Hapki Yu Kwon Sool- The Martial Art of Choi Young Sul

Jinmukwan

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I wanted to make a post about the traditional Hapki Yu Kwon Sool of Founder Choi Young Sul!

Much false information has been posted about hapkido/ Hapki Yu Kwon Sool over the years!

I wanted to ask what is your connection to Founder Choi and what is your opinion how is it different from less traditional hapkido?
 

oftheherd1

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A lot of information on Hapkido for sure. Much of it I think a little incorrect and more truth stretching imho.

Not enough information on Hapki Yu Kwon Sool I guess, since I don't ever remember having heard of it. Perhaps you could give some information on it and the difference between it and Hapkido?

I personally would be most interested in differences between the two than attempts to show which might be more or less "correct" or "traditional." After all, it is acknowledged to have come from Dai Ito Ryu and then had some Korean MA influences added.
 

Gweilo

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From what I was taught, Hapki Yun Kwon sool or sul, was the name he gave his art, after he called it Yawara, to give the art a Korean sounding name, after a long winded name of Da Dong Ryu yu sool, which is Korean for Daito Ryu.
 

Gweilo

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Just got back from training, Suh, Bok Sup, Choi s 1st black belt had a knowledge do judo, and I was told was the beginnings of some techniques in Hapkido, and went on to open a school in Hapki kwon yu sool, which is Daito ryu with elements of judo.
 

skribs

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Much false information has been posted about hapkido/ Hapki Yu Kwon Sool over the years!

What false claims are you referring to? What claims have been made, and why are they false?
 

Gweilo

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I am wondering if he is talking about the many adaptations of Hapkido available today, like combat Hapkido, or recently I have seen ads for Hapkido Karate, it's not the Hapkido I was taught, but I guess things move on, I am not a fan of these modern takes on the art, but I guess traditional don't pay the bills.
 

skribs

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I am wondering if he is talking about the many adaptations of Hapkido available today, like combat Hapkido, or recently I have seen ads for Hapkido Karate, it's not the Hapkido I was taught, but I guess things move on, I am not a fan of these modern takes on the art, but I guess traditional don't pay the bills.

"Hapkido Karate". Why not "Aikijutsu Karate" or "Hapkido Tang Soo Do"?
 

Gweilo

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Maybe for yourself, that's Ok, but why trade off other names, Yes Ok arts evolve, but evolve the name.
 

skribs

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Maybe for yourself, that's Ok, but why trade off other names, Yes Ok arts evolve, but evolve the name.

It makes more sense if they both come from the same place, at least to me.

Although with all that said, we kind of blend TKD and HKD at my school, even though they each have their separate classes. Every once in a while, I'll get to mix them when I spar, and it works really well.
 

Gweilo

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It makes more sense if they both come from the same place, at least to me.

Although with all that said, we kind of blend TKD and HKD at my school, even though they each have their separate classes. Every once in a while, I'll get to mix them when I spar, and it works really well.

I think it's great, that you mix your arts, or add HKD techniques to your locker of TKD, but Hapkido Karate, the 2 philosophies are only similar in a small proportion, the linear style of Karate with the circular style of Hapkido would only work with HKD hard elements, leaving the other 5/8 soft elements redundant IMO, but I am sure you could blend certain karate styles with elements of HKD, and if you are that creative, then surely it's not difficult to come up with a name, even Hapki te, or Karatido. The Hapkido story is contested enough.
 

skribs

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I think it's great, that you mix your arts, or add HKD techniques to your locker of TKD, but Hapkido Karate, the 2 philosophies are only similar in a small proportion, the linear style of Karate with the circular style of Hapkido would only work with HKD hard elements, leaving the other 5/8 soft elements redundant IMO, but I am sure you could blend certain karate styles with elements of HKD, and if you are that creative, then surely it's not difficult to come up with a name, even Hapki te, or Karatido. The Hapkido story is contested enough.

Unless you use the circles to give you the best lines to attack. Like the letter G.
 

skribs

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Then Imo, it would be easier to use the hard techniques of hkd

At my school, there are no hard parts of Hapkido, because we do that stuff in Taekwondo. 75% of our Hapkido students are black belts in TKD. Half of us are somewhere in 2nd-4th degree range.
 

Gweilo

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So the hard strikes and kicks have been replaced with tkd elements, I can see that working because of the taek kyon elements, and some of the hand strikes, but are there some of the kicks you don't use, I have not trained tkd, do you use, what hkd calls shovel kicks, reverse low spinning kicks, crescent and arc kicks, hammer fist, ridge hand, crab claw.
 

skribs

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So the hard strikes and kicks have been replaced with tkd elements, I can see that working because of the taek kyon elements, and some of the hand strikes, but are there some of the kicks you don't use, I have not trained tkd, do you use, what hkd calls shovel kicks, reverse low spinning kicks, crescent and arc kicks, hammer fist, ridge hand, crab claw.

No. The hapkido class simply doesn't include them at all.
 

Gweilo

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So the Hapkido you was taught, did not include, a soft hard style,
 

adamr01

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When I was studying Taekwondo, it was WTF style, but they offered a "Hapkido" class to advanced students. This consisted mostly of front rolls and falling techniques, and was looked at as an add-on to their main curriculum which was TKD. It wasn't until a friend of mine showed me what he was learning from this Hapkido Grandmaster named Chin Il Chang, that my world changed. I had never experienced joint locks before, and after my friend demonstrated on me all of the techniques he learned as a white belt, it became clear to me that real Hapkido was WAY bigger that what my TKD school was presenting as Hapkido. It wasn't long after that, that I quit TKD and started training Hapkido.
 

skribs

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When I was studying Taekwondo, it was WTF style, but they offered a "Hapkido" class to advanced students. This consisted mostly of front rolls and falling techniques, and was looked at as an add-on to their main curriculum which was TKD. It wasn't until a friend of mine showed me what he was learning from this Hapkido Grandmaster named Chin Il Chang, that my world changed. I had never experienced joint locks before, and after my friend demonstrated on me all of the techniques he learned as a white belt, it became clear to me that real Hapkido was WAY bigger that what my TKD school was presenting as Hapkido. It wasn't long after that, that I quit TKD and started training Hapkido.

Our Taekwondo includes the rolls and falls. The Hapkido is mostly wrist locks, takedowns, and submissions.
 

oftheherd1

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Our Taekwondo includes the rolls and falls. The Hapkido is mostly wrist locks, takedowns, and submissions.

A teacher can decide what he wants to teach in any martial art he decides to teach. I don't think it is bad to combine what is learned in TKDk with knowledge of some aspects of Hapkido. But there is more to Hapkido that wrist locks, takedowns, and submissions. That said, some of those things may be taught at your school with your teacher combining them into those three aspects.
 

skribs

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A teacher can decide what he wants to teach in any martial art he decides to teach. I don't think it is bad to combine what is learned in TKDk with knowledge of some aspects of Hapkido. But there is more to Hapkido that wrist locks, takedowns, and submissions. That said, some of those things may be taught at your school with your teacher combining them into those three aspects.

So, I don't know if you've been part of threads where I talk about the size of my TKD school, but the HKD class is a much smaller population. Our active members include (in order from highest to lowest rank in HKD)
  1. 1st dan in TKD
  2. 3rd dan in TKD (me)
  3. 2nd dan in TKD
  4. 3rd/4th dan in TKD (KKW/ATA)
  5. 1st dan in TKD
  6. Green belt in TKD
  7. 3rd dan in TKD
  8. Orange belt in TKD
So...we know how to strike.
 

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