Cafeteria brawl and security just watches

[Kittan Bachika]

A girl confronted her bullies and then all hell broke loose.
http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/video?id=8136918&syndicate=syndicate&section

The NYPD Safety officers need to be fired and replaced. Their job is to be in harm's way. In fact, NYPD should just flood the school with uniformed cops for a couple of days as a warning.

As for the teachers, I really can't blame them. They have to be able to defuse situations or prevent them from happening. I can understand if they were scared off. However, I have seen teachers break up fights bigger than this at their own personal safety.

This is a worst nightmare for any martial artists because you are being hit in all directions. And no matter what you get hit. If you try escape you get, you defend yourself you get hit. And from that report, one girl who was trying to get away, got hurt the most.

I think the only option is to survive. Whether it means running away, or using a two arm shoulder throw. What do you all think?

 

[MaxiMe]

Agree with the cops getting fired. NYPD isn't their motto "protect and serve"? Not much protection in that school. Of course the world has change alot since i was in school.

I think I'll see if our Master will do more circle of death drills with my 10 year old.

 

[Kittan Bachika]

Agree with the cops getting fired. NYPD isn't their motto "protect and serve"? Not much protection in that school. Of course the world has change alot since i was in school.

I think I'll see if our Master will do more circle of death drills with my 10 year old.

Is that what you call them? What are these drills like?

I remember one drill where one student was put in a circle of other students. Then the teacher would point to a student circle to attack. The teacher would point to anyone and they would either do a choke or a grab. If they were coming from the front, students would usually do a strike. These were just drills, but the point was to get everyone aware of dealing with groups.

It got real serious during sparring when there would be 5 to 1 sparring.

 

[Andy Moynihan]

Agree with the cops getting fired. NYPD isn't their motto "protect and serve"?

No, I believe that was LAPD, and I believe nowadays it's "We'll kick your *** AND take your donuts".

 

[Aikicomp]

Is that what you call them? What are these drills like?

I remember one drill where one student was put in a circle of other students. Then the teacher would point to a student circle to attack. The teacher would point to anyone and they would either do a choke or a grab. If they were coming from the front, students would usually do a strike. These were just drills, but the point was to get everyone aware of dealing with groups.

This has been our style's standard for over 40 yrs. We just call it "The circle". Any attack was permissable and the student being attacked did not know what attack or where it was coming from. Very good training for self defense.

It got real serious during sparring when there would be 5 to 1 sparring.

Yup, we also do this. The test is called "5 man Kumite"

In a normal class I give a warm-up, then work on a specific attack & a few different techniques for said attack and then we do the "circle". This is done at every class and keeps the students skills sharp, fluid and gives them a chance to hone their technique as well as be pressure tested at every class.

Mike

 

[chinto]

Believe it or not, the cops were legally ok to just watch! 5 times in the last 100 years the Supreme Court of the United States of America has ruled ( making it the law of the land ) that the police and other law enforcement officers have NO DUTY TO PROTECT ANY ONE!!!
they have a duty to investigate any crime with the intent and duty to assist the in prosecution of said crime. they work for the DA, attorney General of the state, or the federal attorneys and US attorney General in assisting in the prosecution of that crime.

the Justices have repeatedly said " if you get protection be thankful but its not their duty!

so legally as long as they were collecting evidence after and during the brawl.. they are free and clear!

 

[Kemposhot]

Agree with the cops getting fired. NYPD isn't their motto "protect and serve"? Not much protection in that school. Of course the world has change alot since i was in school.

I think I'll see if our Master will do more circle of death drills with my 10 year old.

The NYPD you see in schools are not NYPD Police Officers but NYPD School Safety Officers. They are not police officers, and in most circumstances do not carry a firearm. They wear a similar patch though similar to how Traffic agents in NYC also wear the patch of NYPD but aren't fully sworn police.

That being said, I'm not really sure what their procedure is on fights in schools.

 

[Twin Fist]

they used to break up fights, till parents started suing as soon as a teacher or school employee touched a kid

 

[MA-Caver]

they used to break up fights, till parents started suing as soon as a teacher or school employee touched a kid

That may be just the whole crux of the reason why the "safety officers" didn't get involved. Getting into a melee like that means you will have to do some strikes yourself or tossing people out of the way... soon as that happens you'll have an irate parent screaming abuse and assault upon a minor.

I remember many times seeing a teacher wade into a fight and break it up and doing it not so gently. Parents (including my own) usually asked the key question afterwards and it was directed at their own children... what did YOU do? And it was an accusation not a question of innocence.

Yeah times have changed.

The girl said she was fighting back against a bully. Kudos to her... sorry that it blew up the way it did but at least she stood up for herself.

 

[MaxiMe]

Is that what you call them? What are these drills like?

I remember one drill where one student was put in a circle of other students. Then the teacher would point to a student circle to attack. The teacher would point to anyone and they would either do a choke or a grab. If they were coming from the front, students would usually do a strike. These were just drills, but the point was to get everyone aware of dealing with groups.

It got real serious during sparring when there would be 5 to 1 sparring.

That's basically the idea, we've done it different ways, circled studens holding pads and kiop to let the center student know who id comming. Strike is delivered and another student kiop and wades in, most sparring is 2 on 1 till higher belt levels.

 

[MaxiMe]

I remember many times seeing a teacher wade into a fight and break it up and doing it not so gently. Parents (including my own) usually asked the key question afterwards and it was directed at their own children... what did YOU do? And it was an accusation not a question of innocence.

Yeah times have changed.

The girl said she was fighting back against a bully. Kudos to her... sorry that it blew up the way it did but at least she stood up for herself.

Yup, that sounds real familiar...echoes of dad ringing in my ears

 

[MA-Caver]

Yup, that sounds real familiar...echoes of dad ringing in my ears

The idea I now realize (being older) is to teach a kid to assume and accept personal accountability for THEIR part in whatever happened.

Seems those days are gone... it's going to be someone else's fault... Someone to blame.

 

[MaxiMe]

The idea I now realize (being older) is to teach a kid to assume and accept personal accountability for THEIR part in whatever happened.

Seems those days are gone... it's going to be someone else's fault... Someone to blame.

I totaly agree, seems like sometimes we are the last of a a generation that "cowboys up and takes our sdue lumps".

 

[LuckyKBoxer]

Believe it or not, the cops were legally ok to just watch! 5 times in the last 100 years the Supreme Court of the United States of America has ruled ( making it the law of the land ) that the police and other law enforcement officers have NO DUTY TO PROTECT ANY ONE!!!
they have a duty to investigate any crime with the intent and duty to assist the in prosecution of said crime. they work for the DA, attorney General of the state, or the federal attorneys and US attorney General in assisting in the prosecution of that crime.

the Justices have repeatedly said " if you get protection be thankful but its not their duty!

so legally as long as they were collecting evidence after and during the brawl.. they are free and clear!

And this is probably the biggest misunderstanding that citizens have about police officers.
I am sure that most would like to protect...
but the fact is that today more then ever they primarily glorified janitorial specialists and tax revenue generators... as much as they may not want to be that.
They clean up after a crime, and go after the guilty parties, and they generate revenue for the city/state more and more aggresively every day.
If people want protection they need to protect themselves. Of course with the assault on our rights to bear arms, this becomes harder and harder since criminals do not hold themselves to any such restrictions.

 

[Kenpo Missle 47]

its a tuff call , damned if they do damned if they dont.

i know if the video showed the police officer grabbing one of them kids , some parent would already showed up with there attorney ready to sue the school district & police dept. for misconduct or something :soapbox:

 

[chinto]

And this is probably the biggest misunderstanding that citizens have about police officers.
I am sure that most would like to protect...
but the fact is that today more then ever they primarily glorified janitorial specialists and tax revenue generators... as much as they may not want to be that.
They clean up after a crime, and go after the guilty parties, and they generate revenue for the city/state more and more aggresively every day.
If people want protection they need to protect themselves. Of course with the assault on our rights to bear arms, this becomes harder and harder since criminals do not hold themselves to any such restrictions.

that is true, if you want protection it is your responsibility to protect yourself. that is what the Supreme Court of the United States of America ruled over and over again... not what some would tell you, but the law of the land is that they have no duty to protect you.

 

[Balrog]

One would think that the security folks would have had Mace. If they had just stood on the perimeter and sprayed into the middle, that melee would have broken up real damn quick.

 

[the warrior]

Believe it or not, the cops were legally ok to just watch! 5 times in the last 100 years the Supreme Court of the United States of America has ruled ( making it the law of the land ) that the police and other law enforcement officers have NO DUTY TO PROTECT ANY ONE!!!
they have a duty to investigate any crime with the intent and duty to assist the in prosecution of said crime. they work for the DA, attorney General of the state, or the federal attorneys and US attorney General in assisting in the prosecution of that crime.

the Justices have repeatedly said " if you get protection be thankful but its not their duty!

so legally as long as they were collecting evidence after and during the brawl.. they are free and clear!

This means in suffolk newyork where I live cops are being paid 108,000 dollars a year to watch. Good to see my tax dollars at work.

 

[hongkongfooey]

The job of the police is to protect and serve the interests of municipality that employs them, not the individual citizen.

 

[Mark Jordan]

Maybe they misunderstood their motto to "protect and serve yourself".