Pin Sun Wing Chun & Wing Chun Boxing

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I see your point. But he doesn't know what you know about the situation. From his point of view, it's all he-said, he-said. And nobody ever (even if they try to) actually presents their side of the story objectively - our own memories make that impossible. His comments, taken as generic comments, aren't way off base. I disagree with some of his conclusions (on a generic level), but not vehemently. I'm just saying it could be that he's making generic comments that happen to sound like they are about you. A PM between you guys could probably clarify it.

But he was willing to take Steve's (Geezer's) word for it about what happened between Richter and Leung, but he is not willing to take my word for what happened between me and Jim. He has repeatedly discounted what I have had to say about the "distance learning" process (at least in my case) and continues to say he doesn't think it works. And he has repeated his little catch phrase at least twice now..."Everyone wants to think they are the exception. They are not." So yeah, regardless of his point of view, it certainly appears to me that he is essentially calling me a liar. I don't see any other way to look at it...from my point of view. I don't think a PM is going to change that. If he wants to clarify and apologize for any misunderstanding, then he can do that publically.
 

Flying Crane

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But he was willing to take Steve's (Geezer's) word for it about what happened between Richter and Leung, but he is not willing to take my word for what happened between me and Jim. He has repeatedly discounted what I have had to say about the "distance learning" process (at least in my case) and continues to say he doesn't think it works. And he has repeated his little catch phrase at least twice now..."Everyone wants to think they are the exception. They are not." So yeah, regardless of his point of view, it certainly appears to me that he is essentially calling me a liar. I don't see any other way to look at it...from my point of view. I don't think a PM is going to change that. If he wants to clarify and apologize for any misunderstanding, then he can do that publically.
For clarity: I have not called you a liar.

This discussion has become more personal than it should have, so I will discontinue my involvement.
 

Jim Roselando

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Lets quickly review, as this will be my last post, this is turning into a he said she said going back 15 years, which tends to be boring and worthless... First, let's focus on the two points I made.

1) Anyone can look at your video and see the TWC influence (body & movement) so my first comment was correct.

2) The second comment was, you learned quickly, which was also correct.

As 'one' example I used your version of Jut Choi, so other than you trying to come up with a million ways to somehow turn four weekends over a decade into vast training experience, essentially our discussion was complete.

Yes. You are correct. I required all out of state study groups to share footage so I can check their progress. I also keep regular communication with everyone. You can try to make that sound glorious, I know this is your home for promoting the 'I'm a Pin Sun Instructor' facade, but the reality is four weekends over a decade. That's it amigo. I know I know, you had this incredible foundation in WC so you don't need a teacher (which is so arrogant) but both Joy & Kurt have different opinions on your foundation and these were the only two guys you actually spent a 'little time' training under.


Comparing yourself to Alex is a laughable attempt at a Pity Party for poor Keith. Poor me. Poor me. I'm being attacked! You high jacked my thread! ROFLOL I actually only made two points, on a public forum, and then you decided to try and glorify your background rather than be honest which started the debate.


Now, you can try to distract from the above by saying its about secrecy or even compare that to Leung Ting, which just shows you and I wont see eye to eye. One thing to remember, nobody said, don't train other stuff, don't visit other schools, don't create your own version. etc.... Just about all our guys, including me, cross train with other arts. So I guess if requesting someone to actually train their art before teaching it is such a bad thing....I'm guilty.



Remember, you requested to study an art, we said, OK! Come on up! Just don't teach until you are qualified.... That was the only thing requested.


You wanted to come up. I said, Ok.

You wanted to film, I said OK.

We wanted, no teaching until qualified. You said OK.

"END OF STORY"


That's it! Nothing else. Did I even charge you for training?!?! NO! That's right, your training was even FREE.

Geez, we sound like such horrible people based on having one request? Any of this ring any bells? Our so-called fallout that you stated happened wasn't because of this? You and I both know it was... So this entire nonsense goes back to you agreeing to our sole request, and not being a man of your word, but somehow we are the bad guys? Go figure..... The simple reason you were no longer welcome as part of our 'study group' students was because the moment you learned anything you ran to the internet which is no different than today.


The other gentleman you complained about, who not long ago mentioned you on this forum, Jason, personally asked Mui Sifu about your credentials in his association. He was curious as he read your, I am an Instructor under Mui being thrown around, so he decided to asked him, Who is KPM? Sorry you didn't appreciate his posts but he got his info from the source. I guess Mui Sifu must have lied to him...

In the end, I really don't care what people do or how people train. That's not the point of this discussion. Anyone can create whatever they want. Personally, that's not my thing as I don't believe in reinventing the wheel but as long as it keeps you healthy & happy that's cool. One thing to remember, nobody ever said, don't train other stuff, don't visit other schools, don't create your own version. etc.... Just about all our guys, including me, cross train with other arts. So I guess if requesting someone to actually train their art before teaching it is such a bad thing....I'm guilty.

Unfortunately, this wonderful trip down memory lane has been fun but a complete waste of time. Why? All I replied was, TWC Influence & Quickly Learned. Both were 100% accurate despite the spin doctors attempts to distract, throw blame elsewhere and re-write his background rather than be honest.

Thanks for the stimulating discussion.
 
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geezer

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Let's focus on the two points I made. All I replied was, TWC Influence & Quickly Learned. Both were 100% accurate...

Hey Jim, all you ever had to say was what's quoted above. And it would have been acceptable to add that your organization has not granted Keith "full instructor status". That's useful information.

The problem I have with your lengthy debate with Keith on this forum is that Keith is not promoting himself as a Pin Sun instructor, or a TWC instructor, or an Augustine Fong WC instructor. He is now working on a functional blend of Western boxing, historical western pugilism and Wing Chun (including what he picked up from all the previously mentioned lineages).

As traditional Chinese Martial artists, we may not agree with that approach, but I think we do agree that he is free to explore and go in whatever new directions he so chooses ...as long as he isn't falsely representing himself. And, I see no evidence that he is doing that at this time, regardless of any old history between you two. So why not let it go and wish him the best in his new endeavours? :)
 

Nobody Important

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Hey Jim, all you ever had to say was what's quoted above. And it would have been acceptable to add that your organization has not granted Keith "full instructor status". That's useful information.

The problem I have with your lengthy debate with Keith on this forum is that Keith is not promoting himself as a Pin Sun instructor, or a TWC instructor, or an Augustine Fong WC instructor. He is now working on a functional blend of Western boxing, historical western pugilism and Wing Chun (including what he picked up from all the previously mentioned lineages).

As traditional Chinese Martial artists, we may not agree with that approach, but I think we do agree that he is free to explore and go in whatever new directions he so chooses ...as long as he isn't falsely representing himself. And, I see no evidence that he is doing that at this time, regardless of any old history between you two. So why not let it go and wish him the best in his new endeavours? :)
Well said Steve, and I agree.
 
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1) Anyone can look at your video and see the TWC influence (body & movement) so my first comment was correct.


---It would have been nice if you had actually gone back and read my previous replies before just repeating the same old thing again. If you are referring to what I "created"....meaning the adaptation of the Jut Choi San Sik that I showed as part of "Wing Chun Boxing", then Ok. Its not classical Pin Sun and I never claimed it was! But there is as much western boxing influence there as there is TWC influence. But, you didn't bother to read what a wrote previously, so you didn't bother to clarify what you are talking about.


2) The second comment was, you learned quickly, which was also correct.

---No its not. We kind of hashed out what would be an "old China" approach to distance learning on the other thread and what I did was very close. That's just your bias and your prejudice to now try and devalue and belittle a program that you designed and that I followed just because I showed actual classical Pin Sun Wing Chun on video. If you were really being honest, you would admit that your primary reason for making all these comments was because I dared to show actual Pin Sun on video in an instructional manner.



Yes. You are correct. I required all out of state study groups to share footage so I can check their progress. I also keep regular communication with everyone. You can try to make that sound glorious,

---No one has tried to make it sound "glorious". I've only maintained that this was a viable way to learn for someone that already had a background in Wing Chun. Why you are coming along now and trying to devalue and belittle a program that you yourself created is what people should be wondering about.


I know this is your home for promoting the 'I'm a Pin Sun Instructor' facade, but the reality is four weekends over a decade.

---And again, you are completely discounting the feedback I received from you, the many many hours of training put in, my own personal insight and talent I might have brought to the table, and my past experience. Learning did not stop just because I was not in your presence. You're not that special!


That's it amigo. I know I know, you had this incredible foundation in WC so you don't need a teacher (which is so arrogant)

---And I never said that. You are the one now sounding arrogant by trying to put such words in my mouth.


but both Joy & Kurt have different opinions on your foundation and these were the only two guys you actually spent a 'little time' training under.

----"A little time." You have no idea what you are talking about. I spent 4 years training 2 to 3 nights per week, in person, with either Joy or Kurt. What do you know about it? You've been listening to Joy? Joy tells everyone here that Pin Sun is "just a collection of drills" and not a true system of Wing Chun based upon listening to you. So I think we can dismiss Joy's assessments.



Comparing yourself to Alex is a laughable attempt at a Pity Party for poor Keith. Poor me. Poor me. I'm being attacked! You high jacked my thread! ROFLOL I actually only made two points, on a public forum, and then you decided to try and glorify your background rather than be honest which started the debate.


---I'm not "glorifying" anything. You are doing your best to discredit me, disown me from Pin Sun, and devalue the training I had. Anyone is invited to read the blog I posted from Alex Richter to see the comparison I have made. And you are the one sounding very arrogant in your comment above.


Remember, you requested to study an art, we said, OK! Come on up! Just don't teach until you are qualified.... That was the only thing requested.


---And I didn't. I had one main training partner, which was your requirement for the program. Scott hit a patch when he was out for awhile and I recruited someone else so I would continue to have a training partner while he was gone. So I was sharing what I knew with only 2 people while I was with you. Then when we parted ways, I'm was free to do whatever I wanted. But I still didn't go out and start a school or group and begin teaching Pin Sun. And I still didn't share the video we made with anyone.



Geez, we sound like such horrible people based on having one request?

---A request which I honored.


Any of this ring any bells? Our so-called fallout that you stated happened wasn't because of this? You and I both know it was...

---I don't know what you think was happening at the time. But I only had two people I was sharing Pin Sun with as training partners when we parted ways. You were demanding that everyone do the Chi Gung standing post everyday for 20 to 30 minutes. You were demanding that I stop posting on any forums. You keep conveniently leaving that part out.


So this entire nonsense goes back to you agreeing to our sole request, and not being a man of your word, but somehow we are the bad guys?


---You were demanding and controlling and I DID agree to what was NOT your "sole request." I was only sharing Pin Sun with 2 training partners. I wasn't teaching it openly and publically. Either you have a poor memory, or you are simply on a crusade of character assassination here.


Go figure..... The simple reason you were no longer welcome as part of our 'study group' students was because the moment you learned anything you ran to the internet which is no different than today.

---Ah! Now a little glimmer of the truth emerges! You make it sound like I was giving detailed accounts of Pin Sun or sharing video clips or something. I wasn't. I mostly talked about the history and the organization of the curriculum. What was happening is that you wanted to be seen as THE authority on Pin Sun on the internet, and having someone else talking about Pin Sun took away from that. And one incident does stand out in my memory around the time we parted ways. I believe I had mentioned either "Got Bong" or "Got Gan" in the KFO forum. You told me not to bring that up because most Wing Chun lineages don't know what that is and we should keep it to ourselves.



The other gentleman you complained about, who not long ago mentioned you on this forum, Jason,

---So he was your student! Very rude and disrespectful! And I wasn't the only one that pointed it out to him!


personally asked Mui Sifu about your credentials in his association. He was curious as he read your, I am an Instructor under Mui being thrown around, so he decided to asked him, Who is KPM? Sorry you didn't appreciate his posts but he got his info from the source. I guess Mui Sifu must have lied to him...

---Well, first of all my certificate from Henry Miu reads "4th level instructor"...I think. I'll check. It doesn't say "junior instructor." But certificates don't mean much to me. But even if it actually said "junior instructor".....that is still an instructor! Marc was the one that spent time with me. Not my fault if Henry Miu has a bad memory for names.

---And I will say again something that you have simply ignored......Marc did not put any limitations on me at all. He didn't tell me I couldn't teach my Wing Chun to others. He didn't tell me there was a requirement to come back for more training if I wanted to teach others. He welcomed me to the family and said I could come back and train with them any time I wanted. Marc approved of my Pin Sun knowledge and gave me his blessing. Given that he is also a direct senior student of Henry Miu, like yourself, I think I can safely say that your opinion is therefore null and void. You have not seen me or touched hands with me in over 10 years. And the only thing I didn't learn was the pole form. And sorry, but I wasn't impressed with the Pin Sun pole form and I wasn't going to pay a big fee to learn it simply so Henry Miu would give me a certificate that said "Sifu."



In the end, I really don't care what people do or how people train. That's not the point of this discussion. Anyone can create whatever they want.

---Great! Then stop giving me crap and attempting your "character assassination"!


Unfortunately, this wonderful trip down memory lane has been fun but a complete waste of time. Why? All I replied was, TWC Influence & Quickly Learned. Both were 100% accurate despite the spin doctors attempts to distract, throw blame elsewhere and re-write his background rather than be honest.

---I have been perfectly honest. You haven't tried to deny anything I have written other than me saying it wasn't "quickly learned." And, as I have pointed out, if you think the distant learning process I have gone through was "quickly learned" then you have very poor judgment, and everyone should be questioning your motives for coming here.
 
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Now, clearly anyone can see that my certificate, signed by Sifu Henry Mui, says "Level Five (Instructor)". Maybe that's a junior instructor in his organization. I don't know. I wasn't told that. Again, Marc Kenney was my primary instructor for my Pin Sun "revamp" or "update." He was happy with my skills and depth of knowledge. He did not tell me I was limited in any way as far as teaching what I know to others. He welcomed me back to the Pin Sun family and invited to come back to Boston for training at any time. So if I have stated here in the past that I was an "Instructor under Henry Mui", this certificate backs up what I was saying. I've never claimed to represent Henry Mui or his organization. I have never claimed to represent anyone other than myself. I mention Henry Mui if someone asks about my Pin Sun background so they will know exactly what version of Pin Sun I have studied. What Henry Mui teaches is different from John Fung's "Ku Lo 22 Points", different from Robert Chu's "Gu Lao 40 points", and different from Lee Sing/Joseph Lee/Mick Watson's "GuLao Pin Sun." So I feel like it is appropriate to clarify that my Pin Sun background is through Henry Mui. To not do that would seem to be disrespectful.

Consider that, even as a "junior" instructor it would imply far more knowledge and skill than Jim has given me credit for. It certainly implies something more than "quickly learned" over a couple of weekends.

Consider that Jim has not seen me, touched hands with me, or had anything to do with me for over 10 years. Yet he thinks he knows me and what my skill level might be. THAT is very arrogant on his part!

So hopefully people are starting to ask themselves what Jim's real motivation is for coming here to cause trouble. I'm telling you it is because I posted videos on youtube that showed a couple of the classical Pin Sun sets and their training progression. That is the main reason. And he accuses me of not being honest! I have been honest and up front with everything I have posted so far.

This has clearly been a "smear campaign" by Jim Roselando. Which is pretty low and pathetic.
 
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Vajramusti

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1) Anyone can look at your video and see the TWC influence (body & movement) so my first comment was correct.

---It would have been nice if you had actually gone back and read my previous replies before just repeating the same old thing again. If you are referring to what I "created"....meaning the adaptation of the Jut Choi San Sik that I showed as part of "Wing Chun Boxing", then Ok. Its not classical Pin Sun and I never claimed it was! But there is as much western boxing influence there as there is TWC influence. But, you didn't bother to read what a wrote previously, so you didn't bother to clarify what you are talking about.


2) The second comment was, you learned quickly, which was also correct.

---No its not. We kind of hashed out what would be an "old China" approach to distance learning on the other thread and what I did was very close. That's just your bias and your prejudice to now try and devalue and belittle a program that you designed and that I followed just because I showed actual classical Pin Sun Wing Chun on video. If you were really being honest, you would admit that your primary reason for making all these comments was because I dared to show actual Pin Sun on video in an instructional manner.



Yes. You are correct. I required all out of state study groups to share footage so I can check their progress. I also keep regular communication with everyone. You can try to make that sound glorious,

---No one has tried to make it sound "glorious". I've only maintained that this was a viable way to learn for someone that already had a background in Wing Chun. Why you are coming along now and trying to devalue and belittle a program that you yourself created is what people should be wondering about.


I know this is your home for promoting the 'I'm a Pin Sun Instructor' facade, but the reality is four weekends over a decade.

---And again, you are completely discounting the feedback I received from you, the many many hours of training put in, my own personal insight and talent I might have brought to the table, and my past experience. Learning did not stop just because I was not in your presence. You're not that special!


That's it amigo. I know I know, you had this incredible foundation in WC so you don't need a teacher (which is so arrogant)

---And I never said that. You are the one now sounding arrogant by trying to put such words in my mouth.


but both Joy & Kurt have different opinions on your foundation and these were the only two guys you actually spent a 'little time' training under.

----"A little time." You have no idea what you are talking about. I spent 4 years training 2 to 3 nights per week, in person, with either Joy or Kurt. What do you know about it? You've been listening to Joy? Joy tells everyone here that Pin Sun is "just a collection of drills" and not a true system of Wing Chun based upon listening to you. So I think we can dismiss Joy's assessments.
(((Dragged into this mess-not of my choosing; Keith attended some of my classes for less than 23 moths,when I was in New
When i left I listed him an assistant instructor.
Then when I was disappointed with his wanderings I cancelled the certificate and let him know about it.)))


Comparing yourself to Alex is a laughable attempt at a Pity Party for poor Keith. Poor
Now, clearly anyone can see that my certificate, signed by Sifu Henry Mui, says "Level Five (Instructor)". Maybe that's a junior instructor in his organization. I don't know. I wasn't told that. Again, Marc Kenney was my primary instructor for my Pin Sun "revamp" or "update." He was happy with my skills and depth of knowledge. He did not tell me I was limited in any way as far as teaching what I know to others. He welcomed me back to the Pin Sun family and invited to come back to Boston for training at any time. So if I have stated here in the past that I was an "Instructor under Henry Mui", this certificate backs up what I was saying. I've never claimed to represent Henry Mui or his organization. I have never claimed to represent anyone other than myself. I mention Henry Mui if someone asks about my Pin Sun background so they will know exactly what version of Pin Sun I have studied. What Henry Mui teaches is different from John Fung's "Ku Lo 22 Points", different from Robert Chu's "Gu Lao 40 points", and different from Lee Sing/Joseph Lee/Mick Watson's "GuLao Pin Sun." So I feel like it is appropriate to clarify that my Pin Sun background is through Henry Mui. To not do that would seem to be disrespectful.

Consider that, even as a "junior" instructor it would imply far more knowledge and skill than Jim has given me credit for. It certainly implies something more than "quickly learned" over a couple of weekends.

Consider that Jim has not seen me, touched hands with me, or had anything to do with me for over 10 years. Yet he thinks he knows me and what my skill level might be. THAT is very arrogant on his part!

So hopefully people are starting to ask themselves what Jim's real motivation is for coming here to cause trouble. I'm telling you it is because I posted videos on youtube that showed a couple of the classical Pin Sun sets and their training progression. That is the main reason. And he accuses me of not being honest! I have been honest and up front with everything I have posted so far.

This has clearly been a "smear campaign" by Jim Roselando. Which is pretty low and pathetic.

me. Poor me. I'm being attacked! You high jacked my thread! ROFLOL I actually only made two points, on a public forum, and then you decided to try and glorify your background rather than be honest which started the debate.



---I'm not "glorifying" anything. You are doing your best to discredit me, disown me from Pin Sun, and devalue the training I had. Anyone is invited to read the blog I posted from Alex Richter to see the comparison I have made. And you are the one sounding very arrogant in your comment above.


Remember, you requested to study an art, we said, OK! Come on up! Just don't teach until you are qualified.... That was the only thing requested.


---And I didn't. I had one main training partner, which was your requirement for the program. Scott hit a patch when he was out for awhile and I recruited someone else so I would continue to have a training partner while he was gone. So I was sharing what I knew with only 2 people while I was with you. Then when we parted ways, I'm was free to do whatever I wanted. But I still didn't go out and start a school or group and begin teaching Pin Sun. And I still didn't share the video we made with anyone.



Geez, we sound like such horrible people based on having one request?

---A request which I honored.


Any of this ring any bells? Our so-called fallout that you stated happened wasn't because of this? You and I both know it was...

---I don't know what you think was happening at the time. But I only had two people I was sharing Pin Sun with as training partners when we parted ways. You were demanding that everyone do the Chi Gung standing post everyday for 20 to 30 minutes. You were demanding that I stop posting on any forums. You keep conveniently leaving that part out.


So this entire nonsense goes back to you agreeing to our sole request, and not being a man of your word, but somehow we are the bad guys?


---You were demanding and controlling and I DID agree to what was NOT your "sole request." I was only sharing Pin Sun with 2 training partners. I wasn't teaching it openly and publically. Either you have a poor memory, or you are simply on a crusade of character assassination here.


Go figure..... The simple reason you were no longer welcome as part of our 'study group' students was because the moment you learned anything you ran to the internet which is no different than today.

---Ah! Now a little glimmer of the truth emerges! You make it sound like I was giving detailed accounts of Pin Sun or sharing video clips or something. I wasn't. I mostly talked about the history and the organization of the curriculum. What was happening is that you wanted to be seen as THE authority on Pin Sun on the internet, and having someone else talking about Pin Sun took away from that. And one incident does stand out in my memory around the time we parted ways. I believe I had mentioned either "Got Bong" or "Got Gan" in the KFO forum. You told me not to bring that up because most Wing Chun lineages don't know what that is and we should keep it to ourselves.



The other gentleman you complained about, who not long ago mentioned you on this forum, Jason,

---So he was your student! Very rude and disrespectful! And I wasn't the only one that pointed it out to him!


personally asked Mui Sifu about your credentials in his association. He was curious as he read your, I am an Instructor under Mui being thrown around, so he decided to asked him, Who is KPM? Sorry you didn't appreciate his posts but he got his info from the source. I guess Mui Sifu must have lied to him...

---Well, first of all my certificate from Henry Miu reads "4th level instructor"...I think. I'll check. It doesn't say "junior instructor." But certificates don't mean much to me. But even if it actually said "junior instructor".....that is still an instructor! Marc was the one that spent time with me. Not my fault if Henry Miu has a bad memory for names.

---And I will say again something that you have simply ignored......Marc did not put any limitations on me at all. He didn't tell me I couldn't teach my Wing Chun to others. He didn't tell me there was a requirement to come back for more training if I wanted to teach others. He welcomed me to the family and said I could come back and train with them any time I wanted. Marc approved of my Pin Sun knowledge and gave me his blessing. Given that he is also a direct senior student of Henry Miu, like yourself, I think I can safely say that your opinion is therefore null and void. You have not seen me or touched hands with me in over 10 years. And the only thing I didn't learn was the pole form. And sorry, but I wasn't impressed with the Pin Sun pole form and I wasn't going to pay a big fee to learn it simply so Henry Miu would give me a certificate that said "Sifu."



In the end, I really don't care what people do or how people train. That's not the point of this discussion. Anyone can create whatever they want.

---Great! Then stop giving me crap and attempting your "character assassination"!


Unfortunately, this wonderful trip down memory lane has been fun but a complete waste of time. Why? All I replied was, TWC Influence & Quickly Learned. Both were 100% accurate despite the spin doctors attempts to distract, throw blame elsewhere and re-write his background rather than be honest.

---I have been perfectly honest. You haven't tried to deny anything I have written other than me saying it wasn't "quickly learned." And, as I have pointed out, if you think the distant learning process I have gone through was "quickly learned" then you have very poor judgment, and everyone should be questioning your motives for coming here.
(((Somewhere I was mentioned-not by my choice.AAARG! KPM attended some of my classes for about 22 months in New Mexico.
I gave him an assistant instructor certificate
before returning to Arizona. I was so disappointed in his lack of development after that, I cancelled the certificate and informed him accordingly.))
 
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(((Somewhere I was mentioned-not by my choice.AAARG! KPM attended some of my classes for about 22 months in New Mexico.
I gave him an assistant instructor certificate
before returning to Arizona. I was so disappointed in his lack of development after that, I cancelled the certificate and informed him accordingly.))

I thought you would probably show up! I didn't mention you. Jim did! And you have never ever said anything to me about being disappointed with my lack of development or "canceling" any certificate. I'll say it out-right....THAT is a bold-faced lie! But I could care less. Like Jim, you assume that when you left town my learning stopped. It didn't. You have no idea how much I continued to study with Kurt and you have no idea how many times I attended seminars at Fong's school after that, because you weren't around. You have no idea how much time I spent training with Randy Li later on, because you weren't around. Like Jim, you haven't seen me, touched hands with me, or had anything to do with me (other than arguing on this forum) for 30....that's right...30 years!!!!! Your opinion on the matter means diddly squat! :rolleyes:

So how about you tell your buddy Jim your often repeated opinion about Pin Sun being just a "collection of drills" and not a true system of Wing Chun? ;)

You have always held a grudge against me because I left Fong's system and went on to study other things. I've never understood why that is the case. But it certainly seems to be true.
 

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What was happening is that you wanted to be seen as THE authority on Pin Sun on the internet, and having someone else talking about Pin Sun took away from you.

Bingo! that's what this is all about, otherwise he wouldn't have bothered to post on here, Sounds like he have Napoleonic complex! what a D!ck!
 

LFJ

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The simple reason you were no longer welcome as part of our 'study group' students was because the moment you learned anything you ran to the internet which is no different than today.

Haha!

Just like how he made one (1) trip to Hong Kong to learn about Tang Yik pole, and as soon as he got home he started teaching it and making master's class videos teaching it all wrong.

Internet forums are where he comes for validation and gratification because he knows he's basically a self-taught master. :woot:

I knew it. Hilarious! :hilarious:
 
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KPM

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Haha!

Just like how he made one (1) trip to Hong Kong to learn about Tang Yik pole, and as soon as he got home he started teaching it and making master's class videos teaching it all wrong.

Internet forums are where he comes for validation and gratification because he knows he's basically a self-taught master. :woot:

I knew it. Hilarious! :hilarious:

Again, another clueless idiot weighs in! Welcome back LFJ! Here to stir up more trouble? "Master's class"??? What the heck are you even talking about??? I made some videos showing the basic mechanics of the pole that I learned from Sifu Michael Tang. I shared them with only a few people, and did not make them all public. I put a few of them up here that showed some very basics and to give some background to help promote SIfu Tang and the Tang family pole method. I have not taught the actual Tang Yik pole form to anyone including my small group of students, and I have not put it in those series of videos. All I have shown is the basic techniques mechanics and basic drills. "Master's class"? You have no idea what you are even talking about.

And you don't know Tang Yik pole. So how would you know if I was "teaching it all wrong"????

Isn't it amazing how the petty and small-minded people love to pile on when they think they smell blood? :rolleyes: Does anyone else want to take a shot at me? o_O
 
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geezer

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There you have it! KPM's certificate has been cancelled. Next thing you know, his university and high school will be also be demanding his diplomas back for "lack of development". In fact, I have it on good authority that his kindergarten teacher is also revoking his advancement to first grade. She will be posting about it here shortly. :D
 

geezer

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That does it. Keith, I'm revoking your certificate in Geezer-fu. You've shown way too little development, ....especially around the waistline.
 
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KPM

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That does it. Keith, I'm revoking your certificate in Geezer-fu. You've shown way too little development, ....especially around the waistline.

Oh, waist-line development is not an issue! ;)
 
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