Doc Chapel
- Thread starter Doc
- Start date
M
MartialArtsGuy
Guest
Hey Doc its been a while.
I noticed that your curriculum does not resemble the standard 32, 24, or 16.
MY question is, did you ever teach those above and what insight caused you to make changes?
Also in another thread you spoke of synapes and other "stuff" that has to do with our Central and peripheral nervous systems. My question is can you give me some information regarding what effect training has on it, and how it relates to our ability to fight better. I guess im asking about what causes our body to learn and us to get better. I figure if i understand the process, i can pick the best training methods.
Thanks Doc
I noticed that your curriculum does not resemble the standard 32, 24, or 16.
MY question is, did you ever teach those above and what insight caused you to make changes?
Also in another thread you spoke of synapes and other "stuff" that has to do with our Central and peripheral nervous systems. My question is can you give me some information regarding what effect training has on it, and how it relates to our ability to fight better. I guess im asking about what causes our body to learn and us to get better. I figure if i understand the process, i can pick the best training methods.
Thanks Doc
Brother John
Senior Master
You might have better luck sending him a private message with your questions....... or seek out his website.
Generally, if he's got the time, he's good about answering Almost any question.
Your Brother
John
Generally, if he's got the time, he's good about answering Almost any question.
Your Brother
John
M
MartialArtsGuy
Guest
Maybe your right, but he visits frequently, so ill just be patient.
OP
OP
Doc
Senior Master
I have been using, with Ed ParkerÂ’s approval, a 16-technique format since about the mid seventies. Most recently I have added 6 techniques to the 101 (yellow) to balance the charts as well as address issues I felt important in the first course.
I have additionally added techniques at various levels to further examine scenarios previously excluded for various reasons. Slashing blades, blades held to the throat or behind the back, handguns held high and sideways “street style,” along with “long gun” rifles and shotguns front and rear, along with arm bar chokes from the rear, are examples.
Most teach and train in “soft muscle memory.” That is physical movement whose synaptic pathways are not “hardened” to the effects of an “Adrenal Dump,” and subsequent “Adrenal Stress Syndrome.” Proper anatomical movement alone may produce a “chi” effect, but is not sufficient to insure the ability to react properly under pressure.
The addition of significant stress repeatedly with proper corrective measures of all movement will yield over time, “hardened” synaptic pathways. That is the only way “Muscle Memory” impervious to the chemical effects of an adrenal dump can be attained, and the ability to react in what will have become a hardened natural reaction to external stimulus.
Therefore instruction in self-defense scenarios under stress is a mandated part of the learning process. This physical process is rather common in military and civilian law enforcement training, and I have personally used it in teaching since 1970.
Commercial business schools tend to shy away from this type of physically demanding, and psychologically and emotionally stressful training which is not suitable for children or those who can or will not tolerate a certain level of purposeful emotional stress and realistic physical interaction. That would be a significant part of most schools business.
M
MartialArtsGuy
Guest
Thanks Doc, I know of stress training and it is a part of my training but i was never too sure of why it works, or how it worked in our bodies. I spent a semester in a physiology & anatamy class learing about the nervous system and motor neurons, and various other systems. On a superficial level, knowing how these individual systems worked still did not give me a clear understanding of how it applied to our martial arts training. Things are alot more clear now. I feel this general subject is very important for martial artists to know about. Chances are an attack will be stressfull and being able to work through that is what we will have to do.
As of now the only real adrenaline dumping thing i do in training is all out, good old fashion hard sparring/rolling. I also work on a psychological approach to help me relax while in these situations. This relaxation training helps alot and is mainly from my Systema exposure.
Thanks again Doc :asian:
As of now the only real adrenaline dumping thing i do in training is all out, good old fashion hard sparring/rolling. I also work on a psychological approach to help me relax while in these situations. This relaxation training helps alot and is mainly from my Systema exposure.
Thanks again Doc :asian:
K
Kenpomachine
Guest
Can you expand on this? Give some techniques.
Most relaxation techniques I've learnt are static and not dinamic. I even have problems when I feel an asthma attack coming... But that's mainly because I don't want to stop training unless I'm completely breathless
M
MartialArtsGuy
Guest
Try keeping a smile, or smirk on your face while sparring. Many times having a smile on your face is associated with good things in your mind. So the psychology basicly works like that. When you are afraid you hardly are smiling. By smiling you hope to bring about some of the positve emotions that come with it. It sounds silly but it works. Breathing helps too. I work my adrenaline training from too fronts.
A. Learn to operate effectively even in the presence of an adrenaline dump (by training in stressfull situations=what me and Doc were talking about)
B. Learn to lessen the effects of the dump by decreasing the intensity of the dump (this is where developing a mastery of your own psychological situation come in handy= smiling & breathing having realistic self-confidence)
While I was in the military tasks were completed because they had to be, regardless of the situation. It was weird, almost like thinking to yourself, ok im afraid, bad things could happen, but I have a job to do. In the street that job is not getting killed by a murderer, rapist, robber, regardless of how you feel.
Up to recently I only knew that it worked. I'm now learning the details behind why and how it works in the body. It involves some science, but I think it's interesting.
As an unrelated example: Recently I had to break up a vicious dog fight. The environment made it pretty much impossible to do it in a perferred manner. So I knowingly did it a "not so safe way". My heart was racing, my temperature was up, the adrenaline was pumping. Dogs can do horrible damage to a person. Even though i was in this state, i had a job to do, and i did it. I only had a tiny cut on my thumb from who knows what. I could not let my dog or my girlfreinds dog die or being gravely injured. Even though i was in this state of mind i responded effectively. It was automatic, it seemed to happen fast and in slow motion at the same time. At the moment i did not think in words, but in urges and feelings. Its hard to explain. But I know it works.
A. Learn to operate effectively even in the presence of an adrenaline dump (by training in stressfull situations=what me and Doc were talking about)
B. Learn to lessen the effects of the dump by decreasing the intensity of the dump (this is where developing a mastery of your own psychological situation come in handy= smiling & breathing having realistic self-confidence)
While I was in the military tasks were completed because they had to be, regardless of the situation. It was weird, almost like thinking to yourself, ok im afraid, bad things could happen, but I have a job to do. In the street that job is not getting killed by a murderer, rapist, robber, regardless of how you feel.
Up to recently I only knew that it worked. I'm now learning the details behind why and how it works in the body. It involves some science, but I think it's interesting.
As an unrelated example: Recently I had to break up a vicious dog fight. The environment made it pretty much impossible to do it in a perferred manner. So I knowingly did it a "not so safe way". My heart was racing, my temperature was up, the adrenaline was pumping. Dogs can do horrible damage to a person. Even though i was in this state, i had a job to do, and i did it. I only had a tiny cut on my thumb from who knows what. I could not let my dog or my girlfreinds dog die or being gravely injured. Even though i was in this state of mind i responded effectively. It was automatic, it seemed to happen fast and in slow motion at the same time. At the moment i did not think in words, but in urges and feelings. Its hard to explain. But I know it works.
K
Kenpomachine
Guest
The adrenaline dump is not the problem. I know, because the asthma only appears when there's high temperatures and a vicious air. And almost always when training basic technique, no sparring whatsoever.
I don't have so much of a problem with sparring, because fighting have impasses and my breathing goes easily.
I don't have so much of a problem with sparring, because fighting have impasses and my breathing goes easily.
M
MartialArtsGuy
Guest
Man most of us only have to worry about working through the stress of the adrenaline dump.
You have to worry about asthma attacks too.
The body heat of sparring/doing techniques hard causes asthma attacks for you?
Its good that you train in these conditions because it may be something you have to face for real one day. (hopefully not) Atleast you'll have done something while in that condition.
Get good at effectively sparring/doing techniques while using as little energy as possible. Tell yourself you will relax and dont forget to breathe.
This way you will limit the amount of body heat you will generate. This is mostly a mental effort. (free your mind and your a$$ will follow) if you have ever seen an extremely skilled MAist spar a not so skilled opponent, you may notice how the skilled one almost toys with the other dude at will. Effortless almost and does'nt even break a sweat.. Become efficient. Basicly get better at sparring. I hope i understand your question right. Im sure there are others on the forum that might have good advice too.
a few things came to mind as far as "technique" is concerned, but its hard to talk about these things on a forum. For example, when sparring, if someone is delivering blows but is out of range, dont worry about blocking/parrying. just do the least amount of movement to defend yourself. At the same time this could be bad advice too, because i know that while sparring i have delt with oppenents that throw commited blows with intent even though they are out of range. Sometimes I block/parry anyway just to give their weapons something to hit, almost giving the illusion that they are in range. This does not last for too long, eventually they realize we are playing pattycake. But it is a good example of why its hard to give "techniques" on a forum. However a good general idea is to keep your mental state cool. Your mind controls your body.
:asian:
You have to worry about asthma attacks too.
The body heat of sparring/doing techniques hard causes asthma attacks for you?
Its good that you train in these conditions because it may be something you have to face for real one day. (hopefully not) Atleast you'll have done something while in that condition.
Get good at effectively sparring/doing techniques while using as little energy as possible. Tell yourself you will relax and dont forget to breathe.
This way you will limit the amount of body heat you will generate. This is mostly a mental effort. (free your mind and your a$$ will follow) if you have ever seen an extremely skilled MAist spar a not so skilled opponent, you may notice how the skilled one almost toys with the other dude at will. Effortless almost and does'nt even break a sweat.. Become efficient. Basicly get better at sparring. I hope i understand your question right. Im sure there are others on the forum that might have good advice too.
a few things came to mind as far as "technique" is concerned, but its hard to talk about these things on a forum. For example, when sparring, if someone is delivering blows but is out of range, dont worry about blocking/parrying. just do the least amount of movement to defend yourself. At the same time this could be bad advice too, because i know that while sparring i have delt with oppenents that throw commited blows with intent even though they are out of range. Sometimes I block/parry anyway just to give their weapons something to hit, almost giving the illusion that they are in range. This does not last for too long, eventually they realize we are playing pattycake. But it is a good example of why its hard to give "techniques" on a forum. However a good general idea is to keep your mental state cool. Your mind controls your body.
:asian:
K
Kenpomachine
Guest
It's the body heat of doing hard technique work (either on a bag or combinations) on a hot and humid class, not very well ventilated, that is, with a sortage of oxygen. I have been doing ok all winter and spring until now that good weather is back.
Breath! How could I forget that!! :rofl: :rofl:
Now, really, I have forgotten before to breath, and I worked on that by finding the proper rythm and timing in what I'm doing, but the asthma is different, as you don't seem to get enough air even though the only thing you do is try to breath and get some oxigen.
About relaxing, well that's not so easy when an asthma attack is coming, that's the reason I asked for advice when you said you have some exposure to this side of martial arts
This may work. I'll try and tell you how it went. But breathing may still be the problem. Thanks for all the advice and time put into writing it.
PS Do you think that changing the timing and rythm of work in these conditions, so as not to reach an anaerobic level would be a solution?
M
MartialArtsGuy
Guest
Ok this is the third time im attempting this post because i keep losing it so im going to keep it short and sweet.
Reducing the intensity of your rhythm will help but i dont think you need to do that. Keep working out hard on the bag and try jumping rope. This will keep your cardiovascular situation running efficiently and give you exposure to having to work through the asthma. You may have to some day.
Try doing techniques so that you keep you oxygen needs low. Remember that you are going to stay relaxed and you will breathe. Do the technique using as little motion as possible but so that you still get the job done. Eventually your goal is to be like an engine that gets great gas milage, goes for a long time and runs cool. You want to perform effectvely without using to much energy to do work (In physics you use energy to do work)
The less energy you use to do work the less heat you generate and the more effecient you will be. You are developing your mind and body here. Technique lines are a good time to try this and doing sponteneity drills is excellent.
Reducing the intensity of your rhythm will help but i dont think you need to do that. Keep working out hard on the bag and try jumping rope. This will keep your cardiovascular situation running efficiently and give you exposure to having to work through the asthma. You may have to some day.
Try doing techniques so that you keep you oxygen needs low. Remember that you are going to stay relaxed and you will breathe. Do the technique using as little motion as possible but so that you still get the job done. Eventually your goal is to be like an engine that gets great gas milage, goes for a long time and runs cool. You want to perform effectvely without using to much energy to do work (In physics you use energy to do work)
The less energy you use to do work the less heat you generate and the more effecient you will be. You are developing your mind and body here. Technique lines are a good time to try this and doing sponteneity drills is excellent.
M
MartialArtsGuy
Guest
Forgot to add that the point of this is to function so that the asthma attacks dont occur in the first place. Its hot enough outside, you're training yourself not to add to it. 
Brother, I feel your pain.
I gave up smoking in 1994, cause it was the right thing to do, and promptly developed asthma. Go figure!
I'm usually ok, but every now and again, it sneaks up on me and catches me by surprise. I find when I'm at that point where I just gotta get some air, if I place the pad of my thumb under the tip of my nose and lift up, I can breathe more freely and it allows me to get a second wind.
Of course the fun part is if I am fighting at the time......
Hmmm you do the math!
--Dave
:asian:
K
Kenpomachine
Guest
Mmmmm, apparently it's not asthma, is disnea. Doctor did me an EKG and nothing was wrong at the moment. I have to go through more tests yet.
I've been trying to raise my cardio condition by jogging (and I go slower jogging than walking, go imagine!! ) and swimming, sometimes cycling since november/december. It was meant to be for the bb test, but no way for it now with this problem. I just black out when going 100% and have to stop. If I try to do pushups or abs after the attack, it goes worse.
By the way, Doc, I apologize for stealing your thread.
:asian:
I've been trying to raise my cardio condition by jogging (and I go slower jogging than walking, go imagine!!
) and swimming, sometimes cycling since november/december. It was meant to be for the bb test, but no way for it now with this problem. I just black out when going 100% and have to stop. If I try to do pushups or abs after the attack, it goes worse.By the way, Doc, I apologize for stealing your thread.
:asian:
OP
OP
Doc
Senior Master
Originally posted by Kenpomachine
Mmmmm, apparently it's not asthma, is disnea. Doctor did me an EKG and nothing was wrong at the moment. I have to go through more tests yet.
I've been trying to raise my cardio condition by jogging (and I go slower jogging than walking, go imagine!!
By the way, Doc, I apologize for stealing your thread.
:asian:
You just take care of yourself, and don't sweat the "small" stuff.
K
Kenpomachine
Guest
Thanks for the advice.
Similar threads
