Kempo/Kenpo goes Aikido.

[Humble artist]

I pay a bunch of respect for kempo and do have some experience about aikido.This thread is not all about aikido,so this is not meant to be off-topic wondering.
Many people seem to look down on aikido as far as my knowledge goes,many have doubts about it´s effectiveness (this can be a concern as it takes lots of training supposing you are learning it for SD purposes,and because of it´s complex nature it can be very hard to "turn on".If one becomes succesful though,then that´s great)
I´ve learned lately that kempo practitioners have "taken" techniques from aikido to develop their art (I can´t really say if this is style specific question,I just know it has been adopted)
Some of basic aikido techniques like "iriminage" (entering throw) and many others.I don´t know for sure why,but it seems they think it is worthy and want to add more circular motion&possibly non-resistance into generally linear moving art (please note these are mostly my own ideas of it) to fill what is lacking.
What do you think about all this?
Any input...

 

[Wertle]

I don't know about other styles, but my style of Kempo teaches an aiki principle. It is possibly my favorite, and when I get up in ranks, i plan on doing that as an auxilary art. It is great fun!

I don't really know much about American Kenpo curriculum, or other styles of Kempo for that matter, there are so many! But in ours we learn blocks, kicks, and strikes, but also throws, counterjoints, chokes, and weapons.

I really enjoy the aiki principle, because it seems to flow naturally for me, and I feel like the counterjoints I learn are really suitable to my small stature.

I guess I would agree that it would be helpful to learn the aiki principle, through taking aikido or whatever, if it's not included in your curriculum, no harm in variety, I suppose ^_^.

 

[Blindside]

It depends on whose aikido.

I've met aiki practitioners whose combat skills were negligible despite their rank, whose breakfalls had little to do with street situations, and who never really got past the "ideal" technique in their practice of techniques.

I've also met aiki practitioners who've tossed me, and to this day I don't really understand how they were able to do it so effortlessly.

I will say that I think Kenpo is a faster route to effective combat skills. Aiki's complexity really requires high level skills to make it strongly effective (sensitivity, proper body joining, etc). In some ways I also think Aikido practitioners tend to focus on the grab defenses a little too much, or the attacks they defend against are pretty unlikely (ex: downward chop to the neck). To be fair, I will say that I also think Kenpo tends to focus on the straight right (lunge) punch a bit too much too.

Unfortunately, I think that the main difference is approach. Many aikido practitioners do this as a "way to nirvana" or somesuch, rather than as a means of self defense, as in most martial arts, attitude is everything. My friend who is a good aikido and kenjutsu practitioner wrote me of a sign that he saw in a aikido school in Seattle.

"The way to enlightenment is paved in one-inch mats."

His comment was to the effect that this seemed sort of "wussy" to him. This contrasts greatly with the teachings of his yoshinkai instructor.

I do respect his art, but I'm not sure it is something you can simply take little bits and pieces of. At my low level of understanding I find that the footwork patterns and overall concepts are somewhat contradictory.

I'm babbling here....

Lamont

 

[Kempojujutsu]

The Art I teach is basically a sister art of Aikijujutsu, a lot of things are very similar to Aikijujutsu. Aikido is a copy of Aikijujutsu and Kempojujutsu not the other way around. Number 1 aikido doesn't have any strikes in it. Aikido is a defense of art, Aiki and Kempo are Offense arts.
Bob:asian:

 

[Humble artist]

Thanks for the replies,nice thoughts.
I have to respectfully disagree with you Bob about your idea of aikido,but if it just happened that I got the wrong idea you may feel free to correct me.
Aikido is not a copy of aikijujutsu (i don´t know if I got your point right but are you saying that it also has something to do with kempojujutsu? I´ve never ever heard of such art,but I´m open for all information)
Daito-ryu aikijujutsu had an influence on aikido which cannot be underestimated but that is not all to it.O´Sensei became proficient in various arts,he studied various unarmed arts and became skilled in swordsmanship and other weaponry such as spear&stickfighting.Also creating his own form of weaponry for aikido (use of pole)
Aikido also has strikes (and kicking,if applied) into it,not in the same way that kempo as an example has,you are unlikely to see them chop base of skull (even though it is noticed that atemi of aiki should be cabable of doing damage,which never is the first thing to do) But this is neglected in many schools,so i understand your point.
The idea that aikido uses it´s mostly independent principles of circular movement,it also dumps generally non-circular arts like jujutsu clean on their back (to reveal the idea that circular movement is not from there) Those other arts that had an influence,I believe.

It has been a while since I have thought about aikido with heart so this is all I can point out right now.There´s certainly more,always.


:asian:

 

[Chiduce]

In the days of Ueshiba , Kano, and before them, it was all called Kempo. This was to keep other students whom would walk up on two or more say, aikijujutsu practitioners discussing their art's techniques, motion etc, from knowing what martial art the practitioner's were refering too. When Kano spoke of judo to his jujutsu students, he asked them to "Do your Judo"; or do your jujutsu techniques the gentle way! In this sense; Judo was the philosophy and jujutsu was the actual physical application of this philosophy! O' Sensei also studied Kito Ryu etc,.
For more very interesting info. on jujutsu, akijujutsu, judo, Kano and Ueshiba go to; http://www.kiyojuteryu.org/soke/articles.shtml
There are 70 articles ranging from Kempo, Jujutsu, Aikijujutsu, Nimpo, to Ninjutsu!
Sincerely, In Humility;
Chiduce!

 

[Kempojujutsu]

You beat me to the post Chiduce. I couldn't remember the site and was going to have to surf. Thanks again
Bob:asian:

 

[Humble artist]

Thank you both.
I´ll have to check those articles out.
:asian: