Michael Bisping oh why you shouldn’t use BJJ in a street fight

Discussion in 'MMA' started by Headhunter, Jun 23, 2020.

  1. Headhunter

    Headhunter Senior Master

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    Great video from bisping. Love this guy no nonsense and says what he thinks. Also his first style was jiu jitsu that was base when he was a kid before moving to kickboxing and he was a street fighter in his youth and even went to prison for fighting so he knows about both worlds. I agree with everything he says in this video.


     
  2. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    [​IMG]
     
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  3. Headhunter

    Headhunter Senior Master

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    Oh yes I’m waiting for certain people to jump into this I know exactly which ones will as well
     
  4. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    i agree with you agreeing with him
     
  5. Steve

    Steve Mostly Harmless

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    So, you agree that if you're on your back, you should get up, and you should avoid going to your back, and you should "sweep him, get on top, and control him from guard?" I don't know... that sounds an awful lot like BJJ to me. As a troll, I give you a 2 out of 10.
     
  6. Headhunter

    Headhunter Senior Master

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    Yep you were one of them who I thought would get triggered. What’s the trolling? I posted a video.
     
  7. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    getting on top has much the same downside as being on the bottom, , thats is your prolonging the '' contest'' and you may have difficulty getting up quickly if the occasion demands.

    its clearly about context and situation how much of an issue it is, if your in the middle of nowhere and he is clearly on his own, then by all means take your time, if thers time imperative and or he has mates, then for god sake put him down hard, boot him and leave quickly, thers nothing to be gained by following him to the floor and staying there any longer than you have to
     
  8. Tony Dismukes

    Tony Dismukes MT Moderator Staff Member

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    The trolling comes from whoever titled the video. Probably they just titled it that way to garner views.

    Bisping never says you shouldn't use BJJ in a street fight. What he says is that you don't want to be stuck fighting on your back in a street fight. Guess what? The pioneers of BJJ would say the same thing.

    If you're on the ground in a real fight, you want to be on top. The reason we have guard is because sometimes you don't have a choice. If someone manages to tackle you to the ground and get on top of you (whether through superior wrestling or just through surprise), then achieving guard is much better than getting stuck in the bottom of mount. It gives you some ability to defend yourself and counterattack. Generally your preferred option if that happens is to sweep your opponent and get to the top where you can either control your opponent or disengage as appropriate. Not surprisingly, that's exactly what Bisping advocates. It's also the exact same thing that I, as a BJJ instructor, advocate.
     
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  9. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    im with everything you said aprt from one bit,
    why is it the preferred option to sweep, im not saying its a bad option, just its doesn't seem preferable to either punching your opponent over or slamming him over. both of which are fairly sure to take most of the fight out of him

    and then when you have used the less than optimal sweep, why is preferable to follow him down, the preferable option would seem to be to kick him or stamp him, both of which are A) very effective and b) you dont need to disengage to stand up in a hurry as your already standing, the time saved can be a life saver if his friend(s) are only a few meters away
     
  10. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Punching from under mount is pretty iffy. Not sure what your plan is for slamming from that position. “Sweep” as I understand it, is the BJJ term for moves from under mount to escape by putting them on the bottom, more or less.
     
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  11. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    no we are talking about from a standing position, if you on the bottom against multiple opponents you lost, its rather pointless doing anything much, if your on the top when his mates arive, you lost, which is what i took the quote in the video to relate to,,, STAND UP
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2020
  12. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    You might be, but the person you quoted wasn’t, when he spoke of sweeping. Before you get snotty, check your reading.
     
  13. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    well then he has veered massively from the topic in hand, which is BJJ is useless in street fights against multiple opponents, IF you go to the floor generally but most particularly if you dont get up more or less instantly, if you can use your BJJ skills from a standing position, to dump them over wreck their joints then its possibly as good as anything else

    deliberately putting yourself on the floor is close to suicide, having some way of getting from bottom to top just makes it easier for them to kick you, stay on the bottom and use the guy as a shield
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2020
  14. Tony Dismukes

    Tony Dismukes MT Moderator Staff Member

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    As Gerry notes, “sweep” in BJJ refers to reversing position from bottom of guard to get on top. For the takedown from standing, we’d generally call that a “foot sweep”. I was describing the optimal course if some has already taken you down and gotten on top of you. If you are already standing then you have more options.
     
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  15. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    thanks for the clarification, but we still have the issue raised in the vid, of multiple opponents and the problem of being immobile and at a handy kicking height

    im quite certain that bjj can be used effectively from a standing position, but the advice in the vid is good, dont go down and if you do dont mess about controlling the guy, get up at the shortest time you can
     
  16. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Ok. So people understand how fights work.

    There are elements of fighting that take place over a fraction of a second that can determine the outcome.

    Also fighting isn't a story. It is a puzzle. There isn't a single narrative that determines the outcome. There are infinite outcomes determined by our choices.

    So if you are on your back and the guy on top is hitting you you will probably have to deal with that first or you are going to have a bad day. And quite often that is by controlling the situation and denying them space.

    This is regardless as to whether you are concerned that a second person might come in and kick you.

    If you don't deal with the first problem you won't deal with the second problem.

    So the very first order of business is quite often closed guard, deny space and gain yourself a bit of time. Then when you are not eating elbows. Stand up, sweep, submit.
     
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  17. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    That issue is still pretty much there for the guy standing as well.
     
  18. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Read the bit where fighting isn't a story.
     
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  19. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Which is why people say this gsp like folkstyle wrestling is better for MMA.

    Which BJJ could compete or roll under that rule set if they wanted to.
     
  20. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    fighting multiple opponents is a challenge if you have multi directional mobility,it is more or less impossible if you kneeling on someones chest, you right of course standing isnt much better, moving whilst being upright is a lot better123
     

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