Blending Styles

[Nightingale]

What do you think about instructors who bring in elements from more than one art? Like a school that teaches both Kenpo and TKD, or both TKD and BJJ? I don't mean two separate instructors, one teaching a TKD class, and one teaching a BJJ class at different times, but one class encorporating elements of both styles?

I'm not talking specifically about the arts mentioned above, but in general.

 

[Cruentus]

Its good if done correctly. You don't want to be that person who does a little bit of everything but who knows nothing. Find a style that you like and stick to it. But it is good to crosstrain just to see what other styles are doing, or to fill in gaps in your training from your base style.

:asian:

 

[bob919]

yes it can be very effective if they are blended well
i personally find thai boxing and BJJ to be a great combo for a rounded fighter i would like to do wingchun as well but it is so different to the other striking art (thai boxing) that i believe it would hender my progress so instead i buy lots of books on wingchun and apply those principles to my fighting techniqe

ithink people trying to striking arts like karate and boxing at the same time would have to learn 2 different straight punches and learn to use the right one for eachj class. that probably means no sense but i think it just over complicates things unless alot of time is spent out of class to blend your styles

 

[Old Fat Kenpoka]

There are several ways to approach this:

One is called Mixed Martial Arts or MMA. It's a famous sport combining Boxing/Kickboxing, wrestling takedowns and Jiu-Jitsu/catch-wrestling.

Another is simply combining materials from more than one style. My nephew's TKD school incorporates IKCA Kenpo into its curriculum to round out its self-defense and hand techniques. The Kenpo they do isn't pretty, but the self-defense they do is better than your average TKD school.

 

[arnisador]

The JKD/BJJ I'm taking works well.

 

[karatekid1975]

Originally posted by Nightingale
What do you think about instructors who bring in elements from more than one art? Like a school that teaches both Kenpo and TKD, or both TKD and BJJ? I don't mean two separate instructors, one teaching a TKD class, and one teaching a BJJ class at different times, but one class encorporating elements of both styles?

I'm not talking specifically about the arts mentioned above, but in general.

My instructor does this. We are a TKD school. BUT we also do judo type stuff (grappling, joint locks), and Kali related stuff(great for hand techs and joint locks, not just weapons ).

 

[Rich Parsons]

As in most things in life, it all depends.

Do the arts work well together?

Does the instructor have enough knowledge in both (Multiple) arts to make them work?

The instructor should aways be honest with teh students, tell them where it came from and if they can get rank that is recognized in an organization or just locally.

Just some of my thoughts

 

[MJS]

I agree! I think that it will work, but like some people already said, it needs to be done properly. If the TKD guy goes to a few BJJ seminars and then starts putting up signs in the windows advertising BJJ, then this is VERY wrong. Now, if he does some side training with a qualified BJJ Inst. then yeah, why not.

Mike

 

[Old Fat Kenpoka]

Like any martial arts, the instructor has to know what they are doing.

It is easiest to teach two styles you are qualified to teach if you keep them separate and preserve the original curriculums.

It is more difficult to combine two styles into one and create a new curriculum. Very few people can do this--even if they are qualified to teach both styles.

It is, obviously, very difficult to combine two styles if you are not qualified to teach one or both of them.

 

[KenpoTess]

We are an EPAK curriculum ,though we do incorporate Samurai Jui-jitsu which melds well with Kenpo. The breakfalls, grappling, throws and rolls work very fluidly with our Kenpo Tecs.

 

[LadyDragon]

I don't see a problem with mixing styles at all. As a matter of fact, where I study we do it often. In my opinion, it helps change things up a bit. And if the instructor is truely knowledgeable in what it is that they're teaching, it should/could blend in with whatever the class is for the day.

 

[John Bishop]

We been doing it since 1947. We call it "Kajukenbo". Ka=karate, Ju= judo & juitsu, Ken= kenpo, Bo= Chinese & Western boxing. From Kalihi (hometown of Adriano Emperado, Ed Parker, and Wally Jay) in Hawaii to over 25 countries, the concept has caught on quite well.
So like some of the others said, if done right you got nothing to lose and everything to gain.

 

[hardheadjarhead]

I voted "Yes, the more you know..."

I encourage cross training for my Tae Kwon Do and Hapkido students...pushing them towards kali, Modern Arnis, Brazilian jujitsu, Combat Submission Wrestling, Muay Thai, Judo, Mande Muda Pencak Silat, T'ai Chi and Jun Fan. We offer all these arts at my school, and more. I further encourage them to attend outside seminars in other systems we don't offer...Kenpo, Small Circle, etc.

I want our TKD students to become functional on the ground and with weapons...hence the push towards the grappling arts and FMA. The other arts have a great deal to offer as well.

A common critique of cross training is that students will become "jack of all trades, masters of none." I find the committed students usually stick to one art as a base, and branch out from there...occasionally switching bases if they desire. Its a little like having a major and minor (or several minors) in college...with a student changing his major, perhaps, if he finds something else that really trips his trigger.

So far I haven't seen any problems. Most people are intellectually capable of learning several different approaches. It doesn't confuse them, their horizons are broadened, and most importantly, they're relieved of those "stylistic bigotries" that tend to plague so many people in the martial arts.


Regards,


Steve

 

[Nightingale]

but you also end up with the student who wants six majors in completely unrelated fields.

what would you say about someone who:

went to TKD on monday night
went to Kenpo on tuesday night
went to Muay Thai on wednesday
went to Arnis on thursday
and
went to BJJ on friday???

I've seen people do this!

I think if you learn one art, and then supplement, okay. If you try to learn five or six at once, you're just nuts!

 

[7starmantis]

Sometimes I wonder about those who teach 6 or 7 arts at their school, I wonder how long the instructor trained in each one.

I think trying to learn 6 arts at one time is counter productive.

7sm

 

[Seig]

If I wanted to, I could teach Tae Kwon Do, Shorin-Ryu, Jiu Jitsu and Kenpo as well as other stuff I have been taught. As a students abilities and understanding grow so does what I show them. I have a curriculuum that I teach. I teach American Kenpo, we have FMA available for my students, I do not teach it, a capable and qualified instructor does. What I do with the information he passes along is to show the similarities and parallels to what I teach. If I tried to teach my students every curriculuum I learned, I would muddy the waters.

 

[hardheadjarhead]

Sometimes I wonder about those who teach 6 or 7 arts at their school, I wonder how long the instructor trained in each one.

If you're wondering about ME, then know I only teach three of those styles. I'm not qualified to teach the other arts, and never have claimed to be. The instructors of the other systems are certified in those systems.

We have three apprentice instructors under Guro Dan Inosanto, two apprentice instructors and one associate instructor under Ajarn Chai Sirisute, a number of "official reps" for Erik Paulson, a Jagabaya in Mande Muda who is affiliated with Ibu Rita Suwanda, several lakans who tested under Remy, several sifus under William Chen, etc.

Talent attracts talent. I'm deeply grateful to a number of the instructors here for bringing other outstanding instructors in other systems to our school...AND I'm grateful for them bringing up a good crop of students.

but you also end up with the student who wants six majors in completely unrelated fields.

As far as the student that goes to a class a night in five different styles...I've never seen anybody do that. I'm sure its happened, somewhere, if not here...but it is certainly not the norm at my school.

Many...if not most people...are ambitious and want to advance in a system. None of the instructors here will allow a person to test without giving a commitment to their specific art.

There might be a concern that somebody will study a handful of arts and then go off after a year or two (or month or two) and start his own style. We've seen that happen enough...and we'll see it again. Flakes such as these don't need a school like mine in order to spawn their pseudo-systems.

None of the students in our school have ever done that...and if they did, it would behoove them to start their little project in another town.



Regards,


Steve

 

[theletch1]

If you're wondering about ME, then know I only teach three of those styles. I'm not qualified to teach the other arts, and never have claimed to be. The instructors of the other systems are certified in those systems.

Steve, it's the guys that don't have the integrity to admit that they aren't qualified to teach every one of the systems that they offer or simply watch a video or read a book and try to mix it into what ever they're teaching that causes the problems with mixing styles in a school. If you have a small school with a head instructor and maybe one assistant and the head instructor begins to teach things that he has only heard about or seen in a movie/training video (I had this happen at my old school) then you run into serious problems.

it would behoove them to start their little project in another town.

Even without the Jarhead in your screen name that one phrase gives away the fact that you're a former Marine. I've never heard anyone outside the Corps use the word "behoove".

 

[Cruentus]

Originally posted by 7starmantis
Sometimes I wonder about those who teach 6 or 7 arts at their school, I wonder how long the instructor trained in each one.

I think trying to learn 6 arts at one time is counter productive.

7sm

I agree. Sometimes for a beginner it can be good to experience a bunch of different things if, lets say, they don't really know what they are looking for.

At some point, however, I think it is important to pick something and really learn it inside and out to develop a good base style.

I also question the quality of instruction you'll get if the same instructor is teaching 6 or 7 vaguely related things. Most of the times when I see this, the instructor isn't very qualified to teach anything, or they are REALLY only qualified to teach one thing, but offer a bunch of other things they are unqualified to teach for marketing purposes.

 

[Cruentus]

Originally posted by Seig
If I wanted to, I could teach Tae Kwon Do, Shorin-Ryu, Jiu Jitsu and Kenpo as well as other stuff I have been taught. As a students abilities and understanding grow so does what I show them. I have a curriculuum that I teach. I teach American Kenpo, we have FMA available for my students, I do not teach it, a capable and qualified instructor does. What I do with the information he passes along is to show the similarities and parallels to what I teach. If I tried to teach my students every curriculuum I learned, I would muddy the waters.

Neat...which Filipino Art, and is the teacher anyone I'd know?

Just curious! :asian: