Marshal shoots passenger Miami airport

[Ping898]

Some idiot is trying to screw it up for the rest of us, just in time for the holidays..... It is a breaking story but apparently some guy claimed he had bombs and was shot and killed in the jetway going to a plane...

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/12/07/airplane.gunshot/index.html

"A federal official told CNN that the passenger was shot by a federal air marshal, who felt the passenger was acting in a threatening manner. A senior administration official added that the passenger claimed to have a bomb in his carry-on luggage.

An air marshal told the passenger to stop, and he did not, the official said, adding that the marshal fired after the passenger reached into his carry-on bag."

 

[michaeledward]

Certainly, TSA does not have a sense of humor. Federal Air Marshalls should not have a sense of humor.

Making statements about having a bomb on a plane should be considered a request to get shot.

It is odd that the reports of the person having a bomb are coming from "senior administration officials".

A federal official told CNN that the passenger was shot by a federal air marshal, who felt the passenger was acting in a threatening manner. A senior administration official added that the passenger claimed to have a bomb in his carry-on luggage.

This story will bear watching as it unfolds.

 

[Tgace]

So far it sounds like a "good shoot" to me. Although the article says wounded, not killed. Im awaiting the 3-ring circus thats sure to follow however. I can only hope that the guy was some "average middle class white guy". Because there always seems to be some racial issues in these sort of things lately. The Brazilian guy in London being forefront in my mind....

 

[Kreth]

I find it odd that the article doesn't mention whether he did in fact have anything in his carry-on that would be considered an explosive device. And, this is just a guess, but I'm guessing that the "senior administration official" refers to the Federal Aviation Administration. Sorry, conspiracy theorists...

 

[Ping898]

Certainly, TSA does not have a sense of humor. Federal Air Marshalls should not have a sense of humor.

Making statements about having a bomb on a plane should be considered a request to get shot.

I agree, but I think there has to be another way to protect everyone in the instances when someone is mentally unstable and making false claims. I don't know what they way is, but I have to think there is another solution out there that can disable someone without killing them....
Based on the evidence reported so far it sounds like the air marshalls did what they were trained to.....hopefully further evidence will support what they did and this won't be a huge mistake

 

[Tgace]

I find it odd that the article doesn't mention whether he did in fact have anything in his carry-on that would be considered an explosive device.

Wouldnt really matter as long as the Marshal reasonably believed the guy was a threat.

 

[Ping898]

I find it odd that the article doesn't mention whether he did in fact have anything in his carry-on that would be considered an explosive device.

I don't think they know yet....still a breaking story....

 

[Tgace]

I agree, but I think there has to be another way to protect everyone in the instances when someone is mentally unstable and making false claims. I don't know what they way is, but I have to think there is another solution out there that can disable someone without killing them....
Based on the evidence reported so far it sounds like the air marshalls did what they were trained to.....hopefully further evidence will support what they did and this won't be a huge mistake

The guy said he had a BOMB not a knife. Do you recommend we wait for the BOOM! To see if its legit? If the guy says hes has a bomb does he really have to have one for the Marshals actions to be justified in your opinion?

 

[arnisador]

I wonder if we'll learn that the individual had mental problems. I can't question the decision to shoot, based on a man who claimed to have a bomb reaching into a bag; but, would a person who really intended to bomb something do that? I suspect we're looking at a case of 'suicide by cop' as they say.

 

[Tgace]

When you have to make the decision, you have to go with whats presented to you. Do you just assume that a bomber wouldnt say he had a bomb and not shoot? Then if he goes off (and you live) you will be questioned as to why you didnt shoot.

 

[MJS]

I find it odd that the article doesn't mention whether he did in fact have anything in his carry-on that would be considered an explosive device. And, this is just a guess, but I'm guessing that the "senior administration official" refers to the Federal Aviation Administration. Sorry, conspiracy theorists...

I'm watching CNN/MSNBC right now and as of yet, I havent heard anything about a bomb. They're saying that he may have had some mental problems, but it still amazes me as to how many people STILL, even after all the beefed up security, etc., that people still find it funny to make bomb comments.

I'm sure it'll be a matter of time and we'll hear people say, "Why did he have to shoot and kill him? Why didn't he shoot him in the leg?" Its people that like that I just wanna :whip: because they do not have a clue!

Mike

 

[MJS]

When you have to make the decision, you have to go with whats presented to you. Do you just assume that a bomber wouldnt say he had a bomb and not shoot? Then if he goes off (and you live) you will be questioned as to why you didnt shoot.

I give alot of credit to the LEOs. This Marshal had to make a split second decision, and IMO, he made the right one! The fact of the matter is, is that this guy made a comment, acted aggressively, ran, made a movement towards his bag, giving a very strong impression that he was going to do something. Better to take the guy out than have him blow up the plane and take X number of people with him.

Mike

 

[michaeledward]

I find it odd that the article doesn't mention whether he did in fact have anything in his carry-on that would be considered an explosive device. And, this is just a guess, but I'm guessing that the "senior administration official" refers to the Federal Aviation Administration. Sorry, conspiracy theorists...

As the articles are updated, the 'Senior Administration Official' attribution is being updated. Now there is a name for a Department of Homeland Security official.

However, 'Senior Administration Official' is not an FAA official.This attribution generally refers to secretarys and deputy secretarys.

There was an article in 'Slate' that described this attribution ... and says there are perhaps 100 people who can be so attributed as 'Senior Administration Officials'.

 

[MJS]

I agree, but I think there has to be another way to protect everyone in the instances when someone is mentally unstable and making false claims. I don't know what they way is, but I have to think there is another solution out there that can disable someone without killing them....
Based on the evidence reported so far it sounds like the air marshalls did what they were trained to.....hopefully further evidence will support what they did and this won't be a huge mistake

A few things to take into consideration here.

1: How can we tell what the mental capacity of someone is?

2: When a LEO is faced with the choice to shoot, and any LEO out there, please correct me if I'm wrong, but they're going to be aiming for center mass, not the legs, etc.

Mike

 

[Tgace]

The handgun is not a "less lethal" weapon. Shooting for center mass and even the head is not 100% effective, depending on incapacitating someone with a pistol is a non-starter. Its center mass till the threat is no longer a threat.

 

[Michael Billings]

Good call if the man was acting as reported. Mental health issues aside, you cannot necessarily evaluate that at the time the threat or terroristic action is started. You do your best with what you have at the time. THAT is what makes any LEO's job so tough. Hindsight is always 20/20.

-Michael

 

[rutherford]

Just a quick update: fatal shooting.

You know, of anybody the air marshals would definitely be the people I want trained to shoot center mass. Lots of people and plane parts that could easily be hit by stray shots.

 

[MJS]

The handgun is not a "less lethal" weapon. Shooting for center mass and even the head is not 100% effective, depending on incapacitating someone with a pistol is a non-starter. Its center mass till the threat is no longer a threat.

I agree! Considering the ongoing threats, the war, etc. I really dont see Marshals using LL weapons. When they're faced with a deadly situation, I would hope that theyd continue to use whatever force necessary.

Mike

 

[MJS]

Just a quick update: fatal shooting.

You know, of anybody the air marshals would definitely be the people I want trained to shoot center mass. Lots of people and plane parts that could easily be hit by stray shots.

Exactly!!! This plane was on the ground, but imagine if it was in the air!! Taking out a window would lead to a worse situation.

Side note: I heard that there were no explosives found. It'll be a matter of time before the 'fun' begins.

Mike

 

[arnisador]

Good call if the man was acting as reported. Mental health issues aside, you cannot necessarily evaluate that at the time the threat or terroristic action is started. You do your best with what you have at the time.

Absolutely. There's no way of knowing the whole story when there are only minutes or even seconds to react.