Ontario prostitution laws could be lifted Saturday

[Scott T]

Date: Monday Nov. 22, 2010 12:31 PM ET

Lawyers for the federal government said that Canada is on the brink of launching an "unprecedented" social experiment if three key prostitution laws are lifted this Saturday.
The government is appearing in the Ontario Court of Justice on Monday to seek a delay in the end of those laws.

If the Ontario Court of Appeal does not agree to give the government more time to consider an appeal, it could mean the end for a number of laws that effectively criminalized prostitution.
A September ruling by the Ontario Superior Court of Justice struck down laws against keeping a common bawdy house, communicating for the purposes of prostitution and living on the avails of the trade.

The government is requesting a stay until a proper appeal can be heard.
Michael Morris, a lawyer for the federal government, said if a stay isn't granted Saturday, it will

be the start of a "social experiment unprecedented in this country."

Prostitution is not illegal in Canada, but nearly everything related to it is.

Lawyers who fought for the end of those laws said the adjustment would mean safer conditions for sex-trade workers.

In a 131-page ruling released in September, Justice Susan Himel determined the laws created a dangerous environment for sex-trade workers.
"I find that the danger faced by prostitutes greatly outweighs any harm which may be faced by the public," she wrote.

The struck-down provisions deal with adult prostitution. Prostitution laws dealing with those under the age of 18 remain unaffected.

Dominatrix Terri-Jean Bedford had originally asked the court to rule on the Criminal Code laws relating to prostitution and called the decision to strike the laws down "emancipation day" for sex-trade workers.

The government argued that prostitution is inherently dangerous, no matter where it is carried out. It has also argued that striking down the laws would make Canada a sex tourism destination.

Now employees of the TSA will have a place to go for thier vacations.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Road trip.

 

[CoryKS]

Road trip.

The argument in the final sentence has been proven. With a quickness.

 

[Scott T]

the argument in the final sentence has been proven. With a quickness.

rofl!

 

[crushing]

Road trip.

Detroit area people have been depressed lately, but now they see the red light at the end of the Windsor Tunnel. Gotta spend those brand new GM profits somewhere!

 

[oaktree]

Great way to make some extra money for the holidays. I am just saying

 

[Bruno@MT]

Generally, when prostitution is legal, the women are much better protected and work in a much safer environment. Their job will become more respectable and comes out of the criminal influence sphere. And they'll pay taxes. And because it is legal, prices will go down due to increased competition (which is good for clients).

Everybody wins.

 

[CoryKS]

Generally, when prostitution is legal, the women are much better protected and work in a much safer environment. Their job will become more respectable and comes out of the criminal influence sphere. And they'll pay taxes. And because it is legal, prices will go down due to increased competition (which is good for clients).

Everybody wins.

Everybody except non-professional women, that is. If men have an low-cost alternative that doesn't involve going to jail, I think you will see some pretty major changes in the social dynamic. Just sayin'.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

In all honesty, my wife won't let me go. Said something about divorce, carving my heart out, and removing a few other parts too. So, I'll have to just stick to taking pictures.

As to the TSA...well, some of them aren't eligible to enter Canada...those criminal records n all that.

As to the idea of legalizing prostitution, I'm all for it. As Carlin said, selling is legal, and ****ing is legal, so why isn't selling ****ing legal.

 

[Ken Morgan]

In all honesty, my wife won't let me go. Said something about divorce, carving my heart out, and removing a few other parts too. So, I'll have to just stick to taking pictures.

Bob....you did say you where coming up here one weekend to photograph our iaido practice.....right...?

 

[Scott T]

In all honesty, my wife won't let me go. Said something about divorce, carving my heart out, and removing a few other parts too. So, I'll have to just stick to taking pictures.

Removal of heart: check
Other parts removed: check
Divorce: Overkill?

:mst:

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Bob....you did say you where coming up here one weekend to photograph our iaido practice.....right...?

Yep. Have an issue with my car finance company...seems they have a thing about taking my car out of NY without their permission. Trying to figure that stupidity out. Then I'll be setting things up. Have a project I'll need to talk to you about too once I get my alibi, I mean car issue straight.

 

[Blade96]

Honestly I don't see why people here are making jokes about an activity that exploits women and children. (well maybe I do. Most of the people in this thread making the jokes are men. Surprise.) If it is legalized you'll see a whole lot more of that. Most people do not choose a job like that they take it cause they are out of options. I had a debate with Evil Sandan over it a bunch of times. He had used escort service and yes he was married when he did it so he cheated on his wife, and he was making justifications for it and said No it isnt any exploitation going on. He said he even talked about it with some of them and the women had jobs, he said they didnt have to do this. I said 'Ok, how much money was they makin at these other jobs?' He said 'Crap wages' He said University students do this,and I said yeah but they prey on the students who need money to pay off tuition and they cant do it with the wages at their other jobs. I said Nuff said. I rest my case. But the stupid four letter C word still didnt get it. (and probably didnt want to, having used it himself of course he wouldnt wanna see anything wrong in it)

 

[Bruno@MT]

If prostitution is out of the criminal environment, it will become a job much like any other massage therapist. In many European countries it is perfectly legal, and you don't see more abuse or exploitation.

And -perhaps- this is the only way for some women to make real money.
However, that is their job. If I end up without a job, my job options would include different jobs, ranging from burger flipper to gay prostitute. The choice would be mine and mine alone. If I voluntarily choose for the high pay, then noone should feel guilty about that.

Similarly, those women are not facing a choice that others aren't facing either. They choose that job, others won't. The only problems that are actual problems are caused by the criminality of prostitution. Change that and you stop the exploitation as much as possible.

I really invite you to look at countries where it is legal before jumping to conclusions.
Personally I think any single man should be able to visit a prostitue if he so likes. It's called consenting adults, and really no different from a guy 'buying' a girlfriend with gifts, like hugh heffner or the late husband of the late Anna Nicole Smith.

And yes, I am a male.
And I think having sex for pay is really no different from getting a back massage for pay.
Infidelity is morally wrong inasmuch as it is the breaking of a vow you made, but plenty of single men use the services of a prostitute.

 

[Ken Morgan]

If prostitution is out of the criminal environment, it will become a job much like any other massage therapist. In many European countries it is perfectly legal, and you don't see more abuse or exploitation.

And -perhaps- this is the only way for some women to make real money.
However, that is their job. If I end up without a job, my job options would include different jobs, ranging from burger flipper to gay prostitute. The choice would be mine and mine alone. If I voluntarily choose for the high pay, then noone should feel guilty about that.

Similarly, those women are not facing a choice that others aren't facing either. They choose that job, others won't. The only problems that are actual problems are caused by the criminality of prostitution. Change that and you stop the exploitation as much as possible.

I really invite you to look at countries where it is legal before jumping to conclusions.
Personally I think any single man should be able to visit a prostitue if he so likes. It's called consenting adults, and really no different from a guy 'buying' a girlfriend with gifts, like hugh heffner or the late husband of the late Anna Nicole Smith.

And yes, I am a male.
And I think having sex for pay is really no different from getting a back massage for pay.
Infidelity is morally wrong inasmuch as it is the breaking of a vow you made, but plenty of single men use the services of a prostitute.

Agreed.

You should not have the Crown interfere in what an individual wants to do with their lives, provided that action does not harm themselves or other. Marriage, gay marriage, polygamy, and prostitution are all contracts between consenting adults. Again that is always the big word with all of them, “CONSENTING”. There can be no coercion or it is not a valid contract, people need to be there of their own free will, be of age and the proper mental capacity to give that consent.

Don’t kid yourself men and women both use escort services.

The issue with polygamy and prostitution is exploitation. That of course is wrong and the people who force anyone, to do anything against their own free will should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

 

[jks9199]

Yep. Have an issue with my car finance company...seems they have a thing about taking my car out of NY without their permission. Trying to figure that stupidity out. Then I'll be setting things up. Have a project I'll need to talk to you about too once I get my alibi, I mean car issue straight.

Off topic -- but what the hell? You leasing or buying?

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Off topic -- but what the hell? You leasing or buying?

Buying. Its an interesting clause I'm trying to get them to explain to me. Course, I've already been to GA and back but there's no BP or customs on that route yet.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Honestly I don't see why people here are making jokes about an activity that exploits women and children. (well maybe I do. Most of the people in this thread making the jokes are men. Surprise.) If it is legalized you'll see a whole lot more of that. Most people do not choose a job like that they take it cause they are out of options. I had a debate with Evil Sandan over it a bunch of times. He had used escort service and yes he was married when he did it so he cheated on his wife, and he was making justifications for it and said No it isnt any exploitation going on. He said he even talked about it with some of them and the women had jobs, he said they didnt have to do this. I said 'Ok, how much money was they makin at these other jobs?' He said 'Crap wages' He said University students do this,and I said yeah but they prey on the students who need money to pay off tuition and they cant do it with the wages at their other jobs. I said Nuff said. I rest my case. But the stupid four letter C word still didnt get it. (and probably didnt want to, having used it himself of course he wouldnt wanna see anything wrong in it)

I've talked to a few escorts. All of them said the same thing, this is their choice, the money is a lot better than what they could make flipping a burger and they were picky over who they saw. (Note, I've never used a service professional's services and most likely never will. These were also models/dancers who I talked with at meets).

Some of them do it because they are forced into it. Sex slavery is still big business. I have issues with that.
Some of them do it to feed drug habits. Again, I have issues with that.
Some do it because they like the job. I don't have any issues with that.

I fully support legalizing it, regulating it, and making it safer. Tax revenues would increase as well as safety for both parties. For example, I believe that in Nevada the brothel workers must be tested for STD's regularly. The average streetwalker is never tested.

I'd be interested in data about such things from areas where it is currently legal.

 

[jks9199]

Most financing agreements I've read require you to maintain the car in good condition, and the like. And I've seen lease agreements limit travel outside certain areas, and most rental agreements limit travel as well as drivers... but I've never noted a limit in loan agreement like that.

 

[Bruno@MT]

I fully support legalizing it, regulating it, and making it safer. Tax revenues would increase as well as safety for both parties. For example, I believe that in Nevada the brothel workers must be tested for STD's regularly. The average streetwalker is never tested.

I'd be interested in data about such things from areas where it is currently legal.

There is a reality series about the brothels in pahrump.
From what I saw, the girls are safe, get to decide what they want and don't want to do, regularly see the doc, get benefits, etc...

And each and every one of them has voluntarly chosen that profession. Most of them do it for the money, in a context where they are respected and protected. And some of them just enjoy sex. There was one girl who said that she had en enormous sex drive. By doing this, she was doing something she enjoys and would be doing anyway, and getting paid big bucks for it.

In Belgium it is not abnormal to see street side brothels. Noone seems to mind.
I have also heard that it lowers sex related crimes but I have no immediate data to back that up. I'll see what I can find.

The general concensus here is that it is not immoral to visit a prostitute, and that they should be treated with the respect due any other working person. Most women would not choose to do it, but have absolutely no issues with others who do. I would lie if I said I'd would not mind having my daughters end up in that profession. But if they should do so out of choice instead of necessity, in a way that is not unsafe, then I think there are worse things than that.