Best kicks for average folks

Tez3

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No one is being "combative"


I agree, I post more in sadness and frustration than any sense of being combative. It's painful to see someone with little knowledge slating other styles, deciding who is rubbish and what is 'outdated' when he clearly doesn't understand the styles he's criticising.
I don't understand how someone can 'stay too long' in a style, there's always so much more to learn, more ways to test yourself, no one ever learns everything, to think you can is just arrogance.
 

Tez3

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I think all MA need updating. Constantly. My issue is with the blanket statements that include hints and/or details that demonstrate a lack of understanding of the topic. It'd be like me saying France needs to update its government. I may be right by accident, but I know next to nothing about that government, so my assertion is based on nothing real.


Most martials arts are constantly evolving though, nothing stands still. the fact that many complain about things being modernised show that, the whine of 'why can't we just do what we've always done' is quite common. If martial arts didn't update we wouldn't have the popularity of MMA for a start.
Most martial artists do want to challenge themselves ( and their students) so actively look for ways to teach and to experience new things.
Just saying something needs updating is pointless, as we say in the RAF, don't bring a problem unless you have a solution, what does 'update' mean?
You only have to look at Iain Abernethy for example and many similar exponents of karate to see how they constantly challenge thoughts and techniques, keeping what works and throwing out what doesn't...with explanations. It is however surprising how many 'old' techniques work well provided you understand how to use them. Understanding is the key, always.
In an interesting article from Iain he says '' To play devil’s advocate for a moment, I’d suggest that the majority of karate practised in this country today is not traditional! My reasoning is that much of today’s karate is not “adhering to a long established procedure” but is in fact only a few decades old.''
He goes on to say "There can be little doubt that karate does not have the same status it did in the past. To the wider martial arts community, Traditional Karate is often viewed as an out-dated relic and a wholly ineffective system. Karate is often criticised for its lack of realism, its lack of close-range techniques, its preoccupation with “looking good”, its omission of ground work, the unrealistic nature of its sparring, the impracticality of its techniques etc. And I have to admit that in many cases these criticisms are justified! However, it is not ‘Traditional Karate’ that is at fault, but its modern interpretation. The confusing part of all this is that modern karate is often incorrectly labelled as ‘Traditional’! Just to be clear, it is in no way my intention to belittle modern karate, merely to point out that the modern version of karate is nowhere near as effective in real combat as the karate of old.''

So, some points for discussion there alone! From here What is Traditional Karate? | Iain Abernethy
 

gpseymour

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Most martials arts are constantly evolving though, nothing stands still. the fact that many complain about things being modernised show that, the whine of 'why can't we just do what we've always done' is quite common. If martial arts didn't update we wouldn't have the popularity of MMA for a start.
Most martial artists do want to challenge themselves ( and their students) so actively look for ways to teach and to experience new things.
Just saying something needs updating is pointless, as we say in the RAF, don't bring a problem unless you have a solution, what does 'update' mean?
You only have to look at Iain Abernethy for example and many similar exponents of karate to see how they constantly challenge thoughts and techniques, keeping what works and throwing out what doesn't...with explanations. It is however surprising how many 'old' techniques work well provided you understand how to use them. Understanding is the key, always.
In an interesting article from Iain he says '' To play devil’s advocate for a moment, I’d suggest that the majority of karate practised in this country today is not traditional! My reasoning is that much of today’s karate is not “adhering to a long established procedure” but is in fact only a few decades old.''
He goes on to say "There can be little doubt that karate does not have the same status it did in the past. To the wider martial arts community, Traditional Karate is often viewed as an out-dated relic and a wholly ineffective system. Karate is often criticised for its lack of realism, its lack of close-range techniques, its preoccupation with “looking good”, its omission of ground work, the unrealistic nature of its sparring, the impracticality of its techniques etc. And I have to admit that in many cases these criticisms are justified! However, it is not ‘Traditional Karate’ that is at fault, but its modern interpretation. The confusing part of all this is that modern karate is often incorrectly labelled as ‘Traditional’! Just to be clear, it is in no way my intention to belittle modern karate, merely to point out that the modern version of karate is nowhere near as effective in real combat as the karate of old.''

So, some points for discussion there alone! From here What is Traditional Karate? | Iain Abernethy
Good point - sometimes what we see as traditional, really isn't. Or at least, it's not as old as we perceive it. I think a lot of Japanese/Okinawan arts had some issues with how they came to the US after WWII, as a lot of GI's with fairly thin experience started teaching suddenly, and just hadn't developed the depth of knowledge they'd have if they'd been training longer. I don't know if the same happened on your side of the pond.

In any case, of course my point was that we all ought to be looking to improve all the time. So, Karate, Aikido, Muay Thai, BJJ, Boxing, etc. all fall into the "need updating" category, because there's always something we can do a bit better. Some styles, some schools, would benefit more than others, because some are already doing that and have been for a long time.
 

Tez3

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So, Karate, Aikido, Muay Thai, BJJ, Boxing, etc. all fall into the "need updating" categor


I don't think 'updating' is the correct word, that implies something is obsolete or unable to work because it has worn out. Better words are evolve and advance, I like improve as well, just as we do when we start our training and move on with experience. We must be careful though not to get rid of things just because of 'fashion' or because someone can't be bothered to take time over their training instead wanting instant techniques and results.
There is a current argument going on in athletic circles about the running shoes that supposedly make runners faster, the recent record breaking marathon time was made wearing these shoes, is this 'updating'/moving with the times or actually cheating? Do we go the same way with martial arts finding 'cheats' to win or is it 'updating'? Do we go the way of some Olympic sports changing the rules to make things spectator/layman friendly or do we take the more difficult route of painstaking training?
 

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I don't think 'updating' is the correct word, that implies something is obsolete or unable to work because it has worn out. Better words are evolve and advance, I like improve as well, just as we do when we start our training and move on with experience. We must be careful though not to get rid of things just because of 'fashion' or because someone can't be bothered to take time over their training instead wanting instant techniques and results.
There is a current argument going on in athletic circles about the running shoes that supposedly make runners faster, the recent record breaking marathon time was made wearing these shoes, is this 'updating'/moving with the times or actually cheating? Do we go the same way with martial arts finding 'cheats' to win or is it 'updating'? Do we go the way of some Olympic sports changing the rules to make things spectator/layman friendly or do we take the more difficult route of painstaking training?
That’s a reasonable distinction. To me, it somewhat - but not precisely - is the same thing. As we learn new things, we update what we do based on that learning. It doesn’t necessarily invalidate the previous practice, even in cases where the new practice proves superior in some ways.
 

Tez3

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That’s a reasonable distinction. To me, it somewhat - but not precisely - is the same thing. As we learn new things, we update what we do based on that learning. It doesn’t necessarily invalidate the previous practice, even in cases where the new practice proves superior in some ways.


I'm trying to get away from the word 'update' because previously quasar44 had used it to style bash and we've been mired in his 'thoughts' on styles he considers pointless and useless.
I hope not too many people are dumping their hard gained expertise and training to pander to those who only want to train for months yet expect the results that years of training bring. It seems that the fad of 'instant gratification' is much to blame along with the unrealistic view that merely watching a video makes you an expert.
 
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quasar44

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What is m-th?

By what criteria do you judge a style 'lousy'? It looks like you quit if you find it too hard or aren't instantly good at it. While there are undoubtedly bad gyms around it seems you are extraordinarily unlucky to go to all of them.
Take your boxing training, how do you know your coach was bad at 'tactics', you were only there for 6 months.
You say 'reverse' punches are outdated, a strange word to use, do you actually know how to use a reverse punch or are you judging purely on what you think you see? You know reverse punches are used both in MT and MMA as well as boxing right? Do you not consider if you had more patience and training you would have understood more, everyone has to do basics before moving on but you don't stay to learn the basics instead considering it 'rubbish' and looking for the next instant gratification. The fact you consider your opinion to be the final word on styles is an indication of your lack of knowledge.
As for training more than any 44 year old, I very much doubt that.

Nobody does a reverse punch in ufc lol
Training in what ??
 

Tez3

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She keeps calling me a beg lol
You're in the begginer Mma class and the begginer bjj class (or should be because in your own words you suck)

So yes you are a "beg".....and so what? There's nothing wrong with being a begginer or do you think you're beneath being a begginer
 
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