Looking for Peoples take on being avoided in class

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Mxmillion

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Hi, and thanks for having me MT and all.

I'm in my forties and I'm currently enrolled in an adult TKD program. I am currently a green belt. However, all the students are 18 and younger.

Sometimes my master would pair us off in 2's to kick the bag from opposite sides.
For the last two classes, two girls--one is a white belt(14-15ish) and the other(16-17ish,mixed) told the instructor that they'd rather kick the bag by their selves. I am a very nice person and usually try to ignore most things, but I did not do anything to them. I am also beginning to encounter this behavior from females of all ages at regular settings, in terms of avoidance.

I am a nice looking person. This angers me and I do not deserve this, nor did I do anything to warrant that treatment. Has anyone here had a similar experience?

Just looking for different takes and opinions because I am seriously growing more frustrated with people and their garbage nowadays. Please advise.
 

jobo

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Hi, and thanks for having me MT and all.

I'm in my forties and I'm currently enrolled in an adult TKD program. I am currently a green belt. However, all the students are 18 and younger.

Sometimes my master would pair us off in 2's to kick the bag from opposite sides.
For the last two classes, two girls--one is a white belt(14-15ish) and the other(16-17ish,mixed) told the instructor that they'd rather kick the bag by their selves. I am a very nice person and usually try to ignore most things, but I did not do anything to them. I am also beginning to encounter this behavior from females of all ages at regular settings, in terms of avoidance.

I am a nice looking person. This angers me and I do not deserve this, nor did I do anything to warrant that treatment. Has anyone here had a similar experience?

Just looking for different takes and opinions because I am seriously growing more frustrated with people and their garbage nowadays. Please advise.
well they are children and your old, i wouldnt take it to much to heart, they probably dont want to hang out with their grand dad either

agree with DB , go somewhere a bit more adult orientated, with the best will in the world, its a bit odd being in a children's class
 
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Earl Weiss

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I think the instructor needs to ask them "Why" in order to get more information or perhaps consult with them and their parents.
 

jobo

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I think the instructor needs to ask them "Why" in order to get more information or perhaps consult with them and their parents.
some times " why" is the wrong question, they may tell you or they may make something up and that's not going to make it better, for one reason or another two female children feel uncomfortable partnering with a a mature adult Male,

I think that's all the justification they need, if that's adult males in general or this one in particular doesnt really alter the fact he is clearly in the wrong class for himself and it seems others

take the hint, the fact he has bothered to tell us how nice looking he is in this context, seems to ring warning bells, so much so, im wondering if the whole post is a wind up

I was on a night out in Glasgow and got " an invite" to a club, when i arrived i was clearly in the wrong place, i felt like a teacher at the school disco, i left
 
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Martial D

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Hi, and thanks for having me MT and all.

I'm in my forties and I'm currently enrolled in an adult TKD program. I am currently a green belt. However, all the students are 18 and younger.

Sometimes my master would pair us off in 2's to kick the bag from opposite sides.
For the last two classes, two girls--one is a white belt(14-15ish) and the other(16-17ish,mixed) told the instructor that they'd rather kick the bag by their selves. I am a very nice person and usually try to ignore most things, but I did not do anything to them. I am also beginning to encounter this behavior from females of all ages at regular settings, in terms of avoidance.

I am a nice looking person. This angers me and I do not deserve this, nor did I do anything to warrant that treatment. Has anyone here had a similar experience?

Just looking for different takes and opinions because I am seriously growing more frustrated with people and their garbage nowadays. Please advise.
If a person, or two people, or even multiple women from the same friends group are avoiding you. Maybe it's them.

If multiple unconnected females are avoiding you..well at that point it might me time to look at the common thread as the source of the problem.

The fact that you mentioned your looks makes me think you might be (maybe unintentionally?) creeping on them, or behaving in such a manner that it appears that you are(else why would you mention that .looks don't matter in martial arts)

Maybe look at your own behavior.
 

Tony Dismukes

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take the hint, the fact he has bothered to tell us how nice looking he is in this context, seems to ring warning bells, so much so, im wondering if the whole post is a wind up
Yep. Someone who feels the need to tell us that he's nice looking in the context of asking why a couple of underage girls might be avoiding him is probably answering the broader question of why women might be avoiding him in other settings as well.

Just in case this is a genuine question and not a troll, here are some thoughts for the OP:

There is nothing surprising or inappropriate about young teenage girls not wanting to pair up with you (a middle aged man) in class.

As Martial D notes, if "females of all ages" are consistently avoiding you in a variety of contexts, then it almost certainly comes down to your own behavior and the vibes you are putting out. You need to drop the anger and examine what work you need to do on yourself to fix the problem. Warning - that sort of self-adjustment takes time and hard work and can be frustrating and emotionally painful. It is worth it, though.
 

skribs

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Hi, and thanks for having me MT and all.

I'm in my forties and I'm currently enrolled in an adult TKD program. I am currently a green belt. However, all the students are 18 and younger.

Sometimes my master would pair us off in 2's to kick the bag from opposite sides.
For the last two classes, two girls--one is a white belt(14-15ish) and the other(16-17ish,mixed) told the instructor that they'd rather kick the bag by their selves.

I'm going to start here. Let's go ahead and use the standard font. Things like bold and italics should be used for emphasis. This may be a stylistic choice, and I may be nitpicky, but let's start with this.

There are many reasons why they may rather kick the bag by themselves.
  • You may kick the bag harder than they like, and they don't want to catch up.
  • You may be slower than they are, and they don't want to feel held back.
  • They may just want to hang out with their friends, either because they're cliquish or socially anxious, and not socialize with people outside their group.
  • They may be more comfortable around people their age and/or gender.
  • They may have some prejudice against you (race, gender, religion, etc).
None of these are really indictments on you, and are something you shouldn't worry too much about. There aren't any other middle-aged men in the class for you to see if it's that age group or if it's you. If it's something like you're hitting the bag too hard or too slow, you're just in different stages of training. If it's a prejudice, then that sucks, but overall doesn't affect you. However, there may also be reasons why it is specifically you they have issue with:
  • Anger issues
  • Creepy (especially if they think you're being flirty)
  • Critical or mean (or even just trying too hard to be helpful)
  • Poor hygiene
  • Distraction (i.e. if you joke around a lot when they're trying to train)
I specifically bring up the first two because in the rest of your post, you said you have anger towards this situation, and you are talking about being a "nice looking person" in regards to underage girls (as others have said). The others are things I've seen. I know some of my students quit because when I first started teaching, I was very critical. I've had some students complain about being partnered with someone who has BO. Then there was one kid who would spend his entire drilling time talking about his social media instead of practicing. Nobody ever volunteered to be his partner, and there was a visual grimace every time they were stuck with him.

If it's any of these, then you have stuff to work on. Focus on the training, and not on the partner. Don't try to be too friendly around younger folk who aren't familiar with you. Make sure your hygiene is on point. You may want to consider going to therapy to figure out what it is you need to work on (are you coming across as angry, creepy, etc) and then how to work on that.

Martial Arts training is a vulnerable situation. You are opening yourself to violent physical contact from another person. If you do not consent to training with a partner, then that becomes assault. You see this more in more modern-style arts, where people feel more opportunity to refuse to spar or roll with anyone they don't feel comfortable partnering up with. Ideally it would be with good cause, but it doesn't have to be any reason you understand or agree with.

I listed some possible reasons this might not be your fault. However, if it's happening in a lot of places, then it probably is something that you need to work on. Most likely anger, being too friendly, or hygiene.
 

Martial D

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I think young women will avoid older or bigger males in class, because they are afraid of being hurt.
Our club had lots of females of all sizes ages and shapes and there was never any issues pairing up.

Even for bjj which is very um close quarters to say the least. It's really a trust thing that begins with a vibe.

And the whole /r/niceguys vibe this op gives off is not a great foundation for that.
 

skribs

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Our club had lots of females of all sizes ages and shapes and there was never any issues pairing up.

Even for bjj which is very um close quarters to say the least. It's really a trust thing that begins with a vibe.

I think it's different for striking arts, in regards to getting hurt or not. There are three of our students: two brothers who are small for their age, and one other kid who is big for his age. The bigger kid didn't have much control over his power or aim. The Dad of the other two asked us not to let the bigger kid spar with his kids. However...

I think young women will avoid older or bigger males in class, because they are afraid of being hurt.

In this it sounds like they are kicking a heavy bag or standing bag, and are pairing up to more efficiently use the bags. I don't think getting hurt is a concern.
 

Martial D

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I think it's different for striking arts, in regards to getting hurt or not. There are three of our students: two brothers who are small for their age, and one other kid who is big for his age. The bigger kid didn't have much control over his power or aim. The Dad of the other two asked us not to let the bigger kid spar with his kids. However...



In this it sounds like they are kicking a heavy bag or standing bag, and are pairing up to more efficiently use the bags. I don't think getting hurt is a concern.
It was an mma place (RIP Foundry martial arts and fitness), so there was plenty of striking/sparring too.
 

JowGaWolf

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Earl Weiss

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some times " why" is the wrong question, they may tell you or they may make something up and that's not going to make it better, for one reason or another two female children feel uncomfortable partnering with a a mature adult Male,

I think that's all the justification they need, i...............t

I think it incumbent upon the instructor to investigate further both for the person who posted here as well as the others in class to make certain there is not a larger problem that could affect all. Agree no further justification is needed if they do not want to work with him - that is enough.
 

jobo

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I think it incumbent upon the instructor to investigate further both for the person who posted here as well as the others in class to make certain there is not a larger problem that could affect all. Agree no further justification is needed if they do not want to work with him - that is enough.
what sort of ''investigation'' were you thinking of that doesn't also require the girls in question to provided ''justification''.

the two issues seem irreconcilable

as it is, the instructor isn't posting here, so giving him advice on remedial action seems a little futile, if i were to give advice, its that under the present climate having an adult in a children's class is a recipe for disaster even in a mixed class id go out of my way to keep them apart, just so there are no '' misunderstandings''

in fact the OP doesn't seem to be posting any more either, so its perhaps all a bit of a waste of time
 
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Earl Weiss

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what sort of ''investigation'' were you thinking of that doesn't also require the girls in question to provided ''justification''.

the two issues seem irreconcilable

as it is, the instructor isn't posting here, so giving him advice on remedial action seems a little futile, if i were to give advice, its that under the present climate having an adult in a children's class is a recipe for disaster even in a mixed class id go out of my way to keep them apart, just so there are no '' misunderstandings''

in fact the OP doesn't seem to be posting any more either, so its perhaps all a bit of a waste of time

The investigation would consist of the poster asking the instructor what he asked here. This would alert the instructor to the potential of something going on. The instructor would then ask for a meeting with the students and their parents. While the immediate action would be to prevent further interaction between the adult and the ones who have expressed a desire to not work with him what do you do about young female students who have not expressed anything? Let them work with this adult because you don't know of any specific problem taking the chance there may be? Eliminate any interaction with young female students even though there is no issue other than some being snowflakes?
 

jobo

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The investigation would consist of the poster asking the instructor what he asked here. This would alert the instructor to the potential of something going on. The instructor would then ask for a meeting with the students and their parents. While the immediate action would be to prevent further interaction between the adult and the ones who have expressed a desire to not work with him what do you do about young female students who have not expressed anything? Let them work with this adult because you don't know of any specific problem taking the chance there may be? Eliminate any interaction with young female students even though there is no issue other than some being snowflakes?
well there an issue even if its snow flakes, there seems to be an epidemic of snowflakeitise, that bringing a lot of grief to a lot of people

what you do, if your the op stop hang9ng out with teenagers, it's at best unbecoming, if your the instructor, recognise that if you have a class full of young teenagers it may become an alurment for undesirable element and if all is innocent a misplaced hand in an exercise can bring a world of trouble down on you, there already a very preventable issue and no, misplaced hand

so ask him to attend an age appropriate class if available or refere him to the nearest school that can accommodate him, or be his training partner yyour in if that's all that's left

if I was an involved parent, aware that a middle aged man had arrivied in the middle of a group of 15 yo I'd be telling my kid to steer well clear, coz it's very odd behaviour
 
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skribs

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what sort of ''investigation'' were you thinking of that doesn't also require the girls in question to provided ''justification''.

the two issues seem irreconcilable

as it is, the instructor isn't posting here, so giving him advice on remedial action seems a little futile, if i were to give advice, its that under the present climate having an adult in a children's class is a recipe for disaster even in a mixed class id go out of my way to keep them apart, just so there are no '' misunderstandings''

in fact the OP doesn't seem to be posting any more either, so its perhaps all a bit of a waste of time

They don't have to consent to partnering with him for any reason. They also don't have to divulge their reasons if they don't want to. However, if the issue can be resolved (or at least articulated), then that could help. At the very least, it could give OP closure on the situation.
 
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Hi, and thanks for having me MT and all.

I'm in my forties and I'm currently enrolled in an adult TKD program. I am currently a green belt. However, all the students are 18 and younger.

Sometimes my master would pair us off in 2's to kick the bag from opposite sides.
For the last two classes, two girls--one is a white belt(14-15ish) and the other(16-17ish,mixed) told the instructor that they'd rather kick the bag by their selves. I am a very nice person and usually try to ignore most things, but I did not do anything to them. I am also beginning to encounter this behavior from females of all ages at regular settings, in terms of avoidance.

I am a nice looking person. This angers me and I do not deserve this, nor did I do anything to warrant that treatment. Has anyone here had a similar experience?

Just looking for different takes and opinions because I am seriously growing more frustrated with people and their garbage nowadays. Please advise.

Not your fault at all. These are just the kind of people that want to do martial arts for the reputation and want to learn it without sweat & blood. Kind of an alibi thing.
Encountered plenty of them during my martial arts career and even had female black belts running out on me crying like little girls, not because I overdid it on them but because they could not land any hits on me. These black belts became trainers later on themselves...makes you wonder.

I personally really hate training with kids/teenagers as the mix up is just a disadvantage for either one of them, either for the adult as he doesn't get anything out of sparring with a teen or child or for the child or teen as they feel overwhelmed by the often stronger and more experienced adult.

I am currently doing Shotokan Karate and we have tons of people who want to practice martial arts without the martial arts.....Unfortunately our dojo doesn't even have a punching bag hanging up or anything solid you can punch. If we are lucky our sensei gets some punching pads out from time to time we can hit in a controlled manner (lame).
 
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