1. Hanzo04

    Hanzo04 Guest

    What makes kenpo a martial art and how effective is it? i only ask this question because me and my brother had an argument if it is or isn't a MA. i think it is a martial art but i couldn't back it up since i don't practice kenpo. so can someone justify me please? and by the way he was saying that kenpo was just street fighting and that it is nothing compared to kung fu. try not to be to harsh on him. lol!
     
  2. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    Kenpo is more of a way of thinking. We like to say Martial arts are what you do when your kenpo fails. In this context Kenpo is just another word for logic; however this is not everyones understanding and kenpo stylists are without a doubt practicing a unique and very recognizable martial art that is based on logic. However not all kenpo is logical because each practitioner brings his own shortcommings to any situation and that person may choose to kick on a gravely surface just as quick as a TKD person might and that would be illogical. Do we call what he did not kenpo, or do we simply say that that particular practitioner lacked principles and experience? As for your brother, I would let him know that these words get lost in translation and Kung Fu is just another way of articulating a "mastery" of about anything: cooks, florists, reapulsterers, you name it.
    Sean
     
  3. bzarnett

    bzarnett Guest

    Kung Fu in regards to martial arts, can be used to denote a system of pure fighting or a system of self-improvement. More correctly. Kung Fu is any system that takes time and effort to achieve proficiency in. Fut Gar Kung Fu is a pure fighting system - no moral philosophy. Hsing-I Ch'uan on the other hand has a strong moral and philosophical foundation based on the Tao. The term Kung Fu does not denote philosophy or the enlightened little sage on the mountain.

    Kenpo comes in many forms. Some are not practical for self-defense while others are very efficient self-defense forms. Since this is in the EPAK section, I would have to say that the approach to Kenpo makes it a competant system of fighting. Individuals like Mike Pick have used it in the military, while I know several police officers throughout the US that have used it effectivly in the line of work.

    American Kenpo Karate itself contains a deeply moral and philosophical foundation regarding personal development and refinement. One only needs to examine the Kenpo Creed, aspects of the Zen of Kenpo, or the teaching approach of Kenpo to see that it offers both sides of the picture - the scholar and the warrior.

    Regardless, the competance of American Kenpo lies in the individual - the teacher and the student. How we train will demonstrate how effective we are in using the art. Mr. Rebello is an excellent well-rounded practitioner of the art with the philosophy and the fighting skills. Mr. Skip Hancock is another fine example. On the other hand I have seen people who can do the show, but have no substance or practical skill. It's about attitude and the approach to training.

    I've been recently using the following definition to describe Kenpo. Kenpo is...

    1. The development of attitude, logic, basics, and fitness to reach new levels of refinement.

    2. Taking care of your concerns in regards to environment, predicament, and individuals within your sphere of influence

    3. Being Neutral to your environment, predicament, and individuals within your sphere of influence

    -----
    Bryan Zarnett
    www.SphereOfInfluence.ca
     
  4. tsunami

    tsunami Guest

    "When pure knuckles meets pure flesh, its pure martial arts." I belive Mr. Parker said something close to that. Question, what does your brother consider as criteria for qualifing or disqualifing any system as a MA? As far as effectiveness of any art. Its is the man who makes the art. A good man in a poor art could still do well. All arts have flaws. Kenpo lacks wrestling skills and weapons skills. I do Kali for weapons and would like to do ground fighting. I have tried several other styles and I must confess, I am a Kenpo/Kali addict and would not waste my time if I thought it was lame.
     
  5. Gin-Gin

    Gin-Gin Senior Master

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    Actually, I believe the saying is: "There are no pure styles of Karate. Purity comes only when pure knuckles meet pure flesh no matter who delivers or receives." I agree with you, how well the person trains will decide how effective their art will be. In Vol. I of Infinite Insights into Kenpo, Mr. Parker said: "the truth for both lies in the actual moment of combat."

    Respectfully,
    Gin-Gin :asian:
     
  6. kenpoworks

    kenpoworks Purple Belt

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    "martial" Pertaining To War.

    "art" ....a Form Of Expression...

    Kenpo Could Fulfil One Of Both Of These Criteria At A Given Time.
     
  7. Doc

    Doc Senior Master

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    :)
     
  8. Doc

    Doc Senior Master

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    Please make an attempt to not characterize all Kenpo based on the limitations of your personal knowledge, skills, and instructions you have received. There are many who have been taught, and address these issues, myself included. Painting such a large body of information that emcompasses so many decades, teachers, students, and interpretations with your personall broad stroke of understanding is counter-productive in discussions.

    Thanks
     
  9. Dark Kenpo Lord

    Dark Kenpo Lord Brown Belt

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  10. MJS

    MJS Administrator Staff Member

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  11. Bill Lear

    Bill Lear Brown Belt

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    I 100% DISAGREE WITH YOU. :rolleyes:

    Here are a couple of Ed Parker quotes that you seem to have missed:

    "Positive innovations are imminent when you keep an open mind."

    "Don't look for answers beyond your realm of understanding, for more often than not, many answers are before you that have been overlooked."
     
  12. parkerkarate

    parkerkarate Blue Belt

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    Kenpo is made up of three styles of fighting, two of which are martial arts. It is made of Kung-Fu, Jujitsu, and boxing. As I see it as long as you are munipulating a person, while using kicks, punches, and ect... that makes it a martial art. As I see it Kenpo is very effective because there is just not one way of moving. After learning all our techniques you can improvise. When you are on the street and some guy throws a right punch at you, you are not going to think, OK Five Swords. You might use part of it, but the guy id just not going to stand there and take it, he will move and you will have to move wit him. Lets take a look at Kung-Fu, big circular movements right, now take the extensions to most of these techniques, BIG CIRCULAR MOVEMENTS just like Kung-Fu. Plus take a look at Mr. Parkers books, there you will see what kenpo is really made of.
     
  13. parkerkarate

    parkerkarate Blue Belt

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    Originally Posted by tsunami
    Kenpo lacks wrestling skills and weapons skills


    If it lacks wrestling skill than how come we are putting the guy to the ground most of the time? Yes, we do not have many nife and gun techniques, but take a look at all our club techniques. Plus all our knife and gun techniques are for higher belt levels, which means by that time they should be able to figure out what to do with a gun or knife.

    I do not mean to be rude but unless people can really back up what they are saying than they should not be posting stuff. I did not spend 8 years learning all of this to just read what some people say to "put down" kenpo. If you ask me unless you are in kenpo or know anything about it you have no right to talk bad about it.
     
  14. pete

    pete Master Black Belt

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    i don't think he's talking bad about it, just with limited information. my information is similarly limited but that will change because my mind is open, and i'll seek the answers. truthfully, we practice many techniques that take down the attacker, and some that have us down while the attacker remains up... but how many and which ones specifically place us (the defender) on the ground with the attacker?

    No doc and dark lord, this is not for you guys (yet)... i'm sure you have stuff outside the norm...

    not the way i've learned them... circular yes, but tight rather than big...

    pete
     
  15. parkerkarate

    parkerkarate Blue Belt

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    OK my man you got me there, the only techniques that I know so far when we are on the ground would be Ecounter with Danger, and Bowing to Buddah. But neither of these techniques are ground techniques for two people. I did not mean to come out being mean at all, just an early morning with a stupid Bio test. Sometimes college can get to you.
     
  16. parkerkarate

    parkerkarate Blue Belt

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    If you do not mind, could you tell me what belt you are. I am a little confused. of your style and level. I do not mean to be rude.
     
  17. parkerkarate

    parkerkarate Blue Belt

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    If you can take a look at Mr. Parker doing techniques and see how he moves than you will see wher I am coming from with the whole circular movements and Kung-Fu.
     
  18. pete

    pete Master Black Belt

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    Its not the circular movements being challenged, but the emphasis on BIG.

    I try to keep most of my circles in the techniques and extensions smaller and tighter by locking and controling joints in sequence, thereby needing less motion and exposure on my part to manipulate my attacker.

    If you mean BIG circles for continuous striking sequences, i still try to keep them small, more as a natural flow from changes in stance driven by the hips than as BIG circular arm movements.

    Where do you see advantages or applications of BIG circles in kenpo... they are there and have their place, just that i don't see them as prevalent as smaller tighter circles.

    thanks for the conversation...

    pete
     
  19. parkerkarate

    parkerkarate Blue Belt

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    No problem. I like these kinds of conversations.

    hmmmmm, lets go out on a limb here, Thundering Hammer, all of those hammer fists. They are all circular, but not outragously big. But it is true, what you said about tightening up those circles, I do the same thing, it creates more speed and power.
     
  20. tsunami

    tsunami Guest

    geez you guys are uptight. To most people kenpo is a hand art. You can extraplelate ground applications and I will not get out of Kenpo because I love it and still have alot to explore. This however does not make Kenpo the best wrestling stye known to man. Nor is Kenpo a highly weapon oriented art as is Kali.

    George
     

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