taegeuks. I much prefer the deeper stances of the Palgwe forms.

 

[pdg]

Do you have a "front stance"? Your walking stance looks like our front stance, except our knee would be more bent.

Not that I recall or am aware of.

There is a low stance, which is like the walking stance shown but one foot length longer.

 

[skribs]

Not that I recall or am aware of.

There is a low stance, which is like the walking stance shown but one foot length longer.

So then instead of a technical difference, I think we're more talking about a difference of vocabulary.

Still, it's along with what I was saying - different schools do things differently. At my old school we had separate names for axe kick and crescent kick. At my school, they're both called "axe kick". Neither school is wrong.

 

[pdg]

So then instead of a technical difference, I think we're more talking about a difference of vocabulary.

Still, it's along with what I was saying - different schools do things differently. At my old school we had separate names for axe kick and crescent kick. At my school, they're both called "axe kick". Neither school is wrong.

Wasn't saying that either was wrong in themselves.

More that an instructor from one would be 'locally' wrong more often than not at the other.

 

[skribs]

Wasn't saying that either was wrong in themselves.

More that an instructor from one would be 'locally' wrong more often than not at the other.

Which is part of why I think most instructors are from in-house. If you go to another school, you have to learn their stuff first.

It's probably less of a deal in sport-focused arts.

 

[pdg]

Which is part of why I think most instructors are from in-house. If you go to another school, you have to learn their stuff first.

It's probably less of a deal in sport-focused arts.

I don't know how it works in kkw schools tbh.

Within 'our' ITF group, it should be possible to move between individual schools and have the same requirements and structure - essentially the same sort of classes and teaching, more or less.

One of the students recently went on holiday to literally the other side of the world - he found an ITF school and attended a few times and he said he slotted right in, there were very few differences and nothing significant at all.

Conversely, he has also attended a kkw school in the past and it was the similarities that were few and insignificant.


I'd like sometime to put this in a personal perspective - there's a kkw school not all that far from me. Possibly some time next year I'm considering arranging a visit.