IKKA Website

[Nightingale]

The IKKA website has been removed...
( www.edparkersikka.com )
because someone turned a very similar address into a porn site. You can email me if you want the addy, cause I don't think the mods would let me post it.

Personally, I'm pretty pissed. I've got nothing against porn as a whole, but a porn site does not belong on a URL that contains EPAK's founder's name!

 

[Kirk]

This is public information, so I'm not posting anything
I shouldn't be. Anyways, the information originally
was:

Administrative Contact:
Gottlieb, John [email protected]
14 Airway Cir. 2c
Baltimore, MD 21286
US
410-642-1304

Technical Contact:
Gottlieb, John [email protected]
14 Airway Cir. 2c
Baltimore, MD 21286
US
410-642-1304

----------------------------

Don't know if he's a kenpoist or not, or who
this guy John Gottlieb is, but incidentally,
or coincidentally, the information changed
today. It now reads as:

Registrar: INTERCOSMOS MEDIA GROUP, INC. D/B/A DIRECTNIC.COM
Whois Server: whois.directnic.com
Referral URL: http://www.directnic.com
Name Server: NS1.4PH.COM
Name Server: NS2.4PH.COM
Updated Date: 12-aug-2002


Last update of whois database: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 04:59:35 EDT

updated this morning

 

[Les]

It's sad that things like this happen, as if it isn't enough that we get bombarded with e-mails for porn related websites, services, free passwords, webcam peeks etc.

Personally, sites like this hold no attraction for me, and as far as sex is concerned, it's like Kenpo. It's just not a spectator thing.

Hopefully, the Parker family will turn this to their advantage, and come back with a new, up to date website, including links that work.

Les

 

[Nightingale]

intercosmos/directnic has an abuse address...perhaps we could write letters?

[email protected]

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Who turned the site off? Their host? Something doesn't smell right here to me.....

If they're looking for a new host, someone let em know we got lots of room here. I can have em up and running in no time...Personally, I wouldn't mind hosting all the top names in the arts. (means they can pay their bills on time...heh)


I've got nothing against (most) porn, but the spammers have to go...... and so do clueless hosts who can't read email headers, or think for themselves. (Not saying this is the case here, but I've seen too much to be surprised anymore)

:asian:

 

[Nightingale]

From what I've been told, IKKA turned the site off themselves, because the other domain name is so incredibly similar (remove one letter) that they didn't want someone going to the other site accidentally.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

They may have grounds to get the other site turn off instead.

Questions are basically, who was there first, can they prove the other group was 'squating' on the similar name, do they themselves have legal rights to the domain name, etc.

Its sorta like Ford going after someone who registers fordsucks.com (been done) or who had registered gmsucks.com and pointed it at ford.com

 

[GouRonin]

Get on your cyber horse and chase them down. If you want a feather in your cap and something that will help you take off businesswise then contact them and tell them you can host it all for the low low price of XXX!

Also...send me the good porn ok?
:rofl:

 

[cdhall]

Originally posted by nightingale8472

The IKKA website has been removed...
( www.edparkersikka.com )
because someone turned a very similar address into a porn site
...
Personally, I'm pretty pissed....

You know, I've had a link to their site from my site for a long time and they used to own edparkerikka and then it went down because it expired or something and then they launched again with the "s" added to the name.

I don't think they should have let it expire in the first place, but I think because of the name they might have recourse.

I also have to agree with Les. Mabye the IKKA will develop a better site out of this and turn lemons into lemonade.
:asian:

 

[GouRonin]

I hate that. People will buy up domains that expire and then use them for porn sites in hopes that they can bring people there from previous traffic numbers.

I doubt that is what went on here but people do strange things.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I'm gonna say something, and some folks aint gonna like it....

MartialArtists are cheap sobs.

Domain Names and registration
goto godaddy.com register a domain name for $70 for 10 YEARS!

Thats 1-2 students lessons for 1 month. (or less than 1 weeks pay at McDonalds!)

Thats too much! was what 5 different MAists have told me in the last 2 months. Its $9 for 1 Year... or about 2 hrs pay at McD.

I'm sure that 99% of those teaching for pay make more than that for 1 30 min private.

I wanted to register Katana.com for a personal site....someone wanted $8,000 for it.... I picked something else..got it for $12/yr.

Hosting
How much does it cost to host a website? Most folks say "I can't afford it" and stick their sites on the ad-infested 'freebies' like geocities. Folks, I do hosting for martialarts sites... 1 yr is about $100-$150US (or about 3 students for 1 month or 30 hrs at McD) It aint that expensive...

I'll be blunt... if youre an international organization, and you don't own your name, and youre on a freebie host with a ton of pop-ups and banner ads that you have no control over, how professional does that really look? For $160US (Tax deductable as advertizing I might add) you can at least have a professionally hosted website. If your organization can't afford that...well....

Check these sites out:
www.hukplanas.com
www.jkkenpo.com
www.wmarnis.com
www.internationalkenpo.com

These are some that we've done besides MartialTalk.

I'm sorry if I pissed anyone off, but there is simply no reason why -any- school, instructor or organization should have to lose their website to some spammers. I know this looks like a blatent ad, but man, theres way too many bad sites out there, and too many honest good folks get the shaft because they weren't taken care of right by their web guys...If you're host/designer can't hack it, call me....I'll make sure you get treated right. We're all friends here, and friends take care of friends.

:asian:

 

[WilliamTLear]

The original IKKA URL was bought by a Kenpo practitioner, and operated as a forwarding address for the better part of a couple of years. It had an advertisement banner that appeared at the bottom while you were able to view the "REAL" page in a frame. I think it was set up to pay the owner for each hit on the site or something like that (much like the different marketing programs of today that pay people to surf the web).

Thing is he lost the URL, and this guy John Gottlieb now owns it.

Here is the rest of his information (public information)
[email protected]
14 Airway Cir. 2c
Baltimore, MD 21286
US
410-642-1304

 

[Michael Billings]

Good job Billy. Thanks for the info, a few emails might be appropriate. After all, we all need a hobby, hee-hee.

RE: HOSTING
Kirk, I use register.com for Domain forwarding, but I do not have them hosting. I do pay a little more for no banners or ads on my site. That way I can pick and chose what I put on there. I assume your price include hosting and/or registration and URL forwarding (which is what I do.)

I don't particularly want to host since I am using a cable modem. I have a firewall and several layers of defense, but just don't want to have to worry about it. Besides, power goes out at my site more than once a month. I do have a UPS, but it would not last long, and the site would go down. Hence the URL forwarding instead of hosting myself.

Yes school owner's are cheap. Especially when we usually don't get business off the internet ... it is much more of a resource for my students. I do get some, but it is usually a result of my location or yellow pages add, then they look up the URL. It would be a completely different deal if I had multiple locations or were head of an Association. Associations have to make the investment I would think. In fact I would probably gut it up and host myself if I were an Association. I am not an IT guy and know just enough to be dangerous ... to myself, or worse, to friends who ask me advice. You have to distinguish between businesses that generate revenue off the internet, or that internet traffic drives business to their site and personal service businesses. Think about a gym, or other exercise business. Some internet traffic, but not enough to pay someone to design, host, etc. It is a cost benefit kinda thing. Sometimes the up front cost is prohibitive (professional design, CitySearch wanted to do mine. Lots of money for not much.)

Got off track, sorry about that. Hopefully, not too many people will keep on this thread for long.

:soapbox: SORRY
-MIchael

 

[Kirk]

Okay, that was Kaith, not Kirk
Innocent mistake. I don't do hosting services, too many
headaches.

 

[WilliamTLear]

I know some of the facts, because I was there when it happened. The credit for finding out the information on John Gottlieb lies with Kirk. He da man! The Super Spy Killah of da Kenpo Clan in Texas (Not to be confused with the Klan of course).

Take Care,
Billy Lear

 

[cdhall]

Originally posted by Kaith Rustaz

I'm gonna say something, and some folks aint gonna like it....

I'll be blunt... if youre an international organization, and you don't own your name, and youre on a freebie host with a ton of pop-ups and banner ads that you have no control over, how professional does that really look? For $160US (Tax deductable as advertizing I might add) you can at least have a professionally hosted website. If your organization can't afford that...well....

I'm sorry if I pissed anyone off, but there is simply no reason why -any- school, instructor or organization should have to lose their website to some spammers.

You go Bob. I was alluding to this when I said

I don't think they should have let it expire in the first place...

I host 7 domains myself. I found a cheap place that will register them for free if you host with them and they will host you for $0.25/mo. The plan most of my domains use is $5.00/mo though. These people have caused me some problems in the past, but they are cheap and the cost/benefit is OK so far. I'm planning to move out en masse though if my partner and I buy our own server.

I think it is a crime that the International Kenpo Karate Association lost its website to someone because they didn't know they could spend $17/yr to point their name to a second URL which they could get for $5/mo.

While I agree that a lot of Martial Artists are cheap, I think more of them are poor businesspeople. I mean, if you get 1 student off your website then I can set you up so that it makes a profit for 2 years. Good Lord.

This just happened the other day, someone emailed me to ask where they should take Kenpo. They found me on the web. But I digress. I'm not a great business person myself either so I understand where some of these guys are coming from.

But the IKKA sites all "needed work" so I don't know if it was a complete loss all things considered.
:shrug:

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Alot of the folks I've talked to usually have a student do their site in exchange for lessons. Its a simple time exchange, and lets be honest, in most cases, the school owner comes out ahead.

The problem is of course, when that student leaves, or you decide to do something beyond their skills. Almost anyone can slap a site together in a few hours using Frontpage or the free sitebuilder tools many hosts provide. Of course, you often end up with a site that either looks slapped together or like everyone elses, just in blue, not red.

The other side of the spectrum is where you pay 10's of thousands of bucks for the same thing. I've seen the work that the folks with NAPMA do... it all looks the same to me, and they charge $15k+

Is either one good? Depends. I look at a website the same way I would walking in your door. If you have a ton of junk by the door, the floors a mess, and the guy teachings wearing half his lunch, I aint training there....and Im sure many others wouldn't either.

My personal belief if that your school/organization is unique, so you should have a site that reflects you, not someone else with some cosmetic tweaks.


Michael, We've had about 15 minutes total downtime in the last 6 months. Quality hosts have backup generators, redundant connections, etc. Full specs on what we offer is at our biz site, or ya can click the banner on the support forum.

You are right, 95% of your students will find you thru your local advertizing. What I tell school owners is to use their websites as an information source for their students, and a 'teaser' for perspectives. Put up an image gallery of past events, belt promotions, test schedules, video clips or even a virtual tour of the school. It becomes a full time sales tool, but one of many you should be using. Biz cards, flyers, brochures, signage, community events and involvement and a web presence. All combine to help market you and your organization. A good developer will help ya see the potential and advise you on how to best use it.


Put another way, you get what you pay for. If you go the cheep route, it won't produce as well as you'd like. For a pro look and push, ya go with a reliable pro. BUT! do your homework...I've yet to see any martial arts site (federation or otherwise) worth more than $3-5k, with most in the sub-$1k range.

Heck, I can slap a 1pg no-email site together and host it for a year dirt cheap $50 US ($78 CAN). (Add $15 for domain reg if ya need it) Ya want more? lets haggle

Of course, if you can run it yourself, more power to ya. Most of the MA folks I've talked with aren't the most PC savvy of folks. I thought about running a site off my home DSL, but reconsidered after a 15 min outage 1 day. With the traffic MT gets, I need the reliable box and datacenter support. (This place is busy!) Bottom line is though, if it works for you, then its good. I just think there are soo many good sites out there, they just need a 'nudge' or 2 and they could really rock.


As to the IKKA folks, tell em to contact a lawyer familiar with Domain Dispute policies and ICAAN (sp) regs. They may be able to get things corrected in their favor.
:asian:

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Some interesting notes:

edparkersikka.com is blocked from archival on archive.org


doing a 'DIG' on edparkersikka.com turned up the following:

; <<>> DiG 8.3 <<>> edparkersikka.com ANY
;; res options: init recurs defnam dnsrch
;; got answer:
;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 4
;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 2, ADDITIONAL: 2
;; QUERY SECTION:
;; edparkersikka.com, type = ANY, class = IN

;; ANSWER SECTION:
edparkersikka.com. 2D IN NS NS1.ULTSEARCH.com.
edparkersikka.com. 2D IN NS NS2.ULTSEARCH.com.

;; AUTHORITY SECTION:
edparkersikka.com. 2D IN NS NS1.ULTSEARCH.com.
edparkersikka.com. 2D IN NS NS2.ULTSEARCH.com.

;; ADDITIONAL SECTION:
NS1.ULTSEARCH.com. 2D IN A 213.130.63.232
NS2.ULTSEARCH.com. 2D IN A 212.100.230.160

;; Total query time: 14 msec
;; FROM: wega to SERVER: default -- 127.0.0.1
;; WHEN: Thu Oct 10 03:48:05 2002
;; MSG SIZE sent: 35 rcvd: 141

Or in english, ultsearch.com has control of the name....

a detailed 'whois' on it shows this:

The domain registrar is MELBOURNE IT, LTD. D/B/A INTERNET NAMES WORLDWIDE



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Domain Name.......... edparkersikka.com
Creation Date........ 2002-10-06
Registration Date.... 2002-10-06
Expiry Date.......... 2003-10-06
Organisation Name.... Ultimate Search
Organisation Address. GPO Box 7862
Organisation Address.
Organisation Address. Central
Organisation Address. NA
Organisation Address. HK
Organisation Address. HONG KONG

Admin Name........... DNS Support
Admin Address........ GPO Box 7862
Admin Address........
Admin Address........ Central
Admin Address........ NA
Admin Address........ HK
Admin Address........ HONG KONG
Admin Email.......... [email protected]
Admin Phone.......... 852 2537 9677
Admin Fax............

Tech Name............ DNS Support
Tech Address......... GPO box 7862
Tech Address.........
Tech Address......... Central
Tech Address......... NA
Tech Address......... HK
Tech Address......... HONG KONG
Tech Email........... [email protected]
Tech Phone........... +1.85225379677
Tech Fax.............
Name Server.......... ns1.ultsearch.com
Name Server.......... ns2.ultsearch.com

The current IP addy is 213.130.63.232 which is a shared ip. Looks like someones squatting on the name to suck traffic off it... possiblly something a little legal push could resolve. You stand a better chance of winning if you can prove that:
1- You have a right to the name
2- They dont
3- You've done business under that name before
4- They havent
5- The name applies to your industry
6- The name does-Not apply to theirs

 

[Michael Billings]

I really like the MartialTalk format ... if I have not complimented you before, then I was remiss. It is an excellent site and forum, and I even agree with most of the moderation most of the time (Better than at my work or home even.)

I understand the financial side and good presentation. I am an administrative law judge, not a businessman, and never intend to be. I have a small school that I can almost run as a club. It has a limit of 35 students due to space restrictions and my availablability to teach. I teach 3 classes a day Tues & Thurs, and 2 on Saturdays. I neither need, nor want, the extra business, but try not to turn away a good potential student.

CitySearch did a slick good sales job, I just did not need what it offered. But I think for large commercial schools or Association's, a professional looking, informative, fast website is a must. I was not trying to be cheap, but the reality is my site was for my 4th Black Thesis, and was my 2nd evolution, but completely redone and expanded. My next step will be to move over to Dreamweaver, although I don't like the load time for frames or Flash stuff I want to include. Just finished a site for my teacher Tommy Burks, and he wanted to use Front Page (yuk), so I learned how to do it, and it went up today. Not real happy about some of the choices he wanted in terms of appearance, but the customer is always right ... especially if he out ranks you by a couple of stripes.

This has been a good thread for advice and some expertise for people and association owners. Can I recommend copying relevant parts of this thread over to General and Business Threads? It would be especially helpful to young instructors, somwhat computer literate, who are trying to start-up a site. Shameless if one of you has to do it for him. Hee-hee.

Yall have a good one, from the live music capitol of the world, and ex-silicon valley clone - Austin, Texas.

-Michael

 

[GouRonin]

The www.ikka.com website is for precision injected moulded parts.

I wonder how many people went there the first time the looked for the IKKA?

Kaith has a pretty good service going. If I was going to get a webpage done for myself I would do it except, 1) I don't have anything I want to put up professionally, 2) it's in USA dollars. But he does good work.