Self Defense for Women

[drop bear]

Well even when they train, and learn how to use them properly they end up killing themselves, an innocent bystander, or end up getting the weapon turned on themselves.

Heck, look at American cops. They're wrongfully gunning down people left and right instead of using alternative measures. If they can't be trusted with guns with their training, then the average citizen shouldn't be either. Arming the population simply leads to a more paranoid society as a whole.

As i have said i am middle ground here.

If you are talking 3 days? Of training and have come to the conclusion that you have to shoot someone because you are too gumby to arrest them. Then yes the system that lets people habe guns needs a fix.

But if the person could show he can use a gun with responsibility. Then the issue is lessened.

 

[ballen0351]

The media absolutely does sexualize young people and promotes unhealthy ideas about sex and relationships and one's interactions with the opposite sex, that's definitely true, but I think that's the result rather than the cause. Most of the people in charge of "the media" are middle-aged or older men. They weren't watching sexy music videos as kids. I think, rather, they view teenage girls as sex objects and then that influences the media that gets made.

I think the media uses What it thinks will,work. If they think sex sells they use it. If donkeys dressed as carrots worked then they would use that. Its less about sex more about money

 

[Hanzou]

if your not able to tell the difference between a simple fight and a home invasion robbery then it's kind of hard to discuss using any type of self defense
hitting him with a mack truck would be ok in that instance.

It wasn't a simple fight because the woman was woefully unequipped to defend herself. Had she trained in a proper martial art things may have been a bit more fair.

doesn't matter if I am, you are so I used it

So are you recanting your earlier statements about the website using false information and "nonsense"?

you do know Its possible to kill a little girl without a gun right? And in this guys situation had his family and friends stepped up and reported him and his behavior prior he could have possibly gotten some help. Instead they wait until after he kills and then say oh yeah he was acting crazy. Again 1 death prices nothing when you have several hundred thousand people a year defending themselves with a gun

Somehow I think if this guy approached their car window with a knife that little girl would still be alive.

After Sandy Hook a crazed man in China attacked a school full of children with a knife, and no one was killed. A lot more were killed in Connecticut because a large segment of Americans still think that they live in the Wild West and can't leave their homes without a gun at their side.

 

[ballen0351]

It wasn't a simple fight because the woman was woefully unequipped to defend herself. Had she trained in a proper martial art things may have been a bit more fair.

No it wasn't a fight because it was in her living room. That makes it a home invasion/ robbery.

So are you recanting your earlier statements about the website using false information and "nonsense"?

No the article you posted was nonsense opinion based and lacking of facts. The arrival I posted was using numbers from,the CDC study if you would prefer I can post the actual CDC study and not the slate article

Somehow I think if this guy approached their car window with a knife that little girl would still be alive.

Or he would have stabbed her sooner or later at the house. He was friends with the family and he was CRAZY.

After Sandy Hook a crazed man in China attacked a school full of children with a knife, and no one was killed. A lot more were killed in Connecticut because a large segment of Americans still think that they live in the Wild West and can't leave their homes without a gun at their side.

well had someone in Connecticut had a gun at their side alot,less,kids may have been killed. Dude the facts speak for them selves hundreds of thousands of positive self defense uses of guns a year. That's hundreds of thousands of less victims

 

[drop bear]

well had someone in Connecticut had a gun at their side alot,less,kids may have been killed. Dude the facts speak for them selves hundreds of thousands of positive self defense uses of guns a year. That's hundreds of thousands of less victims

The facts still have a source.

 

[ballen0351]

The facts still have a source.

Yes the CDC study that Obama ordered

 

[drop bear]

Yes the CDC study that Obama ordered

This one?

First Reports Evaluating the Effectiveness of Strategies for Preventing Violence: Firearms Laws

 

[oftheherd1]

Well even when they train, and learn how to use them properly they end up killing themselves, an innocent bystander, or end up getting the weapon turned on themselves.

Heck, look at American cops. They're wrongfully gunning down people left and right instead of using alternative measures. If they can't be trusted with guns with their training, then the average citizen shouldn't be either. Arming the population simply leads to a more paranoid society as a whole.

OK, you don't like people having guns. Why not? What are you really against and why? Does the martial art you train in have no lethal techniques? You may say a person with a gun can kill more people in a shorter time. True.

But if you train in a martial art with lethal techniques, and learn how to use them properly, why aren't you and others killing innocent people and yourselves?

And America cops wrongfully gunning down people right and left instead of using alternate measures? Really? Do you think you may have overstated things a little? Are you trying to bait ballen0351? Do you think there is a possibility you may bait/insult a lot of good cops? Or don't you think there are any good cops?

Do think there is a difference between a split second decision whether to use lethal force or not, and intentionally using lethal force illegally?

 

[RTKDCMB]

hitting him with a mack truck would be ok in that instance.

Bit hard to get into your living room.

 

[ballen0351]

Bit hard to get into your living room.

drive thru beeep beeeepp

 

[Hanzou]

OK, you don't like people having guns. Why not? What are you really against and why? Does the martial art you train in have no lethal techniques? You may say a person with a gun can kill more people in a shorter time. True.

But if you train in a martial art with lethal techniques, and learn how to use them properly, why aren't you and others killing innocent people and yourselves?

Because it requires a great deal of training to set up a choke or a throw in my martial art. It requires next to zero training to load a gun and fire it in a general direction and harm or kill someone. Heck there are examples of 5-6 year old children killing people with loaded guns.

And America cops wrongfully gunning down people right and left instead of using alternate measures? Really? Do you think you may have overstated things a little? Are you trying to bait ballen0351? Do you think there is a possibility you may bait/insult a lot of good cops? Or don't you think there are any good cops?

For every bad cop out there, there are entire police departments that cover up for them. Take that recent incident in Chicago for example where the cop shot a knife-wielding kid on the ground 16 times. It took a year for that case to go to trial, and the only reason it reached that point was because of a video. Before that video, the cops (not just the shooter, but every cop on the scene) outright lied about the incidents that took place leading up to the shooting.

Do think there is a difference between a split second decision whether to use lethal force or not, and intentionally using lethal force illegally?

Certainly, and my point was that those with the most training (cops) can't even be trusted to make those decisions, so how can ordinary citizens?

 

[ballen0351]

Because it requires a great deal of training to set up a choke or a throw in my martial art. It requires next to zero training to load a gun and fire it in a general direction and harm or kill someone. Heck there are examples of 5-6 year old children killing people with loaded guns.

you do realize people have been strangling eachohter to death with no training forever right. Its not rocket science. I bet you can even figure it out

 

[CatNap]

What do you think is the best form of martial arts for women? One that can help them with assaults?

I think the best training is one that they'll show up for class for. There's no best martial arts style for women any more than there are "guns for ladies." Whatever works.....

Laura

 

[oftheherd1]

Because it requires a great deal of training to set up a choke or a throw in my martial art. It requires next to zero training to load a gun and fire it in a general direction and harm or kill someone. Heck there are examples of 5-6 year old children killing people with loaded guns.

I never learned how to choke in my art, only how to defend it. But we did learn very early on how to use throws. Naturally we got better at throwing the longer we trained. But I see no connection between throwing and accidently or illegally killing with a gun. Your last two sentences are disconnected. The fact that young children have played with loaded guns and accidently killed someone does not mean they know how to load a gun, much less that they are old enough to form a legally malicious intent. I think your whole argument is weak; see ballen0351's post just above on choking.

For every bad cop out there, there are entire police departments that cover up for them. Take that recent incident in Chicago for example where the cop shot a knife-wielding kid on the ground 16 times. It took a year for that case to go to trial, and the only reason it reached that point was because of a video. Before that video, the cops (not just the shooter, but every cop on the scene) outright lied about the incidents that took place leading up to the shooting.?

None of that is proven, other than that it certainly appears to be an illegal killing by the video. It is indeed difficult to defend shooting 16 rounds, some of which were reportedly fired while the person was already down, and only armed with a knife, and there were other officers who could have engaged the suspect. But how do you know that every cop on the scene lied? They may have, do you have inside information? I think they would not likely prosecute with only the video. Maybe they have made a deal with the other cops. Do you have any facts on that? Perhaps more importantly, can you show where type of illegal behavior is rampant?

Certainly, and my point was that those with the most training (cops) can't even be trusted to make those decisions, so how can ordinary citizens?

So is your complaint that cops can't be trusted to make the split second decisions you would have made (after you have had time to analyze the situation and think about it for a while?) They do that anyway, knowing there are no muggins.

As to ordinary citizens, where do you think police come from? Regarding the uptick in gun violence, where do you think it comes from? Do you think the guns are responsible? Why in the late 40s, 50s, 60s and later, there was not the same level of mass gun violence?

Nonetheless, what does that have to do with the difference between a split second decision and an illegal act?

 

[Hanzou]

I never learned how to choke in my art, only how to defend it. But we did learn very early on how to use throws. Naturally we got better at throwing the longer we trained. But I see no connection between throwing and accidently or illegally killing with a gun. Your last two sentences are disconnected. The fact that young children have played with loaded guns and accidently killed someone does not mean they know how to load a gun, much less that they are old enough to form a legally malicious intent. I think your whole argument is weak; see ballen0351's post just above on choking.

Yet children DO kill each other with guns. The fact that they may not know how to load them is fairly irrelevant. Children killing each other with guns is such a problem that there's actually laws that require owners to keep their guns unloaded and locked up. There aren't many cases of children choking each other to death.

It takes training to choke someone in an efficient manner. The choking Ballen is talking about is choking utilizing brute force typically performed by assailants far larger than the people they're choking. The choking I'm talking about is the type of choking that weaker people can perform on much stronger people, and choke them out fairly quickly. The latter type of choking requires a great deal of training to pull off.

The same applies to throwing. Quite difficult for a 120 lb person to throw a 200+ lb person untrained. Quite another thing for a 120 lb Judo black belt to do it.

None of that is proven, other than that it certainly appears to be an illegal killing by the video. It is indeed difficult to defend shooting 16 rounds, some of which were reportedly fired while the person was already down, and only armed with a knife, and there were other officers who could have engaged the suspect. But how do you know that every cop on the scene lied? They may have, do you have inside information? I think they would not likely prosecute with only the video. Maybe they have made a deal with the other cops. Do you have any facts on that? Perhaps more importantly, can you show where type of illegal behavior is rampant?

There's the case in Cleveland where cops shot the 12 year old, and lied about what happened. Video proved otherwise. There's the case in South Carolina where the cop shot the black gentleman in the back and said that he fought over his taser. Video proved that untrue. There's the case in Baltimore where the guy was placed in the back of a cruiser and got his spine snapped. Then there's the case in Minnesota where the guy was shot while he was handcuffed. Then there's the aforementioned Chicago situation.

All of that has happened within the last year. Seems pretty rampant to me.

So is your complaint that cops can't be trusted to make the split second decisions you would have made (after you have had time to analyze the situation and think about it for a while?) They do that anyway, knowing there are no muggins.

As to ordinary citizens, where do you think police come from? Regarding the uptick in gun violence, where do you think it comes from? Do you think the guns are responsible? Why in the late 40s, 50s, 60s and later, there was not the same level of mass gun violence?

Nonetheless, what does that have to do with the difference between a split second decision and an illegal act?

My complaint is that if the police can't be trusted to make split second decisions with firearms (as demonstrated in several cases around the country), and they get loads of training, how can the same be expected of ordinary people who get considerably less to zero training?

I'll let you have the last word though, since this topic isn't the purpose of this thread.

 

[ballen0351]

Yet children DO kill each other with guns. The fact that they may not know how to load them is fairly irrelevant. Children killing each other with guns is such a problem that there's actually laws that require owners to keep their guns unloaded and locked up.

300,000,000 guns in the US and 99.99% have never been used by a kid to kill another kid so its really NOT that common.

There aren't many cases of children choking each other to death
It takes training to choke someone in an efficient manner. The choking Ballen is talking about is choking utilizing brute force typically performed by assailants far larger than the people they're choking. The choking I'm talking about is the type of choking that weaker people can perform on much stronger people, and choke them out fairly quickly. The latter type of choking requires a great deal of training to pull off.
.

LOL wait so we are only allowed to talk about the type of chokes you want to discuss? The far more common and the kind you don't need any training for as you described we just are supposed to forget about them? Ok then we are not allowed to talk about handgun violence we only can discuss skill snipers that murder people

 

[Hanzou]

300,000,000 guns in the US and 99.99% have never been used by a kid to kill another kid so its really NOT that common.

Yet thousands of children are killed every year by other children. Ever hear of a toddler choking a baby to death? I haven't, but a toddler has shot a baby while their parents were in the store.

LOL wait so we are only allowed to talk about the type of chokes you want to discuss? The far more common and the kind you don't need any training for as you described we just are supposed to forget about them?

Chokes only came up because I was asked if there were lethal techniques in my system of martial arts. Chokes are part of that system, however the chokes we do aren't the same types of chokes you're describing.

 

[ballen0351]

Yet thousands of children are killed every year by other children. Ever hear of a toddler choking a baby to death? I haven't, but a toddler has shot a baby while their parents were in the store.

There are not "thousands" of children killed every year by other kids with guns lol

Chokes only came up because I was asked if there were lethal techniques in my system of martial arts. Chokes are part of that system, however the chokes we do aren't the same types of chokes you're describing.

And ? they are still effective. Your claim was you needed skill and training to choke someone to death and thats just not true.[/quote][/QUOTE]

 

[Hanzou]

There are not "thousands" of children killed every year by other kids with guns lol

Yeah, my mistake, I got that number mixed up with the total number of children killed by guns annually in the U.S.

And ? they are still effective. Your claim was you needed skill and training to choke someone to death and thats just not true.

[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

My argument was that you need skill and training to apply the chokes from my martial art. The kind of chokes you're talking about have limited effectiveness, and are easy to counter.

 

[ballen0351]

Yeah, my mistake, I got that number mixed up with the total number of children killed by guns annually in the U.S.

even that number still isnt thousands

My argument was that you need skill and training to apply the chokes from my martial art. The kind of chokes you're talking about have limited effectiveness, and are easy to counter.

if you call death limited effectivness ok