Lop Da Drill

[guy b]

Posted again for comparison:

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Differences in perceptions. I dont know what you mean by "pushing", or "stilted". I have met both persons and rolled with them.
Lui Ming Fai has been in real fights and full contact matches in Hong Kong, Macao and SE Asia,

I has assumed the female was a beginner. Is this not the case?

 

[guy b]

Lui Ming Fai has been in real fights and full contact matches in Hong Kong, Macao and SE Asia,

Some free movement stuff at 37.45 here:

 

[guy b]

more drilling:

 

[KPM]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Differences in perceptions.

You really think so? Do you think the same might apply to your criticisms of others???

 

[guy b]

You really think so? Do you think the same might apply to your criticisms of others???

I would say that the Michael Kurth clips are showing a more advanced and flowing use of the drill, and that Kurth is clearly very good. I would agree that in comparison the Liu Ming Fai clip is slow, hesitant and looks stilted, which I had assumed was due to the training partner. Could also be that they are demonstrating slowly on purpose.

The Kurth clip is much better, but the reason for this is not clear. Would need to see more of LMF and would not assume his VT is not good. A shame more footage is not available

 

[KPM]

I would say that the Michael Kurth clips are showing a more advanced and flowing use of the drill, and that Kurth is clearly very good. I would agree that in comparison the Liu Ming Fai clip is slow, hesitant and looks stilted, which I had assumed was due to the training partner. Could also be that they are demonstrating slowly on purpose.

The Kurth clip is much better, but the reason for this is not clear. Would need to see more of LMF and would not assume his VT is not good. A shame more footage is not available

I completely agree. The Michael Kurth clips did show a more advanced and flowing use of the drill. It could be that the Kurth clip is normal training that happened to be filmed, while the Liu Ming Fai clip was specifically for a demo.

 

[Juany118]

I completely agree. The Michael Kurth clips did show a more advanced and flowing use of the drill. It could be that the Kurth clip is normal training that happened to be filmed, while the Liu Ming Fai clip was specifically for a demo.

Yeah, I think so people sometimes forget that in demos you don't always A. get the best partner and B. will slow and/make things more "obvious" so people see what you are doing.

A. In my experience is very important. I'll admit to doing a lot more Kali flow drills than WC. How well I flow in Sombrada is very much determined by my partner. A Sombrada drill (for those unfamiliar) is a choreographed dance of sorts alternating attacks and counters. The purpose is to teach flow and to get you to ingrain muscle memory for when you move on to doing "free form" improvised drills with the same movements. If you don't match your partner's movements you risk taking a ratan stick to the head. As a consequence if they aren't flowing well your flow can be compromised.

 

[Lobo66]

I think his partner in the demo is an advanced student and teacher as well.

The short sparring sequence in the video above really says it all, though. With all due respect to the people involved, it's just not good.

 

[guy b]

I think his partner in the demo is an advanced student and teacher as well

If that is the case then I hope Joy will comment to explain further what is happening in the clip

 

[wingchun100]

Ho Kam Ming version of the exercise as demonstrated by Liu Ming Fai and Louisa Chow.

Is this a good representation of the drill in this lineage, Vajramusti?

I don't recall ever using footwork other than pivoting when I have done this drill. Pretty cool vid.

 

[wingchun100]

Well, I mean that it looks stiff, slow and un-coordinated. Not relaxed and dynamic.
Compare again to this clip :

Kudos if he's been in some full contact matches. A real venue for competition is what CMA really needs (already exists for sanda and shaui jiao, of course) to evolve.

It is so hard to tell from video, but...when he practices on the dummy, it looks like all arms...no real "oompf" from his structure behind it.

But who am I? Just someone looking at it on a computer screen.

 

[Danny T]

Two completely different levels and purposes being displayed.
It isn't that one is better but the purpose for doing the drill at that moment.

Demonstration is not the same as Drilling.
Drilling has several different levels.

 

[Vajramusti]

more drilling:

----------------------------------
they are not beginners but luis has been at it for while.

 

[guy b]

Two completely different levels and purposes being displayed.
It isn't that one is better but the purpose for doing the drill at that moment.

Demonstration is not the same as Drilling.
Drilling has several different levels.

Demonstrating entails exhibition but also showing others how to do something

To me this is demonstrating, it emparts an understanding of what is being shown:

 

[Danny T]

Demonstrating entails exhibition but also showing others how to do something

To me this is demonstrating, it emparts an understanding of what is being shown:

Drilling
Demonstrating
Teaching
All are different and what is show may well be different

 

[guy b]

Teaching: