Indian girl uses Karate to defend herself. Is Karate an effective martial art for self defense?

[RTKDCMB]

Many of those "illegal moves" were perfectly legal in the first UFCs, and we got pretty much the same results we get now.

I know there was a few minor groin shots and a head butt or two but I don't recall any fighter doing eye gouges or throat strikes in the early UFC. Perhaps you could point some out to me?

 

[Skullpunch]

I know there was a few minor groin shots and a head butt or two but I don't recall any fighter doing eye gouges or throat strikes in the early UFC. Perhaps you could point some out to me?

Throat strikes were allowed, it just turned out to be a lot harder to get a good shot on the throat than everyone thought it was going to be.

Eye gouges I believe were always illegal but there were guys who would've done so anyway if the opportunity had presented itself. Gerard Gordeau, for example. He tried to bite his way out of Royce's RNC at the finals of UFC 1 and rammed his thumb into Yuki Nakai's eye at Japan Vale Tudo in 1994 I believe - the latter technique was considered especially dirty considering he was like a foot taller and 80 lbs heavier than Nakai or something absurd like that. Amazingly enough, Nakai still managed to submit him and make it to the finals (after fighting for a combined total of like an hour and with both eyes swollen shut)

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Throat strikes were allowed, it just turned out to be a lot harder to get a good shot on the throat than everyone thought it was going to be.

Eye gouges I believe were always illegal but there were guys who would've done so anyway if the opportunity had presented itself. Gerard Gordeau, for example. He tried to bite his way out of Royce's RNC at the finals of UFC 1 and rammed his thumb into Yuki Nakai's eye at Japan Vale Tudo in 1994 I believe - the latter technique was considered especially dirty considering he was like a foot taller and 80 lbs heavier than Nakai or something absurd like that. Amazingly enough, Nakai still managed to submit him and make it to the finals (after fighting for a combined total of like an hour and with both eyes swollen shut)

I think in UFC 1, eye gouges were not technically forbidden, but they were on a list of techniques that would cause the fighter using them to forfeit a portion of his purse for the fight.

There have been enough instances over the years of fighters (accidentally or deliberately) poking their opponents in the eye without getting immediately disqualified to confirm that in general
a) attacking the eyes can be very effective
b) it's still not any kind of guaranteed win or a substitute for overall fighting ability.

BTW - Gordeau is a scumbag and a psychopath. I'm very glad he retired from MMA after losing his first two fights.

 

[lklawson]

OK, enough of this "Karate does have grappling/Karate doesn't have grappling" bullcrap.

Karateka, please do this; it will help qualify this argument and, hopefully, put to rest the entire thing.

1) Define what "grappling" means in the context of your art. Please be specific to include standing grabbing & hugging, takedowns, trips & throws, ground wrestling, joint locks & chokes and if they are taught standing or on the ground while wrastle'n.

2) Describe what grappling techniques your art teaches. A comprehensive or semi-comprehensive list would be helpful. The name and/or brief description of the technique and, again, if standing or ground wrastle'n. You know, "Rear Naked Choke, standing & ground," "Arm & Neck hip throw," and "mount and side-control." That kinda stuff.

3) Describe how the techniques are taught and practiced. Please include if the techniques are used in sparring and to what extent.

4) Describe when the techniques are taught in the general time-line of a student's training. Are they taught within the first few lessons or only after a certain belt-grade is achieved?

5) Please describe how often these techniques are trained during the normal course of training, such as "every class," or "a few times a month," or "occasionally during the year," or some similar description.

Thank you.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[drop bear]

I know there was a few minor groin shots and a head butt or two but I don't recall any fighter doing eye gouges or throat strikes in the early UFC. Perhaps you could point some out to me?

John Jones used them pretty effectively. But then he could also fight which is the trick here.

 

[Hanzou]

I know there was a few minor groin shots and a head butt or two but I don't recall any fighter doing eye gouges or throat strikes in the early UFC. Perhaps you could point some out to me?

Throat strikes were permitted in the early UFCs, and even more was permitted in the Vale Tudo fights before that.

Again, the results didn't change much. The same arts that dominate in modern NHB dominated back then as well.

 

[Buka]

Some of the posts here have been telling me what is and isn't in my art. When my art was first practiced, what works in it and what doesn't.

Okay, you smarty pantses, what did I have for lunch today?

 

[Tony Dismukes]

OK, enough of this "Karate does have grappling/Karate doesn't have grappling" bullcrap.

Karateka, please do this; it will help qualify this argument and, hopefully, put to rest the entire thing.

1) Define what "grappling" means in the context of your art. Please be specific to include standing grabbing & hugging, takedowns, trips & throws, ground wrestling, joint locks & chokes and if they are taught standing or on the ground while wrastle'n.

2) Describe what grappling techniques your art teaches. A comprehensive or semi-comprehensive list would be helpful. The name and/or brief description of the technique and, again, if standing or ground wrastle'n. You know, "Rear Naked Choke, standing & ground," "Arm & Neck hip throw," and "mount and side-control." That kinda stuff.

3) Describe how the techniques are taught and practiced. Please include if the techniques are used in sparring and to what extent.

4) Describe when the techniques are taught in the general time-line of a student's training. Are they taught within the first few lessons or only after a certain belt-grade is achieved?

5) Please describe how often these techniques are trained during the normal course of training, such as "every class," or "a few times a month," or "occasionally during the year," or some similar description.

Thank you.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

6) Specify what style of karate you practice.
7) If you have experience beyond your own dojo, please give your impression as to whether your answers for 1-5 apply just to your own dojo or are typical of what is widely practiced in your style.

 

[oftheherd1]

It is sometimes said that karate is not the best martial art for self-defense. Many people prefer Krav Maga and Jiu-Jitsu. An incident which occurred in India this year seems to prove otherwise: A girl which was attacked by two rapists magaged to beat them up so that they fled.

"The teenager punched them in the face, kicked them where it hurts most, left them bloody, battered and bewildered — and running for their lives. In Madhyamgram, the northern outskirts of Kolkata where molestation and rape are almost an everyday nightmare, the story of a fightback has turned this karate girl into an instant hero. (...)
Passersby stood stunned. Still no one came forward to help. The battered duo staggered to their feet, got back on their cycles and pedaled away, threatening to teach her a lesson. Local resident Shankari Haldar, who witnessed her in action, said, "I was stunned by her courage. She kicked and punched the youths and they fell flat. But it is unfortunate that they managed to flee. Other girls should also learn martial arts to keep such criminals at bay.""
Karate Girl Takes Down Would-Be Molesters With Well-Aimed Kicks
Karate girl kicks her way out of molesters’ clutches - The Times of India

How can Karate enable a smaller person to overpower two bigger persons? How could she do that? What do you think?

and so it goes on. Style X doesn't work because it failed in an early fixed UFC, style Y is better because 'I' do it and 'I'm' awesome, 'you're' talking rubbish, only 'I' know'. Okay guys, crack on, keep up the good work, in the meantime a young lady has kept her 'honour' and come out unscathed because she defended herself and apart from two other people here, no one cares because it's more important to bicker about style versus style. I'm done with this thread.

Well, I agree, in that I think this thread has degenerated, unfortunately an all too common occurrence. I even show the OP's original post above. His last sentence does question Karate's usefulness in overcoming "bigger persons", so I guess some discussion on that is proper.

I do wonder why there is no great interest the plight of women in that area, or even in the plight of the young lady in question? That takes up more of the original post than the last sentence. I also wonder about the OP. Have we scared him off, or was he trolling? He has made only that one post.

 

[RTKDCMB]

Okay, you smarty pantses, what did I have for lunch today?

Sandwiches.

 

[RTKDCMB]

Throat strikes were permitted in the early UFCs, and even more was permitted in the Vale Tudo fights before that.

They were permitted, but were they used?

 

[RTKDCMB]

John Jones used them pretty effectively.

Used throat strikes and eye gouges when?

 

[Hanzou]

They were permitted, but were they used?

I'm not seeing how that is a relevant question. If they were allowed and weren't used, that should indicate that they weren't viewed as effective. On the other hand, maybe they were used, and again, weren't viewed as very effective.

The point remains; If you lack too many advantages in a conflict, using a bunch of "dirty tricks" isn't going to save your hide.

 

[ballen0351]

OK, enough of this "Karate does have grappling/Karate doesn't have grappling" bullcrap

if you feel its bullcrap you know your free to not read it right?

 

[RTKDCMB]

I'm not seeing how that is a relevant question.

Then why did you bring it up?

If they were allowed and weren't used, that should indicate that they weren't viewed as effective. On the other hand, maybe they were used, and again, weren't viewed as very effective.

That is only two possibilities. On the other hand maybe they were viewed as too effective and that is why they were not used. If they weren't viewed as effective then there would be no need to ban them. If I put a guy down in a self defence situation and I do not stomp my foot through his head is it because I don't think it will be effective or because I don't want to kill him?

The point remains; If you lack too many advantages in a conflict, using a bunch of "dirty tricks" isn't going to save your hide.

One situation's dirty tricks is another situation's survival techniques.

In any case you are dodging the question; When Did Jon Jones use throat strikes and eye gouges? You are a stickler for wanting evidence that is not just anecdotal after all.

 

[drop bear]

Used throat strikes and eye gouges when?

Eyegouged a few guys. In the ufc.

 

[ballen0351]

Eyegouged a few guys. In the ufc.

poking someone in the eye isn't eye gouging

 

[RTKDCMB]

Eyegouged a few guys. In the ufc.

Is there a throat strike compilation? But done on purpose.

 

[drop bear]

Is there a throat strike compilation? But done on purpose.

Not really. I could find a couple where people got dropped but that would be about it.

 

[RTKDCMB]

Not really. I could find a couple where people got dropped but that would be about it.

What about in the early UFC or Vale Tudo? You would probably know where to look more than I do.