Thinking of adding clubs inside my school

[terryl965]

Such things as the Black Belt club and Swat team, split club and some of the other ones. For those of you doing this already does it cheapen the over all views of your club, does it help with retention and is it a positive way for the younger student to strive for?
Thanks
Terry

 

[HKphooey]

SWAT Teams or demo teams are a great way to motivate the younger students. For the upper belts, it gives them something to strive for when their junior black belt has been earned at an early age. It also gives their training the feel of a team sport (like their friends playing baseball, soccer, football, etc.).

 

[AceHBK]

I hate the club idea.
I thing to have a demo team another for all the different clubs. I am not a fan of it and was one reason for my split from my master.

Maybe if someone could really show me some great benefit that arises from it (other than extra money for the school cause they charge more) then I will look at it from another angle. But as of now I dont like them at all.

It ends up getting to the point that if you are not in a club then you do not learn as much as others in those clubs.

In a dojo where everyone should feel equal clubs are a way to start showing seperation amongst students. Kids will naturally want to be in a club b/c of peer pressure. They see other kids in so they want to join. That right there ends up going against the whole thought process of instilling in kids, how to think for themselves. What kid doesnt wanna be in a "club"? They see the cooler looking uniforms and such and "even more in depth training" and feel like they have to be in to fit in. The dojo pushes clubs which makes them more money and in turn has parents shelling out more money.

I see this becoming more and more common though. Before there was just schools and only thing that seperated students were belts and demo/tournament teams. Now it has expanded and I dont like the message it sends.

I am open to someone who can change my view on this though but right now im stuck on it.

 

[terryl965]

I hate the club idea.
I thing to have a demo team another for all the different clubs. I am not a fan of it and was one reason for my split from my master.

Maybe if someone could really show me some great benefit that arises from it (other than extra money for the school cause they charge more) then I will look at it from another angle. But as of now I dont like them at all.

It ends up getting to the point that if you are not in a club then you do not learn as much as others in those clubs.

In a dojo where everyone should feel equal clubs are a way to start showing seperation amongst students. Kids will naturally want to be in a club b/c of peer pressure. They see other kids in so they want to join. That right there ends up going against the whole thought process of instilling in kids, how to think for themselves. What kid doesnt wanna be in a "club"? They see the cooler looking uniforms and such and "even more in depth training" and feel like they have to be in to fit in. The dojo pushes clubs which makes them more money and in turn has parents shelling out more money.

I see this becoming more and more common though. Before there was just schools and only thing that seperated students were belts and demo/tournament teams. Now it has expanded and I dont like the message it sends.

I am open to someone who can change my view on this though but right now im stuck on it.

Ace if I where to start club, I would not charge for them, just some people have said it keeps retention and a couple of student I lost is with a school that has all those clubs and the parents like them.
Terry

 

[AceHBK]

Ace if I where to start club, I would not charge for them, just some people have said it keeps retention and a couple of student I lost is with a school that has all those clubs and the parents like them.
Terry

Then I am all in favor!!
I agree with the retention part b/c then folks will want to stay.

How were the students that left for a school that had a club?

 

[HKphooey]

I hate the club idea.
I thing to have a demo team another for all the different clubs. I am not a fan of it and was one reason for my split from my master.

Maybe if someone could really show me some great benefit that arises from it (other than extra money for the school cause they charge more) then I will look at it from another angle. But as of now I dont like them at all.

It ends up getting to the point that if you are not in a club then you do not learn as much as others in those clubs.

In a dojo where everyone should feel equal clubs are a way to start showing seperation amongst students. Kids will naturally want to be in a club b/c of peer pressure. They see other kids in so they want to join. That right there ends up going against the whole thought process of instilling in kids, how to think for themselves. What kid doesnt wanna be in a "club"? They see the cooler looking uniforms and such and "even more in depth training" and feel like they have to be in to fit in. The dojo pushes clubs which makes them more money and in turn has parents shelling out more money.

I see this becoming more and more common though. Before there was just schools and only thing that seperated students were belts and demo/tournament teams. Now it has expanded and I dont like the message it sends.

I am open to someone who can change my view on this though but right now im stuck on it.

Ace, never thought of it that way. Some good points. I think you cannot charge for the extra programs (maybe just uniforms and patches). The programs are for those students who wish to excel and take their training to another level. Those students deserve the extra attention and the venue to display those skills. I think one needs to be very careful how the programs are run and perceived by others. I have always seen it as a motivational tool, but I now see your point about how it may effect other students.

 

[Martial Tucker]

Ace if I where to start club, I would not charge for them, just some people have said it keeps retention and a couple of student I lost is with a school that has all those clubs and the parents like them.
Terry

Terry, the only negative I can think of is that all the club stuff has negative/McDojang connotations. I know enough about you and your school to know that's not what you are, and the fact that you are not charging shows that you are just looking for creative ways to keep things interesting and retain students. For that I say: great job!

Edit: I don't know if your "clubs" will be voluntary, or by invitation, but if it is by invitation I guess there is a risk that some people who don't get invited may feel as if they are being slighted or not getting as much for their money as those who get invited.
One solution is for the student that didn't get invited to work harder, and this is a potential motivator, but the real risk is the student that is working hard and doing their best, but their natural lack of ability might keep them from qualifying for a desired club. That's the student you have to keep in mind. Good luck

 

[terryl965]

Martial Tucker you have brought up some great points and you are right I do not want McDojo around here.
Thanks for all the toughjt you put into it.
Terry

 

[terryl965]

Then I am all in favor!!
I agree with the retention part b/c then folks will want to stay.

How were the students that left for a school that had a club?

They was below my personal standards but that does not mean in time they could have been, I believe mom and dad was use to the Rec. scenerio and not about hard training.
Terry

 

[AceHBK]

Ahhh ok @ Terry. That may have had more to do with it as well.
If you do the club thing let us know how it goes.

Great advise Martial Tucker!

 

[IcemanSK]

To piggy back on what Martial said, I think its important to watch that the club doesn't turn into a clique. That its open to others. My worst fear would be one kid saying to another, "You might be a green belt too, but you're not on the demo team."....or some such thing.

But knowing you, you've already thought of that &/or had the same concern.