Accidental shootings of children are being undercounted.

[Bob Hubbard]

In most states at 16 years old you can only get a limited license due to the graduated driver's license laws. There is required supervised driving time and a variety of restrictions on when, and with whom, you can drive. Can we try this with guns? In many cases there is a mandatory waiting period during which you have only a Learner's Permit. For a DL you do generally need at least a limited physical exam--see previous link and note that at a minimum there will be eyesight restrictions. (In NYS I generally had to read an optometrist's chart to get my DL issued or renewed.) Certainly it is the case that there are age-based restrictions.

But the big thing is you have to take a safety knowledge test and a practical test. Can we get that for guns?

Sure. Can we get an IQ test and photo ID for voting?

 

[pgsmith]

Sure. Can we get an IQ test and photo ID for voting?

I'd much prefer an IQ test for breeding!

 

[ballen0351]

In most states at 16 years old you can only get a limited license due to the graduated driver's license laws. There is required supervised driving time and a variety of restrictions on when, and with whom, you can drive. Can we try this with guns? In many cases there is a mandatory waiting period during which you have only a Learner's Permit. For a DL you do generally need at least a limited physical exam--see previous link and note that at a minimum there will be eyesight restrictions. (In NYS I generally had to read an optometrist's chart to get my DL issued or renewed.) Certainly it is the case that there are age-based restrictions.

But the big thing is you have to take a safety knowledge test and a practical test. Can we get that for guns?

So your claiming 16 yr olds don't have licenses and don't drive? Restrictions or not you still can go drive a car at 16 legally. You can't own a gun until 18 and a handgun until 21.
There is no back ground check for driver license. There is one every time I buy a gun. Even if I justbought one last week.
No wwaiting period to buy a car. I'm a cop and own a bunch of guns if I go buy a new one tomorrow I still have to go through the waiting period.
You are required to attend classes here to get a gun permit, hunting license, CC permit.
I can't buy certain types of guns made right here in the US here anymore no such restrictions on cars produced here

 

[Tgace]

Don't need a DL to purchase a car...just one to drive it away.

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[Bob Hubbard]

You do not need a drivers license to drive a car, just to drive it on the government roads. Farm kids drive all the time on their property.
You don't need to insure or register your car either, just to drive it on government roads. Again, farm kids drive old cars on family farms all the time.
They don't even need to be 16. I know 1 family where the kids drive an old Buick between the house and barn and fields, one is 14. Wears lifts on their shoes to reach.

If I go to a car dealer and buy a car, I can pay cash, walk out soon as the paperworks done, usually an hour or so. In Erie County NY, if I buy a gun, I'll get to pick it up in 18-24 months as the wait is that long.

When I was in Boy Scouts, I had easy access to guns. Shot all the time at camps in NY and TN. I didn't have a permit. Hell, the only ID I had was a bit of paper that said I knew which end of the knife to whittle with. Funny how none of us stabbed, shot or speared each other all those years.

 

[arnisador]

Restrictions or not you still can go drive a car at 16 legally. You can't own a gun until 18

Just as you can get a restricted-rights DL at 16 in most states, you can own a gun at any age in most states...also with restrictions. And that's for licensed sellers; for unlicensed sellers the age can be as low as 16 (VT) and for long guns any age at all (5 states, incl. NY). See here. You can also use one under supervision at a younger age; hunting with a gun is usually allowed at as young as 10. You don't understand the relevant law in the U.S. if you think you have to be 18 to legally own and/or use a gun.

I can't buy certain types of guns made right here in the US here anymore no such restrictions on cars produced here

You're proving my point. Cars made and sold here must meet stringent safety, fuel efficiency, and other standards. Can we get safety standards for firearms? To reduce the likelihood of accidental shootings by young children?

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Can we get safety standards for firearms? To reduce the likelihood of accidental shootings by young children?

You mean, like the stuff that's been on the books for years already that you're ignorant to?

http://smartgunlaws.org/design-safety-standards-for-handguns-policy-summary/
http://www.gunssavelife.com/?p=5573

 

[Tgace]

He wants "gun idiot" stuff like bio-ID, rings that unlock the trigger and other "suicide if you ever need to use a gun" laws Bob....

Cars and guns are entirely different animals when it comes to safety design.

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[ballen0351]

You're proving my point. Cars made and sold here must meet stringent safety, fuel efficiency, and other standards. Can we get safety standards for firearms? To reduce the likelihood of accidental shootings by young children?

Again you have clue what you speak just like the fools that passed our gun laws.
I can't buy a normal AR15 here anymore. I can buy an AR 15 H-bar model. What's the difference you might ask? The H-bar has a beefier barrel so I can shoot more rounds more accurately and the barrel won't heat up as fast so I can just keep shooting and shooting and shooting. You know why the H-bar is legal and the regular AR isnt? Because Colt firearms company spent millions to convince our legislature that an H-bar is a hunting gun.
So tell me how that law is making us safer?

 

[arnisador]

Cars and guns are entirely different animals when it comes to safety design.

I didn't choose the comparison.

But we don't have federal gun safety standards--just a patchwork of state laws here and there. Guns are specifically exempted from the federal CPSA. That'd be good to address.

 

[arnisador]

So tell me how that law is making us safer?

Can you point me to which law this is? Your state only, I gather?

 

[ballen0351]

I didn't choose the comparison.

But we don't have federal gun safety standards--just a patchwork of state laws here and there. Guns are specifically exempted from the federal CPSA. That'd be good to address.

Yes you did you said its easier to get a gun license then a drivers license which is false

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Yes you did you said its easier to get a gun license then a drivers license which is false

That simply can't be!

 

[arnisador]

Yes you did you said its easier to get a gun license then a drivers license

As usual, you're making stuff up and attributing it to me.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

He twists and turns like a twisty turny thing.

 

[ballen0351]

Are all those things equally well regulated? Is it easier to get a gun license, a driver's license,.

Did I? That's how it sounded

 

[billc]

Just received info. on gettin a concealed carry permit...you need:

--21 years old

--have a current Illinois F.O.I.D card

--submit a complete concealed carry license application

--successfully complete 16 hours of firearms training including classroom and range

The fees:

--150 dollars for the application

--280 dollars for the 16 hour class

Now...since the right to keep and bear arms is a constitutional right...you know...like voting...and certain people complained about requiring a photo I.D....provided for free...I repeat...for free by the state...

I am now waiting for those same people to start howling about how wrong it is to charge a fee, and to require a photo I.D. to exercise a constitutionally protected right...you know, the way they did with voter I.D....

 

[arnisador]

Are all those things equally well regulated? Is it easier to get a gun license, a driver's license,.

Did I? That's how it sounded

It sounds different if you don't edit it to take it out of context and don't change my question mark to a period.

I know this has been said before in one way or another, but I'll say it again. Guns are legal, cars are legal, airplanes are legal, trains are legal, sports are legal. People get hurt and killed as a result of these LEGAL things. Why are guns singled out everytime and targeted for banning?

Are all those things equally well regulated? Is it easier to get a gun license, a driver's license, a pilot's license, a railroad engineer's license, or a pro sports contract?

How often do people playing sports kill numerous people not playing or attending a sports event? How often is a child accidentally run over by an airplane?

And, banning is not what's being suggested. Everything else you mentioned has had mandated safety improvements over the years... except guns.

Meanwhile, this thread is about getting the numbers right whether you think the numbers matter or not. I'm surprised that anyone would find it controversial to suggest we should discuss these things with accurate rather than inaccurate data.

 

[arnisador]

I am now waiting for those same people to start howling about how wrong it is to charge a fee, and to require a photo I.D. to exercise a constitutionally protected right...you know, the way they did with voter I.D....

How many voting deaths per year?

This sounds like a reasonable question...until you think about it. You have the right to freedom of assembly, but getting a permit for your parade can still be an expensive, time-consuming hassle. Your fourth amendment rights will cost you an expensive lawyer to enforce often enough. Misuse of voting rights is very, very rare--completely negligible, by the standards you yourself apply when misuse of firearms is the issue. (If several hundred dead children per year is "negligible" to you, how is under 10 people voting twice a problem?) And of course, ultimately, voter ID laws are explicitly championed as a voter suppression mechanism. Voter ID laws don't solve an extant problem other than that they help Republicans get elected. It's false equivalence to say that all constitutional rights, no matter how different they might be, should be handled in exactly the same way.

 

[ballen0351]

It sounds different if you don't edit it to take it out of context and don't change my question mark to a period.

So what was the point you were making if you were not saying gun license is easier then DL?