Tactical Flashlight

[Psilent Knight]

For me, a weapon's something I'd use when I think I need it. In that case, I'm already expecting a light beating isn't where this is likely to end, so my weapon isn't likely to change things. And a kubotan (or flashlight serving as one) isn't likely to raise someone's ire nearly as much as a baton, knife, etc. would.

I agree with this.

Given how often people don't notice knives, they may also not notice the kubotan.

THIS! From my perspective the bad guy should only know I brought a kubotan (or yawara or palm stick, etc.) into the altercation when he feels it being used somewhere on his body. It should be felt BEFORE being seen. And once I have introduced the kubotan/yawara into the altercation I feel duty bound to keep attacking and put him down for the count and try to prevent him from recuperating from being hit with the kubotan. I don't believe in simply brandishing a weapon (where the bad guy has an opportunity to ascertain what I have and prepare to deal with it). I believe, instead, in quickly deploying and using a weapon to gain the upper hand and to maintain that upper hand until the threat is no longer a threat.

If that's what I have, I'll use it.

Same here.

Is that why you pack the thing. To use against a knife?

The knife or the kubotan are not what's really dangerous. It's the people wielding them. Just because you have a kubotan and you're defending yourself against a guy with a knife does not automatically mean you are at an automatic disadvantage. If he's not good at using a knife and has no fighting skills but you do have real skills and are very good at using your kubotan or yawara who is really at a disadvantage in that situation? Besides, if I had a choice, I would rather face a knife wielding person with a kubotan than to face him empty handed.

 

[drop bear]

The knife or the kubotan are not what's really dangerous. It's the people wielding them. Just because you have a kubotan and you're defending yourself against a guy with a knife does not automatically mean you are at an automatic disadvantage. If he's not good at using a knife and has no fighting skills but you do have real skills and are very good at using your kubotan or yawara who is really at a disadvantage in that situation? Besides, if I had a choice, I would rather face a knife wielding person with a kubotan than to face him empty handed.

I am going to say if you have a kubotan and he has a knife you really are at an automatic disadvantage. Now you guys are packing this thing to adress some sort of threat. You haven't picked it up as a last ditch resort. You intentionally carry it.

What threat do you actually expect to use it on?

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I am going to say if you have a kubotan and he has a knife you really are at an automatic disadvantage. Now you guys are packing this thing to adress some sort of threat. You haven't picked it up as a last ditch resort. You intentionally carry it.

What threat do you actually expect to use it on?

I already answered that. Any threat where I wish I had a weapon, and no better weapon is handy.

 

[drop bear]

I already answered that. Any threat where I wish I had a weapon, and no better weapon is handy.

Why not have a better weapon handy?

I mean you got up in the morning and chose to carry a weapon. And the weapon you chose was a kubotan.

What exactly did you think you were going to use it on?

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Why not have a better weapon handy?

I mean you got up in the morning and chose to carry a weapon. And the weapon you chose was a kubotan.

What exactly did you think you were going to use it on?

There are a lot of places where a better weapon isn't allowed, other than something like a cane. And the cane is bothersome at times, so I don't take it with me.

You seem, once again, to be trying really hard to find something wrong with my choice. Get your head out of your ***.

 

[Psilent Knight]

I am going to say if you have a kubotan and he has a knife you really are at an automatic disadvantage.

I am going to disagree with this. The person who has a knife but is 5"6, 160 lbs and has no fighting skills (with or without the knife) is at a disadvantage if he's going against a guy who has a Kubotan but is 6"3, 230 lbs and is a Trained Fighter and is good at fighting (with or without the Kubotan).

Now you guys are packing this thing to adress some sort of threat. You haven't picked it up as a last ditch resort. You intentionally carry it.

What threat do you actually expect to use it on?

I expect to use it against whatever threat I may be faced with. I am not necessarily focusing on the type of threat or level of threat (knife, gun, really big guy, multiple opponents, etc). I am looking at the fact that I'm being threatened. And I will use any and every appropriate tool at my disposal to end the threat including a Kubotan if I have one or have access to one.

Why not have a better weapon handy?

I mean you got up in the morning and chose to carry a weapon. And the weapon you chose was a kubotan.

What exactly did you think you were going to use it on?

There are a lot of places where a better weapon isn't allowed, other than something like a cane. And the cane is bothersome at times, so I don't take it with me.

In addition to what gpseymour said I will add that 1) some weapons aren't as convenient to carry on me as a Kubotan, 2) some weapons don't deploy as quickly and easily as a Kubotan, 3) I can innocuously carry the Kubotan in my hand to always have it at the ready, 4) many weapons that may be more effective than a Kubotan are illegal to carry (where I live Kubotan's are legal to carry) and 5) a person may use a gun or knife and regret it later because less lethal force could have sufficiently ended the threat. I feel there are too many people walking around with guns and knives who don't have the proper maturity required for carrying them.

 

[CB Jones]

I am going to disagree with this. The person who has a knife but is 5"6, 160 lbs and has no fighting skills (with or without the knife) is at a disadvantage if he's going against a guy who has a Kubotan but is 6"3, 230 lbs and is a Trained Fighter and is good at fighting (with or without the Kubotan).

Disagree.

That untrained fighter is still probably gonna cut you up and there is always the chance that he gets a lethal stab in there.

 

[Psilent Knight]

That untrained fighter is still probably gonna cut you up and there is always the chance that he gets a lethal stab in there.

I disagree for the same reason I disagree with dropbear and that is you are making an assumption such as your post above. I think you guys are only thinking of a knife and not looking at the entirety of the circumstances (such as the differences in skills, size and physical strength).

According to your logic a little 5th grade kid will succeed in carving you up simply because he has a knife regardless of the fact you're bigger, stronger, faster and way more experienced.

 

[CB Jones]

I disagree for the same reason I disagree with dropbear and that is you are making an assumption such as your post above. I think you guys are only thinking of a knife and not looking at the entirety of the circumstances (such as the differences in skills, size and physical strength).

According to your logic a little 5th grade kid will succeed in carving you up simply because he has a knife regardless of the fact you're bigger, stronger, faster and way more experienced.

No we are saying the knife gives an advantage as it is a more dangerous weapon....but all advantages can be overcome.....but it still gives the the knife wielder an advantage.

If that 5th grader by sheer lucks stabs you in the groin....was he a better fighter or did the weapon just give him an advantage that a lucky stab was able to take you down?

 

[Psilent Knight]

No we are saying the knife gives an advantage as it is a more dangerous weapon

I agree that a knife is a more dangerous weapon than a Kubotan but I don't agree that it always means an automatic advantage. I am still of the view that the physical and mental capabilities of each person play into the situation as well.

....but all advantages can be overcome

EXACTLY! If I've been consistently participating in reality based self defense for the past 10 years, am physically fit and Have real world experience in violence I believe that will help me to overcome the advantage of the out of shape junior high kid who does not train and has never been in a fight before.

There's a popular saying that 2nd amendment supporters repeat which is "Guns don't kill people. People with guns kill people." Any weapon other than a firearm is only as dangerous as the person who possesses it.

If that 5th grader by sheer lucks stabs you in the groin....was he a better fighter or did the weapon just give him an advantage that a lucky stab was able to take you down?

Either he was the more capable combatant and/or It would be due to me not possessing the right physical and mental capabilities to, as you said, overcome the advantage he had with the knife.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I agree that a knife is a more dangerous weapon than a Kubotan but I don't agree that it always means an automatic advantage. I am still of the view that the physical and mental capabilities of each person play into the situation as well.



EXACTLY! If I've been consistently participating in reality based self defense for the past 10 years, am physically fit and Have real world experience in violence I believe that will help me to overcome the advantage of the out of shape junior high kid who does not train and has never been in a fight before.

There's a popular saying that 2nd amendment supporters repeat which is "Guns don't kill people. People with guns kill people." Any weapon other than a firearm is only as dangerous as the person who possesses it.



Neither. It would be due to me not possessing the right physical and mental capabilities to, as you said, overcome the advantage he had with the knife.

Perhaps the difference here is perception of articles? The difference between "an advantage" (which I think we all can agree, the knife does confer) and "the advantage" (which will depend upon more than just that one factor).

 

[Psilent Knight]

Perhaps the difference here is perception of articles? The difference between "an advantage" (which I think we all can agree, the knife does confer) and "the advantage" (which will depend upon more than just that one factor).

Yeah, I think this makes a lot of sense.

 

[drop bear]

There are a lot of places where a better weapon isn't allowed, other than something like a cane. And the cane is bothersome at times, so I don't take it with me.

You seem, once again, to be trying really hard to find something wrong with my choice. Get your head out of your ***.

Because I couldn't just bring a glass drink bottle. Or nail someone with a chair. Especially if they wack me with a kubotan.

You again seem to be trying really hard to defend a stupid position. And are resorting to being upset to defend it.

 

[drop bear]

There are a lot of places where a better weapon isn't allowed, other than something like a cane. And the cane is bothersome at times, so I don't take it with me.

You seem, once again, to be trying really hard to find something wrong with my choice. Get your head out of your ***.

And look back at the thread. You quoted me you banana. That makes you trying very hard to find something wrong with my choice.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Because I couldn't just bring a glass drink bottle. Or nail someone with a chair. Especially if they wack me with a kubotan.

You again seem to be trying really hard to defend a stupid position. And are resorting to being upset to defend it.

What is the "stupid position" you believe I'm holding? I don't think a glass drink bottle is a better weapon than a kubotan. And I can't carry a chair with me.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

And look back at the thread. You quoted me you banana. That makes you trying very hard to find something wrong with my choice.

What choice of yours did I question?

 

[Gerry Seymour]

And look back at the thread. You quoted me you banana. That makes you trying very hard to find something wrong with my choice.

Here's where we started:

DB: "Super uncomfortable with the kubaton. If I am threatened enough to need one I probably need a baseball bat. I don't like to start a weapon fight with about the worlds most ineffective weapon."
GS: "I find it useful, but have stopped carrying mine almost entirely. Too many places I can't carry it. TSA doesn't allow them on planes. Many government buildings that have metal detectors/scanning stations don't allow them. While it's better than bare hands (IMO), it's not enough better to be worth the hassle AND having to wonder if I have it with me this time. I figured carrying inconsistently simply meant I'd never think to get it out, anyway."

So, you should be able to see that I didn't question your choice, at all. I simply gave you my view. From there, you worked really hard to try to show I was making some sort of BS choice.

 

[drop bear]

Here's where we started:

DB: "Super uncomfortable with the kubaton. If I am threatened enough to need one I probably need a baseball bat. I don't like to start a weapon fight with about the worlds most ineffective weapon."
GS: "I find it useful, but have stopped carrying mine almost entirely. Too many places I can't carry it. TSA doesn't allow them on planes. Many government buildings that have metal detectors/scanning stations don't allow them. While it's better than bare hands (IMO), it's not enough better to be worth the hassle AND having to wonder if I have it with me this time. I figured carrying inconsistently simply meant I'd never think to get it out, anyway."

So, you should be able to see that I didn't question your choice, at all. I simply gave you my view. From there, you worked really hard to try to show I was making some sort of BS choice.

You view disagreed with mine which in theory shouldn't be an issue. But for some reason you have an issue.

You get flustered start attacking me while blaming me for not agreeing with you.

You are endorsing this product as a useful tool.

Have you used a kubotan in a fight? How useful was it.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

You view disagreed with mine which in theory shouldn't be an issue. But for some reason you have an issue.

You get flustered start attacking me while blaming me for not agreeing with you.

You are endorsing this product as a useful tool.

Have you used a kubotan in a fight? How useful was it.

My view was different from your. At no point did I object to your view. If you see every differing view as an attack, that's on you. I actually agree with the basic premise you put forth (kubotan isn't a great weapon, and I'd rather have something else). I just see it as a weapon I can sometimes have when others aren't readily available.

I see anything that can add capability as useful. It's a continuum, not a binary option. The kubotan does, in fact, add capability (swiping strikes can do damage, hammerfists can do more damage, can make some locks "sink in" quicker, etc.). Whether a specific individual finds it useful or not probably depends upon their approach and whether the kubotan fits easily into it. It's not intrinsically a highly useful weapon (no additional range, added damage in many cases is moderate at best), so if it doesn't fit with an individual's approach, it's probably not useful to them. I'm not sure I'd go so far as calling that an endorsement, but I don't really object to that term, either.

A kubotan is something I've not had to use in a fight (if I define "fight" as something outside sparring). So are a knife, a handgun, an elbow strike, a single-leg takedown, and a baseball bat. Each of those can be useful in the right circumstances, as well.

 

[Psilent Knight]

@Kong Soo Do I think I may have been wrong about the usefulness of the strobe function in a tactical flashlight. After further research, experimentation and contemplation I think the strobe function can be very useful in a SD situation.

I will elaborate later this evening when I have more time. But in short I think a tactical flashlight has two primary purposes; 1) to Distract and 2) to Blind/Take Away Vision. I am still of the viewpoint that the high output mode would be best used at night and in extremely low lit conditions. In this situation it would be used to temporarily blind and completely take away the bad guy's vision.

After some experimentation outdoors in the daylight and indoors with lighting I am now coming to the conclusion that the strobe function can be used under these conditions not to blind but to distract the aggressor. I believe if done correctly (and with very high lumens output) it can sufficiently distract an enemy by disrupting his OODA LOOP. I will say if this is to be accomplished then the higher the lumens output of the torch the better. And I think your chances of success also increase the closer in proximity you are to the bad guy in order to fully effect his eyesight and brain (his OODA LOOP) with the strobe light.

One immediate downside I can see with this though is that I do not think the strobe function under the conditions I've described will do much, if anything at all, against multiple opponents (but I do like my chances against multiple opponents in very dark conditions using high output mode in one hand and a long range weapon or gun in my other hand).

And of course it will not help at all (imo) if the bad guy has a gun.

And one other thing I must mention is that I do not believe the strobe function will work on a CLEAR and SUNNY day unless you're in an alley or between buildings tall enough to provide the less lit conditions required for what I am talking about.