Guns are flying off the shelves

[Korppi76]

Well few small questions, as I don't live in USA so I am not quite sure how things are:

a) What kind of regulations there are now about what kind of guns you can purchase?
b) What kind of ban there will/would/might come?

From outside it just seems... odd that people needs to hoard (right word?) guns and ammunitions.

 

[Cryozombie]

a) What kind of regulations there are now about what kind of guns you can purchase?
b) What kind of ban there will/would/might come?

From outside it just seems... odd that people needs to hoard (right word?) guns and ammunitions.

a) It varies from state to state.

b) In the past, Biden (Our New VP) went thru a picture book of firearms and said "oooh, that looks scary, must be a machine gun, It's now illegal" regardless of the function. This included not only military rifles, military "looking" rifles, but also some single shot hunting shotguns and various other sporting weapons for which he was askeered of the way they looked.

As to hoarding... People who don't want to lose the ability to hunt, recreational shoot, and who also understand the rulings here in the United States that our Police have no duty to protect us, are stocking up before it happens again so when it comes down the pipe they are prepared.

 

[Korppi76]

a) It varies from state to state.

b) In the past, Biden (Our New VP) went thru a picture book of firearms and said "oooh, that looks scary, must be a machine gun, It's now illegal" regardless of the function. This included not only military rifles, military "looking" rifles, but also some single shot hunting shotguns and various other sporting weapons for which he was askeered of the way they looked.

As to hoarding... People who don't want to lose the ability to hunt, recreational shoot, and who also understand the rulings here in the United States that our Police have no duty to protect us, are stocking up before it happens again so when it comes down the pipe they are prepared.

Ok thanks.
I would say I can understand if they want to ban military machine guns but I dont see point with those hunting or non military guns.

 

[KenpoTex]

Ok thanks.
I would say I can understand if they want to ban military machine guns but I dont see point with those hunting or non military guns.

There is no good reason to ban "military type" weapons either...

 

[Grenadier]

a) It varies from state to state.

b) In the past, Biden (Our New VP) went thru a picture book of firearms and said "oooh, that looks scary, must be a machine gun, It's now illegal" regardless of the function. This included not only military rifles, military "looking" rifles, but also some single shot hunting shotguns and various other sporting weapons for which he was askeered of the way they looked.

He certainly did! He even looked at the DPMS pump-action rifle, that has a cosmetic similarity to the AR-15, yet in his absolute ignorance, he didn't know that this gun required that you cycle the slide between each shot.

Then again, most of his similarly anti-gun friends think similarly...

 

[allenjp]

I would call myself a liberal but at the same time I am very pro- "right to bear arms." The ultimate irony of the quote above is that studies have shown that the vast majority of criminals get thier guns from the street, friends, etc., not gun shops/shows.
Here's a wild idea: Don't ban guns, enforce the gun laws that are already in place.

Preaching to the choir my friend, preaching to the f-ing choir. Many of us have been shouting this from the rooftops for many years now. Especially here in cali(gun control)fronia.

 

[allenjp]

Well few small questions, as I don't live in USA so I am not quite sure how things are:

a) What kind of regulations there are now about what kind of guns you can purchase?
b) What kind of ban there will/would/might come?

From outside it just seems... odd that people needs to hoard (right word?) guns and ammunitions.

Welcome to the U.S. (well, sort of).

I don't know how things are in Finland, but here in the states the right of the public to bear arms was established at the foundation of the country, and it was because the men who wrote the constitution understood that denying the public access to weapons is how many tyrannical governments keep control over their population. Banning the colonists from having weapons was one of the ways the British kept control here before we won our independence. It was so important to them that they put the law into the constitution of this nation right along with the right to free speech, the right to vote, etc...

Because of this law, and the inherent ruggedness of the population here, many, many people excersize their right to keep firearms. But some people here think that we shouldn't have that right because they think that firearms are inherently bad, evil, dangerous, or whatever, and that the only reason someone would have them is because they like violence and want to shoot people.

The problem is that statistics prove over and over again that the overwhelming majority of gun owners are very responsible with their weapons and don't cause problems. They just live out their lives and for many of them you never even know they own guns.

But of course criminals, people who would use firearms for illegal or immoral purposes, don't honor the law. So, if you pass laws that ban guns, the law abiding citizens who wouldn't do anything illegal with their guns anyway, won't have them because it's now against the law. In which case, now ONLY the bad guys, criminals, have guns that they obtained illegally in the first place. And all too many of us know that you cannot rely on the police in every bad situation. That is why we train MA or self defense in the first place.

As far as hoarding, I'm not sure what you mean by that. If you like lawn gnomes, and you have four hundred of them, are you "hoarding" them? No, you're just collecting them. While some might not understand why you would want so many lawn gnomes, or what you're going to do with them, no one would say you were evil, or bad for that. But of course lawn gnomes don't carry the same stigma with them as guns do for many people. Many of us enjoy target shooting, hunting, and other such benign shooting sports. If we happen to have a lot of guns, does that have to mean that we want to overthrow the government, or do some other bad thing with them? Of course not. We just want to do what is fun for us, and at the same time not HAVE to rely ONLY on the police if someone wants to do harm to our loved ones.

Hope this helps you to understand things here a little better...I tried to keep it as concise as possible.

 

[Frostbite]

Ok thanks.
I would say I can understand if they want to ban military machine guns but I dont see point with those hunting or non military guns.

The logic behind banning "military" style weapons is that it would prevent crime and help protect public safety. Apparently none of the lawmakers behind the ban read the crime statistics that indicated that most gun crimes aren't committed using AR15s. In fact, as I stated in another thread a large number of gun crimes are committed using a revolver so even the argument against high capacity magazines is specious, at best.

Basically the assault weapons ban was a way for lawmakers to give the impression they were tough on crime, when, in point of fact, its actual effect on crime was negligible. Rifles in general are pretty impractical for the vast majority of crimes people commit with guns but since AR15s and the like are "scary looking" it was an easy target for the ban. Criminals generally want something easy to conceal and dispose of if necessary. The fact is, you can't stick an AR15 down the front of your pants and even if you could, your average thug couldn't afford one anyway.

 

[allenjp]

And if they could afford one, they certainly wouldn't be throwing it away after committing a crime with it...

 

[CDA4555]

Get your rifles while you can. The next four years should have a multitude of laws that will get the guns out of your homes while the bad guys have the top of the line gear. Just my opinion.

 

[Deaf Smith]

CDNN just upped their prices of magazines for pistols. Bummer. But luckly for me, the local shops I find used Glock mags for $20. Will pick another one up tomorrow. Never can have to many magazines.

Deaf

 

[Frostbite]

Never can have to many magazines.

If you own more magazines than rounds of ammo for those magazines, that might be too many. Otherwise, you're right on.

 

[atinsley]

And if there is eventually an outright ban, they will be able to find out about anything you bought on a 4473 since (IIRC) the dealer has to retain that form and turn over all his records if he ever goes out of business. (de facto registration?)

FFL holders must retain the 4473 in their bound-book the entire time they are in business and are required to surrender the log to the BATF upon closing the business.

With that form, the BATF can determine that you purchased the firearm, but they cannot determine if you still have it. Private party sales are legal and do not require any paperwork in most states. I know that Colorado does not require the registration of firearms nor permits to have them, so no other paperwork would exist showing ownership/possession of the firearm.

 

[Korppi76]

Welcome to the U.S. (well, sort of).

I don't know how things are in Finland... <good description how things work in USA>.

Thanks that cleared things up.

One more question:
What is considered those military weapons? It looks like military weapon or it is something like 12,7mm machine gun?



In Finland we have to have license to buy guns. But it used to be quite easy to get license.
But anyway we can get almost all kind of rifles as long as they are semi auto. Rifles and shotguns were easiest to get.
Two main reasons to get license are hunting and army reserve training. (By law every person who has been in army, has to keep up his/her skills with guns.)
Pistols and revolvers were little bit harder to get.
Machine pistols or short rifles(?) need some good reasons.

 

[sgtmac_46]

At the end of the day they can take away weapons but they cannot take away training.

If tomorrow all my guns were gone it would be at best a temporary setback.

At the end of the day they can only TAKE what you give them.

 

[sgtmac_46]

Are we talking actual proof of a ban or just right wing paranoia here? If I want to go out and buy a shotgun, I'll find a way to do it.

Paranoia?

" I think it is a scandal that this president did not authorize a renewal of the assault weapons ban." -Barack Obama

• Principles that Obama supports on gun issues:
• Ban the sale or transfer of all forms of semi-automatic weapons.
• Increase state restrictions on the purchase and possession of firearms.
• Require manufacturers to provide child-safety locks with firearms.

Source: 1998 IL State Legislative National Political Awareness Test Jul 2, 1998
http://www.ontheissues.org/Gun_Control.htm

Paranoia or simply taking Barry-boy at his word?

 

[sgtmac_46]

I would call myself a liberal but at the same time I am very pro- "right to bear arms." The ultimate irony of the quote above is that studies have shown that the vast majority of criminals get thier guns from the street, friends, etc., not gun shops/shows.
Here's a wild idea: Don't ban guns, enforce the gun laws that are already in place.

This may come as a shock......but the idea of actually ENFORCING gun laws against felons in possession of firearms is something that folks like Obama have NO INTENTION of doing......because it flies in the face of ANOTHER principle they hold......that such enforcement would DISPROPORTIONATELY incarcerate felons of color.

As such they have a fantasy of banning GUNS without punishing criminals. They want to attack gun makers, gun sellers, and legal gun owners.......ANYONE but the criminals themselves. They have a fantasy that they can stop the violence by targeting inanimate objects, NOT by targeting those actually engaged in the violence.


Reverend Jeremiah Wright made it clear what he thinks of any laws that will result in minority criminals being sent to prison.

 

[Cryozombie]

Ban the sale or transfer of all forms of semi-automatic weapons

This begs the question... D'ya think that these legislators, Biden, Obama, etc...

Know what Semi-auto means, or do they just hear the "auto" part and assume it's a "machine gun" or do they know, and just play stupid to get what they want?

 

[allenjp]

Get your rifles while you can. The next four years should have a multitude of laws that will get the guns out of your homes while the bad guys have the top of the line gear. Just my opinion.

Just about any semi-auto rifle worth having has been banned in CA for years now. So if anyone wants to know what this feels like just ask me. Oh wait...maybe I can sum it up for you...IT SUCKS!!!

 

[allenjp]

Thanks that cleared things up.

One more question:
What is considered those military weapons? It looks like military weapon or it is something like 12,7mm machine gun?

See, it's hard to say because the laws that govern firearm restrictions are state laws. There are 50 states and the laws can be VERY different for each one. The U.S. constitution guarantees the right to OWN firearms, and that's about it. They leave it up to the individual states to decide what types of firearms you can buy, whether or not you can carry them around with you, etc...But everyone pretty much has the right to buy a gun. No license needed, but once you purchase the gun you have to wait 10 to 15 days to actually take possession of it, during which time they do a criminal background check on you to make sure you're not a convicted criminal.

I live in California, which is generally much more restrictive on guns than, say, Arizona or Texas...