What am I supposed to say to Drop Bear?

[guy b]

Forum members:

I have been criticised for not going into enough detail and for giving flippant and sometimes patronising answers to people. I accept the criticism to an extent, but feel that there are two sides to every story and I didn't show up here with this posting style. Anyway, I will try to do better in future.

I have a problem though: please have a look at the post on chain punching featuring MMA fan drop bear. What am I supposed to say to a person who is definitely wrong, and definitely ignorant of VT while also being hostile to it for some reason I can't work out, but who fails to recognise their wrongness and continues arguing from a base of factual error? Short (if not flippant) answers seem about all I can do here?

Drop bear also feel free to add suggestions. What do you want from me, apart from an argument about nothing?

 

[KPM]

At that point you simply "agree to disagree" and move on. It doesn't have to turn into a long drawn-out argument.

 

[guy b]

Good advice

 

[drop bear]

You support your arguments with credable evidence.

But otherwise. You treat martial arts like a religion and I treat it like a science. So of course our approaches are going to clash.

 

[wingchun100]

I think everyone around here has been guilty of that at some time or another though. I mean if you say "I don't get that WC move...it would not work," and we say, "Well it would because the principle behind it is XYZ," and you come back and say, "Nope, still won't work..."

I mean, assuming that the WC person gave an example of how it WOULD work, and you are adhering to it not working...then where are we supposed to go from there? We can't go anywhere.

It always amuses me that, on boards like this where there is a wing chun section or on wing chun videos on YouTube, I ALWAYS see people from other styles posting things to bash it...yet I hardly ever see even 20% of this much bashing done on any other boards/videos of any other style. Maybe it is because wing chun is the only style where no one has entered a competition and really OWNED it, so there is no "proof" the style works.

Well, no proof in the eye of the public anyway. I've had to use it on a few occasions, so I know it does. You might wonder if these situations were against people who were trained in nothing. From what I saw of them, the answer is: yes, they seemed to have little or no training of their own...but then again, the majority of people in the world that you might fight on the street will NOT have training. Or if they do, they might be a hobbyist. Since I don't plan on competing in the ring anytime soon, that is not what I train for. However, if I wanted to, then I would step up my game to see how the other WC reps who entered MMA tournaments failed, and I would strive to not make the same mistakes.

Anyway, I don't know why I went on that rant.

To the OP: if you don't like what a member says, don't feel like a wimp for hitting the "ignore member" button. They created it to be used.

 

[drop bear]

It is mostly a simple and clinical discussion that can then branch out to exceptions. But if you have access to the better rescourses and the better people you will wind up with a better product.

Australian soccer is not as good as European soccer. We don't have the same resources.

Same with martial arts.

sorry. Not a thing I can change.

 

[wingchun100]

I don't believe anyone asked you to.

 

[guy b]

You support your arguments with credable evidence.

But otherwise. You treat martial arts like a religion and I treat it like a science. So of course our approaches are going to clash.

Making massive assumptions isn't scientific, it's political. If you would like to take an evidence based approach then when you lack evidence, you should remain undecided or without an opinion. When provided with information (a drill is not sparring) then you should modify your opinions accordingly.

I don't think I have any kind of religious approach to martial arts and I have changed system several times. The two I have settled on are BJJ and VT because they are compatible and complimentary. Evidence about VT is available to me that isn't available to you, and this is what I base my decisions on. If you wish to see such evidence then I suggest training VT

 

[Steve]

I think if you answered questions instead of evading them, things would go better. Also, threads like this are really lame, and possibly a violation of the TOS.

Also, I recommend typing out drop bear. DP means something naughty... at least in the USA.

 

[wingchun100]

I think if you answered questions instead of evading them, things would go better. Also, threads like this are really lame, and possibly a violation of the TOS.

Also, I recommend typing out drop bear. DP means something naughty... at least in the USA.

And not for nothing, but wouldn't the proper abbreviation be DB anyway?

 

[Xue Sheng]

Drop Bear likes to promote argument...end of story...you have to decide if he is worth wasting your time on....my recommendation is..... just let it go

 

[guy b]

Drop Bear likes to promote argument...end of story...you have to decide if he is worth wasting your time on....my recommendation is..... just let it go

I think you are correct. Basically it seems to boil down to a demand for videos and odd assumptions based on no info

I will avoid in future

 

[Gerry Seymour]

It is mostly a simple and clinical discussion that can then branch out to exceptions. But if you have access to the better rescourses and the better people you will wind up with a better product.

Australian soccer is not as good as European soccer. We don't have the same resources.

Same with martial arts.

sorry. Not a thing I can change.

The ongoing issue, Drop Bear, is that you only honor one type of evidence, so far as I can see: does it work against a highly-skilled person who has some familiarity with what you do (so, not a surprise technique to them) trying to stop you from doing that thing. There are many reasons that doesn't actually apply to some techniques and contexts. It's like taking evidence from lab mice and expecting them to apply directly to humans. It's usable evidence, but not always valid for the context.

 

[Xue Sheng]

. DP means something naughty... at least in the USA.

It does!?

That is a new one on me

 

[Marnetmar]

You could try not acting like a proverbial brick wall and wondering why people here get annoyed with you or try to push your buttons.

 

[Danny T]

Forum members:

I have been criticised for not going into enough detail and for giving flippant and sometimes patronising answers to people. I accept the criticism to an extent, but feel that there are two sides to every story and I didn't show up here with this posting style. Anyway, I will try to do better in future.

I have a problem though: please have a look at the post on chain punching featuring MMA fan drop bear. What am I supposed to say to a person who is definitely wrong, and definitely ignorant of VT while also being hostile to it for some reason I can't work out, but who fails to recognise their wrongness and continues arguing from a base of factual error? Short (if not flippant) answers seem about all I can do here?

Drop bear also feel free to add suggestions. What do you want from me, apart from an argument about nothing?

How about simply agreeing to disagree and moving on to something else. There is always someone who will disagree on any subject manner. We all have different perspectives...it isn't a matter of being right but of discussing, giving your opinion/perspective and accepting someone else may well disagree. It is when one (whether correct or not) takes discussion into argument (the want to prove their opinion is correct and another's is wrong) that contention along with emotion takes hold. There numerous people here who like and will draw others into arguing rather than explaining with good intent for all.
There are the often teasing/joking/sometimes snide remarks done in fun or jest that others take as insult and then there are the snide remarks done on purpose to insult rather than giving a good explanation of one's perspectives. All cause argumentative and unproductive discourse.

Give your opinion, answer questions in a manner to help others understand your perspective, accept others may or may not agree or understand, ask them questions with the purpose to gain more knowledge of their perspective and again accept that some may still disagree.

As to myself I'm not here to prove my knowledge is the truth, is completely correct nor is it to prove that someone who doesn't have my perspective is wrong.

Something my Sifu often states; "there is no right or wrong, there is only the consequence".

 

[realg7]

Forum members:

I have been criticised for not going into enough detail and for giving flippant and sometimes patronising answers to people. I accept the criticism to an extent, but feel that there are two sides to every story and I didn't show up here with this posting style. Anyway, I will try to do better in future.

I have a problem though: please have a look at the post on chain punching featuring MMA fan drop bear. What am I supposed to say to a person who is definitely wrong, and definitely ignorant of VT while also being hostile to it for some reason I can't work out, but who fails to recognise their wrongness and continues arguing from a base of factual error? Short (if not flippant) answers seem about all I can do here?

Drop bear also feel free to add suggestions. What do you want from me, apart from an argument about nothing?

You guys should remember that this is the internet and that you are both here due to your hobbies and interests.

If this doesn't effect your ability to earn money then it probably doesn't matter that 2 brain egos are clashing on an online forum.

Both of you need to CHILL OUT....

This is a brotherhood of warriors, and in such a band of brothers fights are inevitable, so do what men do after a fight, shake virtual hands, have a virtual beer, give a virtual hug, and MOVE ON!

Love ya

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

 

[Tez3]

This is a brotherhood of warriors, and in such a band of brothers fights are inevitable, so do what men do after a fight, shake virtual hands, have a virtual beer, give a virtual hug, and MOVE ON!

Excuse me? Are women excluded from this site then?

 

[drop bear]

Making massive assumptions isn't scientific, it's political. If you would like to take an evidence based approach then when you lack evidence, you should remain undecided or without an opinion. When provided with information (a drill is not sparring) then you should modify your opinions accordingly.

I don't think I have any kind of religious approach to martial arts and I have changed system several times. The two I have settled on are BJJ and VT because they are compatible and complimentary. Evidence about VT is available to me that isn't available to you, and this is what I base my decisions on. If you wish to see such evidence then I suggest training VT

Funny thing about that. I just saw a whole heap of evidence about VT myself. Validates everything i said.

I Just can't show it to you. As you know they don't like that stuff promoted.

 

[drop bear]

The ongoing issue, Drop Bear, is that you only honor one type of evidence, so far as I can see: does it work against a highly-skilled person who has some familiarity with what you do (so, not a surprise technique to them) trying to stop you from doing that thing. There are many reasons that doesn't actually apply to some techniques and contexts. It's like taking evidence from lab mice and expecting them to apply directly to humans. It's usable evidence, but not always valid for the context.

What else do you have? Stories are easy. I could do stories all day.