Mohammad Ali - Karate Master?

[Bill Mattocks]

Mohammad Ali (then Cassius Clay) fought Sonny Liston in 1965, and was accused of using a 'deadly karate blow' to knock out Liston...

Just thought it was kind of funny. People had a rather strange idea about karate at that time.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...DlWAAAAIBAJ&sjid=AOkDAAAAIBAJ&pg=3490,3927277

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...q=cassius+clay+sonny+liston+karate+blow&hl=en

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...q=cassius+clay+sonny+liston+karate+blow&hl=en

 

[Cyriacus]

Hehe.
The way I see it, even if it was Karate, it doesnt change the fact it wasnt blocked. And a Closed Fist would work just as well.

 

[Nomad]

Mohammad Ali (then Cassius Clay) fought Sonny Liston in 1965, and was accused of using a 'deadly karate blow' to knock out Liston...

Just thought it was kind of funny. People had a rather strange idea about karate at that time.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...DlWAAAAIBAJ&sjid=AOkDAAAAIBAJ&pg=3490,3927277

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...q=cassius+clay+sonny+liston+karate+blow&hl=en

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...q=cassius+clay+sonny+liston+karate+blow&hl=en

That is AWESOME. Twisting your punch turns it into a "deadly karate blow"!

 

[Cyriacus]

That is AWESOME. Twisting your punch turns it into a "deadly karate blow"!

Well, yeah. So does performing any given Open Handed Strike.
Its all Karate.
Theres no such thing as a Knife Hand Strike. Silly People.

 

[Cyriacus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prxnGjKjxoo&feature=related
...interesting Punch though...

 

[punisher73]

George Dillman was in Ali's training camp for awhile. I think it also lended to the mystique that Ali had some "secret karate" knowledge.

 

[elder999]

One of his trainers was a Filipino, back then-he didn't train with Dillman until after he came back from exile.

All the punches in boxing exist in most forms of karate,though.

The "twisting is deadly?" ehhhhh.

 

[Cyriacus]

One of his trainers was a Filipino, back then-he didn't train with Dillman until after he came back from exile.

All the punches in boxing exist in most forms of karate,though.

The "twisting is deadly?" ehhhhh.

Maybe not Deadly on its own, but it does hit People harder, I find. Not so much Targets - I see little difference there. But against a Person, the Penetration can be felt.

In context, however, he really doesnt twist it much.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Maybe not Deadly on its own, but it does hit People harder, I find. Not so much Targets - I see little difference there. But against a Person, the Penetration can be felt.

In context, however, he really doesnt twist it much.

We do not twist our punch in Isshin-Ryu. I guess we don't hit hard. Oh, dear.

 

[WC_lun]

We don't twist our punched in Wing Chun either. Hardest I've ever been hit was by my Sifu. Good thing he didn't twist it, huh?

 

[Nomad]

We do not twist our punch in Isshin-Ryu. I guess we don't hit hard. Oh, dear.

Yeah? Well, we do... :mst: so watch out!

 

[punisher73]

I have seen a couple of "studies" that have shown that twisting a punch doesn't do anything for the velocity of the punch to make it hit any harder. Twisting is also very distance dependant. If the target moves in while the twist is occurring, bad juju on your wrist. One of the reasons for a vertical punch is that the weapon is always at it's optimum configuration, person moves in and the vertical punch still lands as it should, with only a loss of energy instead of injury.

 

[punisher73]

One of his trainers was a Filipino, back then-he didn't train with Dillman until after he came back from exile.

All the punches in boxing exist in most forms of karate,though.

The "twisting is deadly?" ehhhhh.

Thanks for that. I wasn't sure when Dillman/Ali were together. I remember in one interview Ali claimed that he hit a guy with a "karate punch", but it was just a plain ol' punch.

I agree that boxing's punches can be found in most styles of karate, just a different approach based on rule sets.

 

[Buka]

Ali called that "The anchor punch".
There are some pundits in boxing who called Liston's reaction akin to a double pike tuck with a twist, no splash.

There's also other connections to Martial Arts that Ali has. When he was training for the "show" with Japanese pro wrestler, Antonio Inoki (maybe boxing's darkest hour) Karate legend Joe Lewis was in attendance. I don't remember who initiated the friendly conversation between the two but Ali asked Joe to come into the ring and show him what Inoki might do. Joe Lewis shot to Ali's legs, then picked him up in a fireman's carry, then pinned him. In fact, I think he pinned him twice. It was a friendly encounter, though, Ali liked him. (if my memory serves correct.)

Also - a lot of Ali's jabs during his career were actually backfists.

 

[Cyriacus]

We do not twist our punch in Isshin-Ryu. I guess we don't hit hard. Oh, dear.

I didnt say it wouldnt hit as hard - I said that I find that the twist gives you more Power on connection with a Person.
But all Roads lead to Rome.

 

[GisanOx]

Skiddoosh.

 

[chinto]

European boxers have struck in sport to just under the nose on the upper lip and to just behind the ear even before the london boxing rules! lol !! there are only so many places you can hit a man and ko. especially before the modern wrapping of hands and padded gloves to protect the hand .