why do they do it?

Tez3

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I'm too pretty to fight. :)

You can do amateur, no head shots lol! Alex Reid used to say the same thing and ended up with Jordan, dear me!

Anyway I think the thread can go back on subject now?

I've graded a couple of times with a TKD club, got belts but never a certificate. I've graded a lot of times with a karate club got the belts and certificates. Graded TSD got my black belt, a cert, a lot of responsibilities and students.
 

Daniel Sullivan

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Why do kkw masters pass someone to black belt/poom and not order the certs? Today a man came to my class for the first time. He said he was from a school nearby and had been a first Dan for over one year. I asked him for a copy of his cert and his reply was "that is why I am here, sir". After class he sat down and told me that his former sa bum nim, whom I know is a kkw 6th dan, has not ordered any of his students their certs from korea. He charged$800 us for the test and said that the certs would take 6mo to get. One year later, no cert. I looked him up in the kkw database and he, along with his son and 2 nephews are not registered. Why? It is not expensive. I get the 6mo wait time because it forces them to continue classes but to not give a coustomer what they paid for is unethical and criminal.Anyone else had a similar situation?
Many schools' budgets are designed around income that is a combination of tuition, testing fees, and profits from the pro-shop if they have one. If income in one of these three areas is down, then it must be replaced by income from one of the other two. If income in two or in all of these areas are down, then it cannot realistically be replaced.

Since colored belt tests require a minimum of expenditure for the school (less than ten dollars in materials), they are unaffected. But a black belt test generally requires that money and paperwork be submitted to some other body. Waiting periods are exaggerated or fabricated in order to allow the school full access to the funds from often very expensive BB test fees. Bills are paid and expenses are met, while the wait time allows the school a change to pull the money together later, perhaps by ordering certificates in dribs and drabs.

However, if income remains down or goes down further and if the school owner is barely meeting his personal expenses, then there isn't any money to pull together later. If the owner either cannot or will not take the needed funds from his salary, then the school loses the ability to deliver the promised goods.

Then you have owners with weird ideas about withholding certificates for indefinite periods of time and with no written policy to explain why. They may even have the certificates in hand, but withhold them for some unexplainable reason.

Then there are some who purposefully take the money and have no intention of ever delivering on a certificate.

I would like to believe that the first scenario is by far the most common, though the end result is the same: no certificate is delivered.

This is one of the pitfalls of charging a fee for testing: you've taken the money and now, you need to deliver within a reasonable period of time (less than six months, barring any previously agreed upon waiting period).
 

Archtkd

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Why do kkw masters pass someone to black belt/poom and not order the certs? Today a man came to my class for the first time. He said he was from a school nearby and had been a first Dan for over one year. I asked him for a copy of his cert and his reply was "that is why I am here, sir". After class he sat down and told me that his former sa bum nim, whom I know is a kkw 6th dan, has not ordered any of his students their certs from korea. He charged$800 us for the test and said that the certs would take 6mo to get. One year later, no cert. I looked him up in the kkw database and he, along with his son and 2 nephews are not registered. Why? It is not expensive. I get the 6mo wait time because it forces them to continue classes but to not give a coustomer what they paid for is unethical and criminal.Anyone else had a similar situation?

I have been pondering this for while, because I've seen it done by masters I thought I knew well and have come to some thinking: Could it be, a number of masters who do this do not have the right papers to be in the U.S legally and therefore cannot obtain Kukkiwon certificates for American citizens or legal residents? Just a thought. Whatever the reason I think it's theft to get paid with a promise to deliver something and then not do it.
 
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msmitht

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It is my belief that they are just keeping the money and being cheap.
 
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