Wing Chun Be Soft

Yoshiyahu

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We have all heard that Wing Chun utilizes both Soft and Hard Techniques. In Wing Chun we are taught not to use brute force and deflect rather than to meet force with force!

Well I would like to start a discussion with how do you advoid using force?

How do you train to redirect the force of guy that is bigger and stronger than you so you can be in advantageous posistion to strike and he can not.

Lets discuss how to use softness and how to develop the skill in using softness.

I look forward to your comments
 

mook jong man

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We have all heard that Wing Chun utilizes both Soft and Hard Techniques. In Wing Chun we are taught not to use brute force and deflect rather than to meet force with force!

Well I would like to start a discussion with how do you advoid using force?

How do you train to redirect the force of guy that is bigger and stronger than you so you can be in advantageous posistion to strike and he can not.

Lets discuss how to use softness and how to develop the skill in using softness.

I look forward to your comments

You mainly learn to redirect greater force by a combination of forms practice , Chi Sau drills , pivoting drills and having the mental discipline to not use your muscular strength but rely on your skill and structure .

This became self evident to me many times in Chi Sau sparring with a senior instructor . Many times during the sparring you would get locked up in a weird position , your first reaction is to try and muscle your way out of it .

This is wrong , a waste of time and only wears you out . You have to have the mental discipline to not struggle trying to use your physical strength , but use your brain and have faith that there is a way out of the predicament using a proper technique that requires very little effort , you just may not know the technique yet .
 
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Yoshiyahu

Yoshiyahu

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Please share some examples of Chi Sau drills other than (Dan Chi Sau:Fok-jum-punch and tan-palm-bong). Also share some pivoting drills you guys do.


You mainly learn to redirect greater force by a combination of forms practice , Chi Sau drills , pivoting drills and having the mental discipline to not use your muscular strength but rely on your skill and structure .

This became self evident to me many times in Chi Sau sparring with a senior instructor . Many times during the sparring you would get locked up in a weird position , your first reaction is to try and muscle your way out of it .

This is wrong , a waste of time and only wears you out . You have to have the mental discipline to not struggle trying to use your physical strength , but use your brain and have faith that there is a way out of the predicament using a proper technique that requires very little effort , you just may not know the technique yet .
 

mook jong man

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Please share some examples of Chi Sau drills other than (Dan Chi Sau:Fok-jum-punch and tan-palm-bong). Also share some pivoting drills you guys do.

Okay , in double sticking hands if somebody is aggressively pushing forwards you can pull them out of their stance and throw them off to either side .

If you want to throw them off to the left , you drop your Fook Sau down and do a sharp pivot to the left at the same time redirecting them down and off to the side with your Bong Sau .

If you want to make them go off to the right , drop your Fook Sau , sharp pivot to the right , at the same time changing your Bong Sau to a Reverse Tan Sau ( Tan Sau with elbow out , palm up like you are looking at a book) .

As he starts to fall to the right , you can change your Reverse Tan Sau into a palm strike and pivot back into him and hit him .

It is important no matter what side you take him to that you keep your Fook Sau low otherwise you might wear an elbow in the head .

The next one is more of a sensitivity / pivoting exercise in isolation it involves having your arms in the Lan Sau position (arms horizontal , one on top of the other ) .

The partner puts his forearms on your arms and leans on you , when your stance can no longer take the pressure you pivot him off to either side of your choosing .

When you can do that fairly well , close your eyes and your partner will make the exercise more tricky by applying his force in a certain direction . It is up to you to judge which side his force is going to and pivot him to the appropriate side .

Force coming to centre , you can pivot either side , force coming to the left , pivot to the left and force coming to the right , pivot to the right .

For an extra challenge open your eyes and get him to charge at you from a couple of metres away with his forearms up , time your pivot as he makes contact with your arms .

The combat applications for this are obvious , as he charges in you can pivot him off to the side and pull him into a side slash to throat followed by an elbow strike or even a double elbow strike .
 
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Yoshiyahu

Yoshiyahu

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Excellent post...I love your drills. Reminds me of similiar drills we do...


Okay , in double sticking hands if somebody is aggressively pushing forwards you can pull them out of their stance and throw them off to either side .

If you want to throw them off to the left , you drop your Fook Sau down and do a sharp pivot to the left at the same time redirecting them down and off to the side with your Bong Sau .

If you want to make them go off to the right , drop your Fook Sau , sharp pivot to the right , at the same time changing your Bong Sau to a Reverse Tan Sau ( Tan Sau with elbow out , palm up like you are looking at a book) .

As he starts to fall to the right , you can change your Reverse Tan Sau into a palm strike and pivot back into him and hit him .

It is important no matter what side you take him to that you keep your Fook Sau low otherwise you might wear an elbow in the head .

The next one is more of a sensitivity / pivoting exercise in isolation it involves having your arms in the Lan Sau position (arms horizontal , one on top of the other ) .

The partner puts his forearms on your arms and leans on you , when your stance can no longer take the pressure you pivot him off to either side of your choosing .

When you can do that fairly well , close your eyes and your partner will make the exercise more tricky by applying his force in a certain direction . It is up to you to judge which side his force is going to and pivot him to the appropriate side .

Force coming to centre , you can pivot either side , force coming to the left , pivot to the left and force coming to the right , pivot to the right .

For an extra challenge open your eyes and get him to charge at you from a couple of metres away with his forearms up , time your pivot as he makes contact with your arms .

The combat applications for this are obvious , as he charges in you can pivot him off to the side and pull him into a side slash to throat followed by an elbow strike or even a double elbow strike .
 

JadecloudAlchemist

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From the Lao Tzu number 36:

"Reduce someone's influence,first expand it

to reduce someone's force,increase it

To over throw someone,first exhalt him

To take from someone first give to him

This is the subtlety by which the weak overcome the strong:

Fish should not leave their depths

and swords should not leave their scabbards"

Apply this to know how soft overcomes hard.
 

seasoned

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We have all heard that Wing Chun utilizes both Soft and Hard Techniques. In Wing Chun we are taught not to use brute force and deflect rather than to meet force with force!

Well I would like to start a discussion with how do you advoid using force?

How do you train to redirect the force of guy that is bigger and stronger than you so you can be in advantageous posistion to strike and he can not.

Lets discuss how to use softness and how to develop the skill in using softness.

I look forward to your comments

This my friend, is why it takes a very long time to master an art, perhaps a life time. It is not a matter of learning to be soft, by nature, as babys and adolescents we have that safety mechanism built into all of us. Kids can jump, roll, fall, and for the most part not get hurt. As adults, at the first sign of danger our first reaction is to tense up. This is also a protective response, physical and mentally. When we start MA, unless we have an instructor that is old enough and experience, we will only add to this bad habit, and not even realize it. The difference between a master and a student is not in the techniques, but in how we utilize them. This softening of the mind, will reflect back into the body, if we let it. As we begin to relearn this, we discover that we can use this, and should, in all aspects of life. :asian:
 

Eru Il繙vatar

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That was a great post! Very true!

This softening of the mind, will reflect back into the body, if we let it. As we begin to relearn this, we discover that we can use this, and should, in all aspects of life. :asian:

This is something my WC instructor said to and all I can do is agree.
 

geezer

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Eru Il繳vatar;1101730 said:
That was a great post! Very true!
This is something my WC instructor said to and all I can do is agree.

Along the same lines, in our old Wing Tsun circle, we began to use the term Wing Tsun or Wing Chun to describe any event in which we could use a strategy of flexibility and yielding to "borrow the opponent's strength" and turn the situation to our advantage. So, any time you used flexibility to come out on top in any kind of conflict, be it a business deal, a tough situation at school, at work, or in personal relationship, we would say that you "wing chunned" it!

In this expanded sense, "wing chun" becomes a better way to relate to people and live your life. It sure beats trying to bully your way through adversity with brute force.
 
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Yoshiyahu

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Well give some examples in sparring or fighting where you use Softness to over a stronger opponent?


Along the same lines, in our old Wing Tsun circle, we began to use the term Wing Tsun or Wing Chun to describe any event in which we could use a strategy of flexibility and yielding to "borrow the opponent's strength" and turn the situation to our advantage. So, any time you used flexibility to come out on top in any kind of conflict, be it a business deal, a tough situation at school, at work, or in personal relationship, we would say that you "wing chunned" it!

In this expanded sense, "wing chun" becomes a better way to relate to people and live your life. It sure beats trying to bully your way through adversity with brute force.
 

Eru Il繙vatar

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Along the same lines, in our old Wing Tsun circle, we began to use the term Wing Tsun or Wing Chun to describe any event in which we could use a strategy of flexibility and yielding to "borrow the opponent's strength" and turn the situation to our advantage. So, any time you used flexibility to come out on top in any kind of conflict, be it a business deal, a tough situation at school, at work, or in personal relationship, we would say that you "wing chunned" it!

In this expanded sense, "wing chun" becomes a better way to relate to people and live your life. It sure beats trying to bully your way through adversity with brute force.

Ha! Looks like we look at things similarly. My definition of WC is nothing but using the tools you got in the most efficient way to overcome the problem your facing. Now just insert the problem and the tools, look at the principals and your doing it. If you start thinking like this you'd be surprised how many things one does without any real meaning to it(or even actions that hurt yourself)!

Acctualy a few politics arround the world should use WC when facing recession this days! I bet I'd help a lot :D
 
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Yoshiyahu

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How do you use Softness in application of an actual fight scenario?

Lets say your a woman fighting a stronger opponent. How do you use softness to subdue his strength.
 

JadecloudAlchemist

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How do you use Softness in application of an actual fight scenario?

Lets say your a woman fighting a stronger opponent. How do you use softness to subdue his strength.

Redirecting,Borrowing,Sticking,following,Listening.
 

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