Aiki Jiu Jitsu

Discussion in 'Japanese Martial Arts - General' started by vince1, Sep 13, 2017.

  1. the8th_light

    the8th_light White Belt

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    Hi Gerry,

    Having spent a few years investigating and studying two different branches of Daito-ryu, my short answer is "it doesn't differ much". We've tried to put a decent public overview of Hakkoryu on www.hakkoryu.com. Hakkoryu's wikipedia article isn't bad, either.

    In regards to the original topic, I feel it's actually pretty important to dive deeper into any school or person using the words "aiki" and "jutsu" (or "jitsu") or even "aikibudo" to describe what they're teaching. There's already been about thirty or forty years of these terms being muddied by improper use in the west.

    What it really comes down to is one of two possibilities (though there are a couple of well-known exceptions). One, the person has some background in Daito-ryu. Two, the person does not, but is using the term(s) in an attempt to make a distinction between what they teach and modern Aikido. The latter is what's been clouding the pond in the last few decades.

    Devon
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2017
    • Like Like x 2
  2. Encho

    Encho Green Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2017
    Messages:
    163
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Hi 8th light, I saw the name and thought I wonder if they are a Hakko ryu person lol. I do like Hakko ryu stuffs, We had a Hakko ryu guy who use to come to sword practice and said our Daito ryu is to soft haha!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. FighterTwister

    FighterTwister Blue Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2017
    Messages:
    240
    Likes Received:
    30
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Hello Encho,

    The style that you do is it like this....................




    Just out of interest thats what I use to do as Aiki Jiu Jitsu i did enjoy it for about 4 years learning all I could but I wanted something different more like Wing Chun and moved across to Jeet Kune Do which I really love and have taken those skills from Aiki Jiu Jitsu over.

    I was doing Wing Chun and was getting bored and after 5 years of doing it and a guy I met at uni invited me to visit and tried it and liked it from the start all the throws and knife defense and joint locks etc were great to learn.

    I still have some study material put away covering certain training we did. So I did learn allot and did commit 3 times a wek training and after hours with the guy I met especially from the point of view defending from a base ball bat attack, that we used regularly as given scenarios or other wooden training weapons

    What I'm looking for is a wall chart of all the throws and moves with the given names or at least a a PDF File can you help with that at all.

    Something like this but more detailed I would love to put on a wall...........

    [​IMG]



    [​IMG]



    I'm forgetting a few of the names and types of throws its been 20 years now that I did it, and one of throws that i enjoyed doing is the one where someone runs up to you with a sword you grap the wrist in a flow motion as you step in then turn using the energy of the forward attack in the opposite direction and throw them over.

    Kind of like this.............

    [​IMG]

    I really need some good charts to refresh my memory.

    I was going to buy some but they are not cheap all I need is something like the above pics but searching through Google has proven to be difficult can anybody help.

    Thanks in advance
     
  4. Encho

    Encho Green Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2017
    Messages:
    163
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Dear fighter twister,
    I do not practice yoshinkai.
    The video has more of a similar approach to daito ryu but to me seems added things to it. I think the sword part is a good example of the differences. In Daito ryu at least in some cases, we would not wait until the sword has already come down one simple reason it's easy to just turn the sword and cut to the side the other is once the sword is already down where is the "aiki" ? I would say the teacher has a good flow with his uke.

    The move you are describing sounds like shiho nage.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. Yamabushii

    Yamabushii Yellow Belt

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2017
    Messages:
    21
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Washington, D.C.
    Which jujutsu ryu-ha would you say is superior to Daito Ryu? I don't mean to say Daito Ryu is superior to jujutsu as a whole, but as far as ryu-ha go, I don't see any standing above it. Personally, I feel it is the most intricate and effective (once mastered) form of jujutsu.
     
  6. Encho

    Encho Green Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2017
    Messages:
    163
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Hi Yamabushii,
    I do not really think Daito ryu is superior or inferior to any other ryuha. I will say it appears to be more sophisticated, complex, and refined compared to most ryuha. It really depends on what other jujutsu school we are talking about. The other thing is effective at what exactly.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. the8th_light

    the8th_light White Belt

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    I think this answer is a good one, I feel the same. One finds many differences among Daito-ryu schools in fact. Takumakai, Kodokai and others all enjoy much similarity, but differences, too. And there are reasons for it easily explained.

    Even in Hakkoryu, which is a smaller school, all the teachers have some new or different input they share, be they in Japan or abroad. It's evident since we try to get everyone together often, and have done a good job over the years of getting together. Hakkoryu still runs much like koryu though, we share the same patterns of practice, in which the principles live.

    Devon
     
  8. FighterTwister

    FighterTwister Blue Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2017
    Messages:
    240
    Likes Received:
    30
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Can anyone help with Aiki Jiu-Jitsu Charts mentioned in post #43 Please Please Please

    Thanks in advance
     
  9. the8th_light

    the8th_light White Belt

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Michigan, USA

    Sorry, no such thing exists.

    Devon
     
  10. FighterTwister

    FighterTwister Blue Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2017
    Messages:
    240
    Likes Received:
    30
    Trophy Points:
    28
    LoL they do exist its just sourcing them all I want is even a pdf file or poster or even an image like in post #43
     
  11. the8th_light

    the8th_light White Belt

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    There aren't any, because we don't make them, and if we did, they'd not be available to the public.

    Maybe I can help further. Are you interested in studying? Let me know where you're located, maybe I could suggest a school or private teacher near you for Daitoryu or Hakkoryu.

    Devon
     
  12. FighterTwister

    FighterTwister Blue Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2017
    Messages:
    240
    Likes Received:
    30
    Trophy Points:
    28
    LoL

    An example if I may ..................... https://www.amazon.com/Ace-Martial-...rd_wg=S3Tdz&psc=1&refRID=ZAFWJPHGFNR30M1QGZAV


    or

    https://www.amazon.com/Poster-KARAT...rd_wg=S3Tdz&psc=1&refRID=ZAFWJPHGFNR30M1QGZAV


    Is that any clearer LoL
     
  13. Encho

    Encho Green Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2017
    Messages:
    163
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Hi Fighter Twister there really is no Aikijujutsu poster a PDF book maybe on some questionable website, Stanley Pranin(R.I.P.) has/had a Daito ryu learners package that has some great videos of different teachers, a PDF book from the mainline showing the technique and another PDF book on interview and history. I highly recommend it especially the interview book.
    Koryu are for the most part private as in for students only learning. What is shown to the public is not main thing kinda of like showing KFC chicken to the public but not the herbs and spices.
    If you are interested in learning finding a teacher would be your best bet. I have a teacher and books, videos and notes are references. An example was when performing a set I forgot a part and had to look at a book then recall the lesson with my teacher to perform it.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. FighterTwister

    FighterTwister Blue Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2017
    Messages:
    240
    Likes Received:
    30
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Never mind I found one I had to pay for it

    Thanks anyways
     
  15. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

    Joined:
    May 16, 2014
    Messages:
    2,836
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    Trophy Points:
    253
    as a side note , my aikido teacher Fumio Toyota told about how in the 1960's he would see many schools here in the US using the aikido name. he would personally go to each of these schools and ask for their credentials from hombu dojo that allows them to use the name and brand Aikido, if they did not have any he would send them a legal cease and desist letter. he noticed that many of those schools would simply change the name to aikijujutsu.
     
  16. the8th_light

    the8th_light White Belt

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    An excellent metaphor. :)

    Devon
     
  17. Encho

    Encho Green Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2017
    Messages:
    163
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Would be curious to see exactly what it is.
     
  18. Encho

    Encho Green Belt

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2017
    Messages:
    163
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    28
    I did not know the word "Aikido" is copyrighted.
     
  19. Tony Dismukes

    Tony Dismukes MT Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2005
    Messages:
    5,574
    Likes Received:
    4,062
    Trophy Points:
    448
    Location:
    Lexington, KY
    It isn't. The relevant legalities here would involve trademark, but I don't believe "Aikido" is trademarked in the U.S.. Perhaps Mr. Toyota was able to intimidate dojo owners who weren't familiar with trademark law.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    Messages:
    23,827
    Likes Received:
    7,018
    Trophy Points:
    448
    Location:
    Hendersonville, NC
    I hadn't heard of that. As a side note, he apparently was aware of the larger use of "Aikido" as a group of arts (per the DNBK), as he took a high-ranking NGA instructor to Japan with him on a visit to some of the dojos there. We are not descended from Ueshiba's art, and he would surely be aware of that. So his objection would have been to those using "Aikido" to establish a false link to Ueshiba, or by those without enough experience to actually teach that art.123
     

Share This Page