Does the advice people give kids being bullied to simply punch them in the face actually end it?

Discussion in 'General Self Defense' started by Chrisinmd, Apr 12, 2019.

  1. Chrisinmd

    Chrisinmd Yellow Belt

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    Does the advice people give kids being bullied to simply punch them in the face actually end it? I know from some fights I have seen for example was the first job I worked at. I remember one fight the guy being bullied punched the guy in the face and the other guy responded and beat him pretty good punching him and bloodying him up pretty good. I don't remember people stopping screwing with you simply because he fought back and threw a punch. I don't think this myth that you simply fight back and then you earn respect and become best buddies after words is reality from what I have seen.

    Another example was we had a mentally disabled guy that also worked their that people liked to screw with. He would go off verbally on them, get in their face and start screaming at them. So I know at least he stood up for himself verbally although I never personally seem him get physical. But I don't remember that ending the bullying either.

    So the advice that you simply have to fight back to end bullying seems not to be the case to me. Seems like you have to win. Thoughts?

    In my opinion if someone wants to kick your ****, they're not going to be nice about it. The idea that fights are some sort of gentleman's game, where two people face off and fight fair and square, seems like a bit of Hollywood mythology to me. None of my fights I have seen were like that.
     
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  2. kempodisciple

    kempodisciple MT Moderator Staff Member

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    It seems like you've already got your answer, so why ask the question?
     
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  3. CB Jones

    CB Jones Senior Master

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    I dont know about punching in the face but I do believe kids need to learn to be self confident, stand up for themselves, and learn conflict resolution.

    You dont learn that in your youth and you are in for some hard times as an adult in the real world.
     
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  4. ShortBridge

    ShortBridge Black Belt

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    Works great, here's a clip.

     
  5. Chrisinmd

    Chrisinmd Yellow Belt

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    I don't know the answer that why I asked the question. I know what I have observed in the past but that may not be indicative of reality or what others have experienced
     
  6. Chrisinmd

    Chrisinmd Yellow Belt

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    Great clip! Wish I would have thought of doing that when I was getting fired from my first job! lol
     
  7. CB Jones

    CB Jones Senior Master

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    Every situation is different. There is no standard answer that will cover everything. That's why it is important to learn conflict resolution as a youth.
     
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  8. Danny T

    Danny T Senior Master

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    The reality is every situation is different.
    Most, not all, bullies have a confidence issue it that they are constantly having to prove themselves.
    Having the confidence to not let a bully get to you mentally is important. Deflect and redirect their conversation but be prepared for the verbal vitriol they will throw back. Just keep redirecting it but allowing an out that they save face. Otherwise it will most likely become physical. Read the body language.
    Those who don't learn conflict resolution as youngsters will have problems in arguments and as well as feel bullied even non bullying incidents as adults.
     
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  9. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    well sort of, you may need to actually beat them to a pulp, or at least punch them every time till it sinks in, that they are going to get punched, then they may come back with their mates or their big brother, so then you need to wait till you see them on their own and beat them up again.

    generally speaking having a rep as a complete psycho that's going to sneak up behind you with a big stick, means people leave you alone
     
  10. Buka

    Buka MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Complicated question, too many variables to have a one size fits all resolution.

    Sometimes....fighting back changes how you are perceived by others in a peer group. The victim of bullying, once fighting back, might no longer be perceived as a victim at all.

    That can also carry out to other walks of life. Skip to a minute ten if you don't want to wait.

     
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  11. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    The psychology of ending the cycle of being bullied goes deeper then "just a punch". If that is your impression of the advise then either you or your source missed the point. It's not about a punch or fighting back. It's about not being a victim. There are behavioral patterns of being a victim and not being a victim. Bullies tend to gravitate to those people who exhibit victim behaviors. It's kind of a taboo view point but the victim often behaves in such a way that brings about their own victim hood. I'm not blaming the victim, as much as it might sound like that and it's not always the case. However the advise is about changing behaviors so that the bully is not having his needs met buy bullying you...he will probably find another victim but it won't be you.
     
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  12. Steve

    Steve Mostly Harmless

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    Cam you decribe what you mean? I agree in spirit but I see conflict management as being part of a larger skill set.
     
  13. Steve

    Steve Mostly Harmless

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    How do bully victims (I.e., bullies who are also victims of bullies) fit into this? This is very common.
     
  14. mrt2

    mrt2 Purple Belt

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    It is a tough question and I suspect, nobody really knows. It rarely happens the way they show on TV and the movies where you stand up for yourself and earn the bully's respect, (like the end of the original Karate Kid, for example)

    First of all, if you fight a bully, you are playing his game, because bullies generally size up their victims pretty accurately. That said, sometimes you have to fight a bully, if only to deter others, and maybe the bully will lose interest on focus his attention on someone else.

    I dealt with bullies a bit in grade school and middle school, then we moved and I was in a different school district for high school. I had hoped maybe I could get off to a fresh start in high school, but it was starting to happen again, just not as bad as in middle school. So I signed up for Tang Soo Do, imagining myself going all Chuck Norris on the first guy to try to f-ck with me. Well, after about 4 or 5 months of training, I got my chance, and I got a bloody nose, and most of the fight was me wrestling around on the ground with this kid. Not the spinning back fists, and jump roundhouse kicks of my Chuck Norris *** kicking fantasy.
     
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  15. Bill Mattocks

    Bill Mattocks Sr. Grandmaster

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    I have read a lot of good suggestions and information in this thread, very impressive. I have to agree with those who say 'it depends' and 'there is no one-size-fits-all' response.

    A lot depends on the dynamics of the situation and both the bully and the victim, not to mention the circumstances.

    Here are a couple examples I can relate to. In a new social setting, like a kid moving to a new town and school, you will be bullied until you fight. It's as simple as that. You're going to be attacked. You will fight back - at some point. And then the pecking order is established. The others know where you fit into that. You can be anywhere in it, from the top to the bottom, and it doesn't matter at all; once you are a known quantity.

    You can get bullied, fight back, and get the stuffing beat out of you. But typically the bullying stops when you have demonstrated at what point you will fight back, and where you fit into the pecking order.

    I was attacked for no apparent reason by a high school kid when I was still in junior high, much younger and smaller. I had to jump in the air to punch him in the face, and yeah, he beat me black and blue for it. He also didn't bully me again. I guess being willing to fight back was all he needed to decide to move on to other victims. I took the one 'saving face in front of his friends' beating and that was it.

    But there are also examples of bullies who have a particular problem with someone, and fighting back won't fix it. The bully may have mental issues that just can't be resolved by fighting back. I've certainly seen it. Dealing with such issues can be very difficult, and solutions may work for one person and not another.

    I think learning de-escalation techniques and passive resistance and all that stuff is also good. As is learning martial arts at an early age. One does what one can.

    I was raised in an earlier age, and things were less well understood I think. My solution with a persistent bully was to pick up a brick and beat him in the head until I was pulled off of him. I had to do it twice. The third time he bullied me, I told him that even though he could beat me up, I would never stop beating his head in with a brick or a stick or a rock, I'd do it every time I saw his back to me for the rest of his life. He decided I was too crazy to deal with. Not saying that was the best possible solution, but I was tired of taking beatings.
     
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  16. Orion Nebula

    Orion Nebula Orange Belt

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    I don't know the answer to this, but I think it depends on the situation, and that's what I observed from my own personal experiences. I was frequently bullied as tween, although most of it was verbal or stupid stuff like trying to stick "kick me" signs on my back. However, there were a few instances of more serious bullying.

    One set of guys a few years older than me used to walk the same route home as I did from the bus stop and the stuff they would say to me is not appropriate for a public forum. It involved threats of sexual assault among other things. One time one of them got up in my face and I shoved him over. It wasn't even that hard of a push, I just caught him off balance, but that one act of resistance stopped them from ever bothering me again.

    In contrast, a year or two later, a few kids would try taking my flute off me when I was waiting for the bus or while I was walking home. Eventually I got tired of it, and one afternoon I just started beating them with the case. They never came near me again. Instead they threw rocks from a distance, which honestly was worse. Although eventually they got tired of it and left me alone, which they likely would have done anyway.
     
  17. CB Jones

    CB Jones Senior Master

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    I mean that its important to let kids figure it out for themselves most time instead of adults being quick to jump in and resolve it.

    Kids should be learning conflict resolution by trial and error.
     
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  18. Steve

    Steve Mostly Harmless

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    Okay. Yes. I agree mostly. Bullying is a by product of kids who lack the skills to learn only by trial and error.
     
  19. mrt2

    mrt2 Purple Belt

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  20. mrt2

    mrt2 Purple Belt

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    That is an interesting point. Come to think of it, after that one fight, which wasn't the *** kicking I thought it would be, I took a little bit of crap for getting my nose bloodied but never got challenged to a fight again.

    I did also work to transform my body over the summer after that fight and came back to school 35 lbs lighter and hence, maybe less of a target, since I wasn't the fat kid any more. I also changed my attitude a bit. Instead of trying to fit in, I hung out with my friends, and when I wasn't among friends, I kept to myself.
     
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