Students sent home for wearing American Flag

[tshadowchaser]

http://www.foxnews.com/search-results/search?q=american+flag%2F+cinco+de+mayo
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/05/06/california-students-sent-home-wearing-flags-cinco-mayo/
　
http://www.foxnews.com/search-results/search?q=american+flag%2F+cinco+de+mayo
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/05/06/california-students-sent-home-wearing-flags-cinco-mayo/
Not sure if this should go here or in Horror Stories
As any who have been here since the beginning of this site know I usually stay out of the political arena on the forum However I fell deeply enough about this one to open the discussion.
My personal feeling is that the flag of this country should be allowed to be flown, waved, worn, whatever by any who wish at any time in this country.
If your from another country or your parents, grandparents, etc. where and you choose to show your heritage and be proud of it while living in this country that is ok, but you are in the United States of America do not deny the people of this country from doing the same.
I served with many who where not of birth in this country but they lived here, went to school here worked here and they served in our military during war time because they where proud to be allowed to be in this country. Many never came back but they gave their lives so that others could have the privilege that they had been given of being in this country.
If you are an American citizen or claim to be one then you should be proud of the flag that has served as a symbol of this country for so long. You should be proud to wear that symbol to show your support of this country any time you want. You should NOT be punished for wearing it.
I will not get into the other discussion on English language being spoken vs what ever language that will be left for another thread. So to those that post after me in this thread please keep the discussion to the links above and to the opening post.

Sheldon Bedell

 

[MBuzzy]

Sigh....ok - I HATE to say this....but I can see where the principal is coming from. I agree with you, no one should EVER be denied the right to display their patriotism and display the flag. But at the same time, I know kids....blatantly wearing American flags on Cinco De Mayo was PROBABLY just a jab at the mexican kids in the school - why else would they do it? Do they wear those things all the time? Why were they hanging around together? Trying to instigate something? What is the mexican population at the school like? Typical of ALL new media, they completely spun this and failed to see another side, playing on the emotions and "patriotism" of Americans.

I don't believe that they were punished, only asked to remove them, to maintain good order and discipline.

 

[tshadowchaser]

The article says that at least one of them wears shirts with the flag on it often and has many such shirts.
As for the mexicans at that school are they sent home if they wear an Mexican flag on their shirt on the forth of july or any other day.
I am sorry but if they are living here and claim to be born here they should look at themsleves as Americans not Mexicans

 

[tshadowchaser]

Having started this thread and replied once I am going to try to stay out of the discussion .
This is one I get riled up on
Having lived in Ca. and seen 4th generation Americans who could speak little English and who also told me that I was living in Mexico and that they would reclaim Ca. for mexico.
I'll let everyone else have there say and try to just read what is said

 

[tellner]

While everyone is enjoying a good bout of outrage, paranoia and risking asphyxiation from wrapping themselves in
THE FLAG
consider world-class curmudgeon PZ Myers. I realize he's a *shudder* scientist. And (Heaven forfend!) a skeptical scientist. But he does add a healthy dose of reason and logic to our Two Minute Hate.

 

[girlbug2]

I'm all for consistency in applying rules. If there is to be a rule that one can't wear an American flag t shirt , then this should apply to the flag of any other country as well, no matter what day. So were there kids wearing Mexican flag t shirts, and if so, were they sent home as well?

Understand, that showing patriotism for America is not a put-down of Mexico or any other country. It is always appropriate to show patriotism for one's own country while in one's own country. The school's claim that it is "incendiary" is ridiculous.

 

[girlbug2]

PZ Myers. I realize he's a *shudder* scientist. And (Heaven forfend!) a skeptical scientist. But he does add a healthy dose of reason and logic to our Two Minute Hate.

This being my first exposure to PZ Myers, I'm not impressed. Reason and logic--yeah, repeatedly referring to Tea partiers as Teabaggers is the sign of a sophisticated intellect. Not juvenile in the least.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

I am sorry but if they are living here and claim to be born here they should look at themsleves as Americans not Mexicans

Can I wear an Irish flag pin and a "Kiss me, I'm Irish" tee shirt on St Patricks? Or is that different?

 

[punisher73]

I think it's ridiculous. The clothing is not prohibited by the school any other day, but on that particular day it is against the rules? Stupid.

Now, if there were other details that these students were making inappropriate comments about the shirts to other students about hispanics in a derogatroy way, and making the shirts into a big deal, then this is something different and should have been addressed accordingly. But, I have not heard anything like this yet.

 

[Satt]

I'll bet after all the media attention, this school will start up a uniform policy.

 

[LuckyKBoxer]

Sigh....ok - I HATE to say this....but I can see where the principal is coming from. I agree with you, no one should EVER be denied the right to display their patriotism and display the flag. But at the same time, I know kids....blatantly wearing American flags on Cinco De Mayo was PROBABLY just a jab at the mexican kids in the school - why else would they do it? Do they wear those things all the time? Why were they hanging around together? Trying to instigate something? What is the mexican population at the school like? Typical of ALL new media, they completely spun this and failed to see another side, playing on the emotions and "patriotism" of Americans.

I don't believe that they were punished, only asked to remove them, to maintain good order and discipline.

absolutely unacceptable.. if the kids wearing American Flags were forced to remove them or go home, so should every single other kid with a Mexican Flag. Its bullcrap. The liberals want to constantly talk about acceptance and allowing people to express their views, unless its an American Flag, where was the liberals teaching acceptance to the mexican kids at this school for all the years leading up to this, where the vice principal felt he had to remove the American Flag kids from the equation?

No its racist plain and simple... a hispanic vice principal removes American kids with American Flags from school so Hispanic kids are not offended?

If it had been reversed then the ACLU and most likely even Obama would have stood up and gone off on a white principal doing this to hispanic kids.

I will bet a million dollars that on the 4th of July some kids will wear flags from other countries to American schools, and I will bet not one is asked to reverse it or remove it.

The vice principal should be fired, and the school should be sued for violating these kids rights, I would even be happy to see it sued so hard that it closes down completely.

This is an outrage.

 

[crushing]

Can I wear an Irish flag pin and a "Kiss me, I'm Irish" tee shirt on St Patricks? Or is that different?

The authorities would approve of that apparel, just don't wear red, white and blue.

 

[VegasM4]

This is America..LOVE it or LEAVE It!!!It's a pretty sad day when a principal tells AMERICAN kids that they cannot wear the AMERICAN flag in AMERICA!I could care less what mexican holiday it is.If they are so proud of Mexico and are offended by the great flag of our country then maybe they should go back to wherever they came from.The parents of those kids should sue the school for violation of civil rights.It sounds like alot of people need a geography lesson.

Semper Fi and God Bless America!

 

[bushidomartialarts]

The thing is, the students weren't sent home for wearing the flag. They were sent home for being asshats.

The flag, like any other symbol, is only as valuable as what it's being used for. In this case, it was being used to pick a fight. Educators are absolutely right to send students home for picking a fight, whether they use abusive language or Christ on a cross to do so. I doubt very much that a student who just happened to be wearing an American Flag pin or shirt on Cinco de Mayo would have been sent home.

Making this issue about the flag is doing the same thing as those asshat minorities who turn any valid complaint into a race issue. IMO, using my beloved flag for that purpose is as much a desecration of it as burning it or wiping my *** with it.

 

[Stac3y]

For what it's worth, it really bothers me to see people wear U.S. flags as clothing (not pictures of flags on shirts or whatever, but clothes that look like they are made out of flags). It makes me think they're rubbing the flag on their butts or underarms--seems disrespectful to me. I know that's kind of unreasonable of me, but it squicks me anyway.

 

[MJS]

Interesting. Someone got bent because the US flag was displayed on a shirt during Cinco De Mayo. Interesting, because the US of A seems to be the #1 place that numerous people seem to flock to, both legally and ILLEGALLY! If its such a bad place, if wearing these shirts was such a bad thing, then get the hell out of the US!

 

[MBuzzy]

For what it's worth, it really bothers me to see people wear U.S. flags as clothing (not pictures of flags on shirts or whatever, but clothes that look like they are made out of flags). It makes me think they're rubbing the flag on their butts or underarms--seems disrespectful to me. I know that's kind of unreasonable of me, but it squicks me anyway.

Actually - you're right...if you want to talk about Patriotism, wearing "flag clothing" to include bandanas, shirts, arm bands, etc are all violations of the US Flag Code. In fact, the most common offenders that I see of the Flag Code are those who claim to be the most patriotic. If you were truly patriotic, you would show it the proper respect and adhere to the rules that were created for its use and display. If you don't know them, EVERY American should read the flag code.

I think that too many people are missing the point here. These kids were not some noble patriots, they were CHILDREN, trying to start a fight. Nothing more. This is not about rights or patriotism, it is about kids, being kids and trying to provoke other kids. Why on THAT DAY? Why THAT many kids?? Do any of you know anything about the current tensions and situations at that school?

I feel that the Vice Principal was acting in the best interest of the student body and possibly protecting the safety of students.

This has nothing to do with anyone liking or disliking the country or violating freedoms....THIS is why biased news agencies are the worst thing that has EVER happened to the US, it ensures that the general public do not use their own brains to form an opinion. Look at this from an objective point of view.

And if that doesn't work - ask yourself what you'd be saying if a fight had broken out? If someone had gotten knifed? What if it was one of the American kids assaulting a Mexican kid? I know that if one of those five kids (and you're kidding yourself if you think those kids didn't realize this part) got beat up or injured??? The whole country would be calling for the heads of any mexican and screaming that we shouldn't celebrate cinco de mayo.......but they'd be perfectly happy to go to their local mexican restaurant and drink margaritas pretending to know what the holiday is about. Far too often, we as Americans refuse to respect other cultures and cling to some ideal that "This is America, leave your culture at the door," then do disrespectful things out of some sense of entitlement.....But America was BUILT on those other cultures.

Of all of the countries that I've been in, I can tell that you that I am VERY PROUD to be American because when I look around, (particularly the military and Americans who live there, not so much the tourists) we do a good job at respecting other cultures, despite who they are.

Case in point - while deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan, American troops DO NOT eat or drink outside or in the view of the locals in respect of Ramadan. I'm proud to be the better man and respect their culture despite the fact that their countrymen are killing my friends.

 

[crushing]

These things, including whether or not the wearing of a representation of the flag (not the actual flag) violates the US Code (only in Washington DC?) were also discussed in this thread:

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=87254

 

[MBuzzy]

These things, including whether or not the wearing of a representation of the flag (not the actual flag) violates the US Code (only in Washington DC?) were also discussed in this thread:

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=87254

Thank you for the link! Same discussion - and judging from the picture....it would be hard to convince someone that they were not trying to start a fight, considering 2 of their shirts are cage fighting based...

 

[crushing]

I feel that the Vice Principal was acting in the best interest of the student body and possibly protecting the safety of students.

So many questions come out of this. How do a vice principal's low expectations of his students up to and including possible violence affect those students? Do they create (more) distrust and become self fulfilling? Was there a racial component to lead the school authorities to believe there the safety of students was in jeopardy? Did they miss out on a teachable/learnable moment where they could first seek to understand?