Ninjutsu on Discovery Channel

[DuckofDeath]

You know that several e-budo members tried to prove one way or another if Padgett existed and really wrote that letter. The web site manager or Dux never has given a way to contact anyone named Padgett to confirm the facts. Sojobow told us to check the military. Some e-budo members tried and found out that the military will not give out personal information like that. Sojobow then tried to say that if we had special contacts in the military we could confirm it.

That is not independent proof that anyone can check for themselves. That would not stand up in a court of law. Dux has failed to back up and prove his accusations against the military and the CIA.

Padgett was in the military? Where did that little tidbit come from?

 

[Jay Bell]

Some e-budo members tried and found out that the military will not give out personal information like that. Sojobow then tried to say that if we had special contacts in the military we could confirm it.

True. Unless the information is being obtained for journalist purposes....*nudgenudge*

 

[DuckofDeath]

True. Unless the information is being obtained for journalist purposes....*nudgenudge*

But was Padgett even in the military?

 

[Don Roley]

Padgett was in the military? Where did that little tidbit come from?

Woops!
I was thinking of the first guy Sojobow tossed out as "proof" that Dux really was a secret agent, etc and the CIA was out to get him. The guy was supposably an ex-Navy guy who did something like support Dux by putting him ashore when Dux was working in central America. Again, no one was able to find the guy.

And I would be interested in seeing if Padgett can actually be found and evaluated as a witness. Since Dux is accusing the CIA, it is Dux's responsibility to back up those accusations and let others look at the evidence. Can you find him?

 

[sojobow]

Here is the thing, Frank Dux claimed that he was CIA agent. The CIA denied this. Sources as varied as the LA Times and Soldier of Fortune Magazine looked at his claims and proclaimed them bull feces.

I'd like to make this simple inquiry. After which I do not intend to participate in this discussion (Ninjutsu on the Discovery Channel???) as just about every Martial Arts Forum has discussed, in length, Hanshi Frank Dux in depth with the same results - the thread is usually closed by the Moderator due to opinions approaching infinity.

1) --- Be so kind as to show us where Frank Dux claimed to be a CIA "agent" (i.e., an employee of the CIA that works in the field) -- (in reference to your first sentence);

2) --- Post the CIA denial (not where someone said the CIA denied it). -- (in reference to your second sentence).

Thanx.

 

[Don Roley]

1) --- Be so kind as to show us where Frank Dux claimed to be a CIA "agent" (i.e., an employee of the CIA that works in the field) -- (in reference to your first sentence);

2) --- Post the CIA denial (not where someone said the CIA denied it). -- (in reference to your second sentence).

Thanx.

1) errrrrr, "The Secret Man" by Frank Dux.


artyon:

And for #2, are you saying there is a conspiracy to say the CIA denied him, when they really did not.

Where is that smiley for rolling on the floor and laughing now that I need it?

 

[TimoS]

Where is that smiley for rolling on the floor and laughing now that I need it?

Here, use this: :roflmao:

 

[sojobow]

1) errrrrr, "The Secret Man" by Frank Dux.
artyon:
And for #2, are you saying there is a conspiracy to say the CIA denied him, when they really did not.

Where is that smiley for rolling on the floor and laughing now that I need it?

My inquiries are very simple. But since you seem have problems with them, allow me to try once again. Note the "show us" for both request #1 and #2. According to you, you are accussing Hanshi of making your statement in the first sentence. You are accussing the CIA for making the second statement. So - very simply - show us where.

 

[sojobow]

Besides, at least how his "dim mak" is portrayed in the movie, Dux doesn't even seem to understand what the principle is supposed to be in the first place. Its not some "vibrating chi palm" used to break bricks --- its attacking meridian lines. Bah, smells like horsecrap to me. Laterz.

You may be able to assist all on this one. You say "his "dim mak" is portrayed in the movie."" Hanshi didn't write the screenplay, produce or direct the movie. As far as I am able to tell, Hanshi's responsibility was limited only to fight scene development (choreography) so you may be giving him credit for something that should be attributed to others.

So when you and others here say that "Dux doesn't even seem to understand what the principle is supposed to be in the first place.", it seems to be another example of him and or his students having to defend against something unwarranted.

Laterz

 

[Don Roley]

My inquiries are very simple. But since you seem have problems with them, allow me to try once again.

Ah, since you seem to want to pursue one question, then the prior question would seem to have precedence. Your statement above shows you have no valid excuse to avoid it since you pursue your own question. As I wrote in another thread,

Here is a test, what is your sources for what you wrote about the differences between the "clans" of Iga and the "Families" of Koga, or whatever the heck it was.

Go ahead. I am waiting and may answer your questions about all the errors you made when you deal with the question already on the table. You are too used to ducking questions when it is convinient and I asked that question a long time ago.

 

[sojobow]

Ah, since you seem to want to pursue one question, then the prior question would seem to have precedence. Your statement above shows you have no valid excuse to avoid it since you pursue your own question. As I wrote in another thread,

As I am not writing or researching for the purpose of presenting any type of academic discourse, I rarely retain or maintain any type of credit log, source reference logs etc. However, if it will help you in the least, my statements are rather common knowledge on the Internet, books on Ninjitsu history, TLC (the learning channel), the History Channel, the Discovery Channel. In fact, I recently (actully, it was on TV yesturday) watched a documentary on the History Channel entitled "Samauri." The term "Clan" was used (and defined) quite frequently by most of the Professors of Japanese History from UCLA, Uof Georgia (Dr. Friday), and a couple of others of which I didn't write down their names. There have also been these type of documentaries on these cable channels on the subject of Ninjitsu with the same and or additional Professors presenting their research. They (these Professors) also expressed these same definitions of Clans and Families. Basically, Clans are extended families.

I usually give a lot of credit to those individuals with University-level knowledge as their research is usually commendable especially since they make a living dependant upon credible research. I also have excellent and knowledgeable Sensei.

As for as my 2 simple requests, you made both statements attributable to a quote by Hanshi and the CIA. Simple post the statements you possess to back up your statements.

 

[Don Roley]

As I am not writing or researching for the purpose of presenting any type of academic discourse, I rarely retain or maintain any type of credit log, source reference logs etc. However, if it will help you in the least, my statements are rather common knowledge on the Internet, books on Ninjitsu history, TLC (the learning channel), the History Channel, the Discovery Channel.

Bovine feces.

Here is what you wrote,

Very basic in that Koga's seemed to believe that the art is passed within direct family members. Husband taught the two kids as the wife had already been taught by her father and mother. No need of ranks as there is literally only father and mother = (teacher) and children = student. On assignments, all 4 were one. No need for Dojo's, organizations, institutions, certificates, etc. Training started very shortly after birth and all training was hidden from the public. The only "school" attended by a Koga was at the Yamabushi Temple -- something like going to church on Sundays unless you were adopted by the monks in which case, your 'family' included everyone at the Temples which was not uncommon.

Iga seemed to train and operate in a more "clan" relationship. Your clan may have included every family in the general neighborhood thus your clan may have included 5 families, 10 families, in-laws, 3rd cousins, 2nd cousins, grandparents etc. Thus, these 20 to 50 individuals would require organization, schools etc. I'd rather those from the Iga side enlighten you on their system's development.

This type of stuff is not on TLC or any respectable source that I can think of, or that you seem able to site. And you said it with a lot certainty. If it was common knowledge, you should be able to find a source fairly easily.

Try again.

 

[sojobow]

Bovine feces.

This type of stuff is not on TLC or any respectable source that I can think of, or that you seem able to site. And you said it with a lot certainty. If it was common knowledge, you should be able to find a source fairly easily.

Try again.

So, you go over to another thread and bring that conversation here. It is evident what your motives are. Stick to the point. You accused Frank Dux of stating that he worked for the CIA (see my reply above). You also said that the CIA debuked the statement by Frank Dux. I say, show us the Frank Dux statement (direct quote and source please). Then, show us the link to the CIA's debuke of the Frank Dux alledged statement. Since it is you making the accusations, you should have no problem showing us that you have told the truth to begin with (or is your inability to display truth an example of your own "Bovine feces?"

Second: I guess you completely, due to selective ignorance, refused to recognize this simple sentence in my reply to Tshadowchaser which you decided to bring over to this thread. I'll quote if for you: ...... I'd rather those from the Iga side enlighten you on their system's development......

You haven't put forth any effort whatsoever in responding to the gentleman's extremely serious question. When someone "can't do," any excuse will do. I know what the both of you are trying to bait me into assisting you with. I would have helped. All both of you need have done was simply ask me. Let's try adding something of worth to this Forum.

I await the links to your proof of truth.

 

[Don Roley]

I say, show us the Frank Dux statement (direct quote and source please). Then, show us the link to the CIA's debuke of the Frank Dux alledged statement.

"As I am not writing or researching for the purpose of presenting any type of academic discourse, I rarely retain or maintain any type of credit log, source reference logs etc. However, if it will help you in the least, my statements are rather common knowledge on the Internet, books on Ninjitsu history, TLC (the learning channel), the History Channel, the Discovery Channel."


artyon:

 

[DuckofDeath]

Woops!
I was thinking of the first guy Sojobow tossed out as "proof" that Dux really was a secret agent, etc and the CIA was out to get him. The guy was supposably an ex-Navy guy who did something like support Dux by putting him ashore when Dux was working in central America. Again, no one was able to find the guy.

And I would be interested in seeing if Padgett can actually be found and evaluated as a witness. Since Dux is accusing the CIA, it is Dux's responsibility to back up those accusations and let others look at the evidence. Can you find him?

The one you were probably thinking of is Lt. Cmdr. Alexander Martin, USN (ret.):

http://www.frankdux.com/facts/martin/intro.htm

He has this extreme kook site:

http://www.almartinraw.com

Padgett is the one whose mysterious disappearance was mentioned on the Frank Dux Forum. He was said to have been a friend and student of Dux and was also said to have some kind of mental problems, an allegation not denied by a poster named twigg who seemed to be a personal friend of Padgett and who took offense at Padgett's mental condition being brought up. I did a search on John Padgett II and came up with an e-mail address of a Washington state Trekkie, but the e-mail address was not current. I'll try to do a little more digging.

Question for discussion: If a mentally disturbed person is coaxed into signing off on a bogus declaration that he accompanied a famous exponent of Ninjitsu to the Ukraine to shoot a documentary, and the trip never happened and the documentary was never shot, and the mentally disturbed person was later believed to be a "security risk" to the contrived story, would the famous exponent of Ninjitsu have reason to want to make the security risk "disappear"?

 

[DuckofDeath]

I'd like to make this simple inquiry. After which I do not intend to participate in this discussion (Ninjutsu on the Discovery Channel???) as just about every Martial Arts Forum has discussed, in length, Hanshi Frank Dux in depth with the same results - the thread is usually closed by the Moderator due to opinions approaching infinity.

1) --- Be so kind as to show us where Frank Dux claimed to be a CIA "agent" (i.e., an employee of the CIA that works in the field) -- (in reference to your first sentence);

2) --- Post the CIA denial (not where someone said the CIA denied it). -- (in reference to your second sentence).

Thanx.

"He was the CIA's finest covert operative..." (Very first words on dust jacket of The Secret Man.)

http://www.frankdux.com/frankdux/frankdux.htm

"As fiction is never in need of denial and certainly not by an institution used to being the target of criticism, like the CIA, then why does the CIA feel compelled to issue any kind of official denial of Frank Dux book, The Secret Man, Harper Collins?" (From the FrankDux.com site. Why does Frank Dux himself state that the CIA felt compelled to issue an official denial of The Secret Man if it issued no such denial? Are you calling Hanshi a LIAR, sojobow?)

http://www.frankdux.com/frankdux/thefacts/miscpoints.htm

 

[DuckofDeath]

You may be able to assist all on this one. You say "his "dim mak" is portrayed in the movie."" Hanshi didn't write the screenplay, produce or direct the movie. As far as I am able to tell, Hanshi's responsibility was limited only to fight scene development (choreography) so you may be giving him credit for something that should be attributed to others.

So when you and others here say that "Dux doesn't even seem to understand what the principle is supposed to be in the first place.", it seems to be another example of him and or his students having to defend against something unwarranted.

Laterz

Dux himself describes his ability to break the bottom brick in the stack as being dim mak on page 65 of The Secret Man. There's also a picture of him doing this in the photo illustrations (although with not as many bricks as in the movie).

 

[Tgace]

Man this threads hit bottom......"eject goose!!! eject!! eject!! eject!!"

 

[DuckofDeath]

Man this threads hit bottom......"eject goose!!! eject!! eject!! eject!!"

If it's hit bottom, then there's no way to go but up, right? Excelsior!

 

[Cryozombie]

Why does every other thread in this forum degrade into a "These guys are frauds" thread?

C'mon... we are discussing the Discovery channel Special here guys, not the Wubulous World of Dr Dux...