only 22 years late

[bushidomartialarts]

i heard on the news today about how the police in new york city are installing/have already installed government surveillance cameras on streetlights at some intersections.

anybody know any details, and is anybody else thinking about 1984?

 

[Hand Sword]

I always think about the '80's. I miss it so! On a realistic note, it's about time they did this. Hopefully, they will be monitored for real, and used for real.

 

[shesulsa]

We have had those here for a while. And yes, I do think they are rather Orwellian.

 

[Ping898]

We have had those here for a while. And yes, I do think they are rather Orwellian.

I agree...unfortunetally cause it is a public place we supposedly have no expectation of privacy....I don't have an expectation of privacy, per se, but I do have an expectation that my every move won't be recorded....

 

[Bigshadow]

i heard on the news today about how the police in new york city are installing/have already installed government surveillance cameras on streetlights at some intersections.

anybody know any details, and is anybody else thinking about 1984?

Hmmm.... There are so many similarities between today's society and the society of George Orwell's (1984). Everything from the "Ministry of Love" to the daily 2-minutes of hate, to the memory hole. There is so much more than people realize. I think about that nearly every day.

Just remember, in the end, you will love them. They have your best interests in mind.

 

[RoninPimp]

I don't like the idea of these in thoeory. But like Ping said, its hard to argue against them in a public place. Even if the government doesn't do this, the private sector is moving in this direction anyway. It protects them. So in the end, I think its inevitable. I do think every police car should have them like some areas do. It protects both the police and the people they pull over. With security cameras and the ever growing proliferation of video recording cell phones, the future will be recorded imo.

 

[bushidomartialarts]

Even if the government doesn't do this, the private sector is moving in this direction anyway. It protects them. So in the end, I think its inevitable. .

that's another thing that worries me. corporations are doing more to erode our rights than the government has or even can. we have freedom of the press, but fox, gannett, barnes and noble and walmart decide what ideas we're exposed to. we have freedom of choice, but only those choices presented to us by the producers of what we consume.

gives me the creeping willies.

 

[Blindside]

London already has these in place (and they've been there for awhile), thats how they were able to track down those subway bombers so quickly.

And no I don't think this is a good thing, but it'll be awhile before I have to worry about this in Wyoming.

Lamont

 

[deadhand31]

I know that in Milwaukee, Wisconsin they are planning on putting cameras on power line poles. This is in response to Milwaukee's much higher than normal murder rate last year. They seem to be targeting the troublesome areas, though, not everywhere. I believe this is modeled after a system currently in use in Chicago.

 

[RoninPimp]

that's another thing that worries me. corporations are doing more to erode our rights than the government has or even can. we have freedom of the press, but fox, gannett, barnes and noble and walmart decide what ideas we're exposed to. we have freedom of choice, but only those choices presented to us by the producers of what we consume.

gives me the creeping willies.

-Ehhh, I don't like big corporations, but I trust them more than my government...

 

[Ceicei]

Many intersections in Utah have them, and they've been around for quite a long while. A lot of gas stations have these cameras to monitor for the "drive-offs". Almost every major stores have them, both inside and outside. :idunno:

I wish the monitoring weren't necessary. I would love it if the world became more honor based. Unfortunately, the bigger that society becomes, the more people become "faceless" and have less value. Almost everything has to be signed, no longer on a "handshake-agreement". Trust and honor almost doesn't exist any more--at least not at the corporate level. At least at the individual level, I still see trust and honor.

- Ceicei

 

[bushidomartialarts]

-Ehhh, I don't like big corporations, but I trust them more than my government...

do you trust the corporations more, or is it that you fear them less?

corporations don't even pretend to have our best interests at heart. they do what's good for the bottom line and by happy coincidence sometimes that helps some of us out, too.

on the other hand, they don't have the power to harm us like the government does. so far, anyhow...

 

[Jonathan Randall]

I always think about the '80's. I miss it so! On a realistic note, it's about time they did this. Hopefully, they will be monitored for real, and used for real.

I miss the 80's so much as well. Boy, I sure didn't know at the time (and appreciate) that it was really a peaceful time of relative innocence here in the U.S.

Regarding the cameras; I have mixed feelings. They did catch the young sociopaths who beat homeless to death with baseball bats in Florida, but they also intrude, to a degree, on the average citizen's right to privacy. In the hands of a fascist government, however, they could be VERY dangerous and I fear the precedent.

 

[Hand Sword]

Perfect 80's reference for this topic, remember: "I always feel like...somebody's watching me! And I got no privacy!"

 

[bushidomartialarts]

"private eyes...are watching you...every day and night"

 

[RoninPimp]

do you trust the corporations more, or is it that you fear them less?

corporations don't even pretend to have our best interests at heart. they do what's good for the bottom line and by happy coincidence sometimes that helps some of us out, too.

on the other hand, they don't have the power to harm us like the government does. so far, anyhow...

-I've never "feared" a corporation...

 

[shesulsa]

-Ehhh, I don't like big corporations, but I trust them more than my government...

Some might argue that big corporations ARE your government ....

 

[RoninPimp]

Some might argue that big corporations ARE your government ....

-I'm sure they would...

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Found this. Interesting read...wonder how accurate it really is.

Back in the pre-Reagan days, American companies made profits that were distributed among Americans. They used their profits to build more factories, or diversify into other businesses. The profits stayed in America.

Today, foreigners awash with our consumer dollars are on a two-decades-long buying spree. The UK's BP bought Amoco for $48 billion - now Amoco's profits go to England. Deutsche Telekom bought VoiceStream Wireless, so their profits go to Germany, which is where most of the profits from Random House, Allied Signal, Chrysler, Doubleday, Cyprus Amax's US Coal Mining Operations, GTE/Sylvania, and Westinghouse's Power Generation profits go as well. Ralston Purina's profits go to Switzerland, along with Gerber's; TransAmerica's profits go to The Netherlands, while John Hancock Insurance's profits go to Canada. Even American Bankers Insurance Group is owned now by Fortis AG in Belgium.

Foreign companies are buying up our water systems, our power generating systems, our mines, and our few remaining factories. All because "flat world" so-called "free trade" policies have turned us from a nation of wealthy producers into a nation of indebted consumers, leaving the world awash in dollars that are most easily used to buy off big chunks of America. As www.economyincrisis.com notes, US Government statistics indicate the following percentages of foreign ownership of American industry:

· Sound recording industries - 97%
· Commodity contracts dealing and brokerage - 79%
· Motion picture and sound recording industries - 75%
· Metal ore mining - 65%
· Motion picture and video industries - 64%
· Wineries and distilleries - 64%
· Database, directory, and other publishers - 63%
· Book publishers - 63%
· Cement, concrete, lime, and gypsum product - 62%
· Engine, turbine and power transmission equipment - 57%
· Rubber product - 53%
· Nonmetallic mineral product manufacturing - 53%
· Plastics and rubber products manufacturing - 52%
· Plastics product - 51%
· Other insurance related activities - 51%
· Boiler, tank, and shipping container - 50%
· Glass and glass product - 48%
· Coal mining - 48%
· Sugar and confectionery product - 48%
· Nonmetallic mineral mining and quarrying - 47%
· Advertising and related services - 41%
· Pharmaceutical and medicine - 40%
· Clay, refractory, and other nonmetallic mineral products - 40%
· Securities brokerage - 38%
· Other general purpose machinery - 37%
· Audio and video equipment mfg and reproducing magnetic and optical media - 36%
· Support activities for mining - 36%
· Soap, cleaning compound, and toilet preparation - 32%
· Chemical manufacturing - 30%
· Industrial machinery - 30%
· Securities, commodity contracts, and other financial investments and related activities - 30%
· Other food - 29%
· Motor vehicles and parts - 29%
· Machinery manufacturing - 28%
· Other electrical equipment and component - 28%
· Securities and commodity exchanges and other financial investment activities - 27%
· Architectural, engineering, and related services - 26%
· Credit card issuing and other consumer credit - 26%
· Petroleum refineries (including integrated) - 25%
· Navigational, measuring, electromedical, and control instruments - 25%
· Petroleum and coal products manufacturing - 25%
· Transportation equipment manufacturing - 25%
· Commercial and service industry machinery - 25%
· Basic chemical - 24%
· Investment banking and securities dealing - 24%
· Semiconductor and other electronic component - 23%
· Paint, coating, and adhesive - 22%
· Printing and related support activities - 21%
· Chemical product and preparation - 20%
· Iron, steel mills, and steel products - 20%
· Agriculture, construction, and mining machinery - 20%
· Publishing industries - 20%
· Medical equipment and supplies - 20%

http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0227-20.htm

 

[Cryozombie]

Some might argue that big corporations ARE your government ....

I would.