What's the difference?
- Thread starter SFC JeffJ
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Brad Dunne
Brown Belt
Differences?..........IMO, none!........................................................
Wow!, listen to all that grinding of teeth and fist banging by the Hapkido folks.......:xtrmshock
Who is this mad man that says there's no differences?.......He must be out of his mind - surely he's not a Hapkidoin........I mean he couldn't be....
OK, there are differences, but only from the teaching aspect. Aren't there differences between Hapkido styles? Sure there are and it's been stated in other threads. Hapkido came from Aiki-jujitsu and then went it's own way in a double fashion. Folks like to feel that their particular style or discipline is pure, but we all know that there is nothing pure in the arts. They all took their beginnings from something before them. The end result of a technique from any of these disciplines is to render an attacker useless. If that means breaking a wrist, elbow, shoulder or just plain letting his face meet the pavement, then they will have succeded in their mission and the technique(s) used will probably be found in any style looked at. So differences........Not at the bottom line IMO. :wink2:
Wow!, listen to all that grinding of teeth and fist banging by the Hapkido folks.......:xtrmshock
Who is this mad man that says there's no differences?.......He must be out of his mind - surely he's not a Hapkidoin........I mean he couldn't be....
OK, there are differences, but only from the teaching aspect. Aren't there differences between Hapkido styles? Sure there are and it's been stated in other threads. Hapkido came from Aiki-jujitsu and then went it's own way in a double fashion. Folks like to feel that their particular style or discipline is pure, but we all know that there is nothing pure in the arts. They all took their beginnings from something before them. The end result of a technique from any of these disciplines is to render an attacker useless. If that means breaking a wrist, elbow, shoulder or just plain letting his face meet the pavement, then they will have succeded in their mission and the technique(s) used will probably be found in any style looked at. So differences........Not at the bottom line IMO. :wink2:
matt.m
Senior Master
Here is my take. From my experience I have found hapkido to be much more brutal in application than aikido. However, I have seen people call jiujitsu, jiujitsu and hapkido, hapkido. The fact that neither were true.
It is hard to explain, you have to see and experience the difference to understand the difference.
It is hard to explain, you have to see and experience the difference to understand the difference.
OP
OP
I think you might have misunderstood what I was asking. Quite possibly 'cause I wasn't clear enough about it. The organization I'm loosely tied too does both a style of jujitsu that has it's roots in Aiki-jujitsu by way of Hakko Ryu, and Chung do Kwan TKD. What I'm asking is what is the difference between combing those two arts and Hapkido.
And to be very clear, I'm not trying to put down Hapkido, just curious.
Jeff
zDom
Senior Master
Well, you could quite possibly end up with something very hapkido-ish indeed 
I would say the difference might be like, hmmm, potatoes au gratin and a sliced up baked potato with cheese...
(wracked my brain trying to come up with a good food analogy, but that was the best I could come up with
)
I guess what I'm saying is, you seem to have very similar ingredients, and are likely to come out with a very similar dish.
But it isn't the exact same recipe or ingredients, so it won't BE "hapkido." Just something very much like hapkido.
I say, run with it! Sounds like a great combination to me.
I would say the difference might be like, hmmm, potatoes au gratin and a sliced up baked potato with cheese...
(wracked my brain trying to come up with a good food analogy, but that was the best I could come up with
)I guess what I'm saying is, you seem to have very similar ingredients, and are likely to come out with a very similar dish.
But it isn't the exact same recipe or ingredients, so it won't BE "hapkido." Just something very much like hapkido.
I say, run with it! Sounds like a great combination to me.
OP
OP
Personally, I don't do TKD, though I do know the forms up to Hwrawng (sp?). I concentrate on the jujitsu part of it, so what I do looks very little like Hapkido!Well, you could quite possibly end up with something very hapkido-ish indeed
I would say the difference might be like, hmmm, potatoes au gratin and a sliced up baked potato with cheese...
(wracked my brain trying to come up with a good food analogy, but that was the best I could come up with
I guess what I'm saying is, you seem to have very similar ingredients, and are likely to come out with a very similar dish.
But it isn't the exact same recipe or ingredients, so it won't BE "hapkido." Just something very much like hapkido.
I say, run with it! Sounds like a great combination to me.
Jeff
matt.m
Senior Master
Oh, no prob. Not trying to start a fight. In essence the only comparison I can even give is from the following. Takkeda taught Choi, founder of hapkido. Takkeda also taught Ueshiba, founder of Aikido. Hapkido and Aikido are similiar in many respects. However, there are different styles of hapkido and aikido as well.
It really it all comes down to the insertion points in how the technique begins and ends. The cirriculums are different, there is a big difference in 3 Rivers Aikido and Mid America Aikido here in St. Louis. There is a big difference in Moo Sul Kwan and Kuk Sool hapkido.
So as you can tell from my writing that you cannot combine two arts and consider them "Like" a whole completely different art.
I do see where you question comes into play, it is a good one. But I see it like saying "I want to learn tang soo do and say shotokan karate, how close to japanese jiujitsu is it?"
All too often hapkido gets compared to "The stuff Seagal does in the movies."
I do say however, that if the technique is effective, it is good. No reason to make a big hoobie de doo over nothing.
I again was not trying to start a disagreement, and did misunderstand what you were trying to say or ask Jeff. I apologize.
Furthermore, I will agree with my senior zDom and say that you can't go wrong if it is effective. Sounds like a bunch of diverse techniques in the goodie bag.
Interesting question.
I doubt that you'd end up with an art that's as integrated as Hapkido by just taking, say, kicking and striking techniques from TKD and locking / throwing techniques from Jujutsu.
Our style of Hapkido does not derive from Ji Han Jae, so we don't have the kicking techniques that he added to what he learned from Choi when he created Sin Moo. So, I can't speak with any authority about how the kicking done in most Hapkido organizations compares with TKD kicking. But, I recall reading a thread on a forum that compared TKD and HKD kicking, and the consensus among the HKD people who know Ji's kicking techniques was that there are fundamental differences in the kicking techniques of the two arts.
Also, I think that TKD (and all other Karate-based arts) use different fundamental principles from Hapkido or Jujutsu. The former tend to use linear techniques that rely on force against incoming force. The latter use techniques that center on taking the attacker's balance by blending with the incoming attack or using timing, strikes, etc. to disrupt his balance. This is especially true of the styles of Hapkido that make prominent use of hapki / aiki.
Anybody who is learning a legitimate form of Aikijujutsu will be learning techniques that are conceptually very similar (or, in some cases, identical) to many of the techniques that Choi taught his closest students.
I doubt that you'd end up with an art that's as integrated as Hapkido by just taking, say, kicking and striking techniques from TKD and locking / throwing techniques from Jujutsu.
Our style of Hapkido does not derive from Ji Han Jae, so we don't have the kicking techniques that he added to what he learned from Choi when he created Sin Moo. So, I can't speak with any authority about how the kicking done in most Hapkido organizations compares with TKD kicking. But, I recall reading a thread on a forum that compared TKD and HKD kicking, and the consensus among the HKD people who know Ji's kicking techniques was that there are fundamental differences in the kicking techniques of the two arts.
Also, I think that TKD (and all other Karate-based arts) use different fundamental principles from Hapkido or Jujutsu. The former tend to use linear techniques that rely on force against incoming force. The latter use techniques that center on taking the attacker's balance by blending with the incoming attack or using timing, strikes, etc. to disrupt his balance. This is especially true of the styles of Hapkido that make prominent use of hapki / aiki.
Anybody who is learning a legitimate form of Aikijujutsu will be learning techniques that are conceptually very similar (or, in some cases, identical) to many of the techniques that Choi taught his closest students.
