Why Budo Taijutsu.

[Hudson69]

I was skulking around youtube and came across a Stephen Hayes clip (

). But in it he basically says that the reason for the change from ninjutsu to budo taijutsu by Soke to focus students (at least new ones) on the hand to hand combat skills of the various schools.

He also states that to train someone now in all the skills of the ninja of old is not only impractical but could be considered "militia" training and taken the wrong way by todays standards.

Are there any disagreements to this and are there schools that teach "old school" ninjutsu out there or possibly both versions? And how has the Budo Taijutsu, for you, been updated to better help one survive the street of the modern world?

 

[Bruno@MT]

Afaik, there are no known (and known legit) schools teaching 'old-school' ninjutsu. The unarmed fihting techniques are still taught as part of the Xkans and possibly in Toshindo. In Genbukan it is even possible to get menkyo kaiden in some of the old systems like Togakure ryu, but that is besides the general ninpo curriculum, and only for higher level BBs

That said, the full range of ninjutsu is impractical for several reasons. The art of making poisons, disguising yourself as a traveling monk, etc. They are only useful in their original context. I know Tanemura sensei wants to preserve the art, so perhaps the high level shihan receive this training as well. In order to receive Menkyo Kaiden in Togakure ryu, I think it will be part of the transmission (pure speculation on my part)

There are various offshoots who have modernized the curriculum, like the organization where Chris Parker teachers, and of course Steven Hayes's Toshindo, but I don't know if they include those parts of the curriculum in an updated version.

 

[alacran]

Regardless of changing a martial arts system name for any kind of reason, it's important to stand out such an art like Ninjutsu always evolves and adapts to the modern days; this means to toss the non-useful techniques or concepts away and develop those that actually will work on a life-threatening situation. Since Ninjutsu originated more than 2000 years ago, it's obvious that was used first for military purposes and has been adapted in a way that it can be practiced in a dojo. However, if you want to focus on the essence on what Ninjutsu claims to be, then you must train a system which helps on developing skills around your own strengths and weaknesses. A modern system which I practice til these days is called Martial Science( modern Ninjutsu ) encompassing trainin areas such as: body movement, striking, kicking, weapons, realisic self-defense, combat tactics, etc. and all these mostly practiced in the great outdoors to give you an idea that you also have to be aware on your surroundings because those can either help or be an issue when you have to deal with a real situation to protect yourself.

 

[kaizasosei]

I believe that Soke is spot on and not just giving people what they want, but making sure they don't stray from the truth and sink into a swamp of confusion and malice. Plus, such people that overdo the ninja thing in their lives are a bit of an embarassment for the whole organization.

Now believe you me that i know that when one loves something or someone, one tends to want to shout it out from the rooftops, but that is not always such a good thing.




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[Obi Wan Shinobi]

Well there are a few and I do mean few, instructors out there that have learned "some" of the actual ninjutsu aspect that you are referring to. Those instructors were training from the early 80s when they did teach some of that stuff. Nowadays even they won't teach that stuff to just anyone, if they are willing to teach it. My suggestion is to join the military in a MOS that would teach similar skills (sniper, special forces, Force Recon etc.). But my question is though...why would you want to learn such skills and what would you do with such skills if you were to find someone to teach you?

 

[Hudson69]

Well there are a few and I do mean few, instructors out there that have learned "some" of the actual ninjutsu aspect that you are referring to. Those instructors were training from the early 80s when they did teach some of that stuff. Nowadays even they won't teach that stuff to just anyone, if they are willing to teach it. My suggestion is to join the military in a MOS that would teach similar skills (sniper, special forces, Force Recon etc.). But my question is though...why would you want to learn such skills and what would you do with such skills if you were to find someone to teach you?

I guess it was just that after seeing the video segment that I was remeniscient of when I first trained in (then) Ninjutsu and had a full range of field training. It was after trying it again after so many years, with the name change and all that I thought I would just ask the question. Nothing else really.

As far as learning those skills by way of the military I have been luck enough to have done so. I currently have almost 16 years in with most of those being in special operation. They include trips to the sandbox, Snier & Air Assault School as well as some joint training exercises.

Not trying to fire anybody up, just asking.....

 

[bwindussa]

I remember that training too. I started training Togakure in the mid 80's and there seemed to be a bit different style of training. The things mentioned like learning to make gunpowder, etc... were actually taught to upper rank students. And at least 1 or 2 classes each month were outdoor and in different landscape to help us learn adaptability (and I'm sure a lot of other things).

It was so much fun! I never learned so much.

 

[ElfTengu]

Personally I believe that Budo Taijutsu is a term that makes most of us less laughable than if we called ourselves 'ninja', which is pretty much the only term for someone who practices 'ninjutsu'.

I can be (and am) overweight, inflexible, and not terribly good at what we do, and happily call myself a practitioner of Budo Taijutsu, especially as it doesn't have a generally accepted label for the individual, which means people can only say what I 'do', rather than what I 'am', whereas people will quite understandably, logically, reasonably and properly label a practitioner of ninjutsu as a 'ninja' in the absence of a legitimate obvious alternative, and living up to all that the word 'ninja' suggests, even at a basic level of martial artistry, athletic and gymnastic capability, is quite some feat, even without pandering to popular misconception, misrepresentation and artistic licence!

I can be a practitioner of Budo Taijutsu whatever my shape or with pretty much any level of ability, but call me a practioner of ninjutsu which automatically makes me a ninja, or ninja-in-training at least, and I aint gonna make the grade!