MN man beaten nearly to death by SWAT officer....for loud cell phone use

[Carol]

SWAT officer beating a guy for talking on his cell?
So badly that the victim needed two brain surgeries?
And that only nets a 3rd degree assault charge? Really, Minnesota?

http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/story/18818084/brian-vander-lee-benefit
http://www.twincities.com/localnews/ci_20973232/victim-alleged-assault-by-minneapolis-police-officer-is

 

[Wo Fat]

SWAT officer beating a guy for talking on his cell?
So badly that the victim needed two brain surgeries?
And that only nets a 3rd degree assault charge? Really, Minnesota?

http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/story/18818084/brian-vander-lee-benefit
http://www.twincities.com/localnews/ci_20973232/victim-alleged-assault-by-minneapolis-police-officer-is

Vander Lee's law firm is my previous employer. They will represent him well.

No comment on the officer, but as in other cases where someone is either killed or critically injured and the other person is alive and well, the circumstances will become evident soon.

 

[Gentle Fist]

You're either SWAT or you're not...

 

[Tgace]

The cops side of the story:

http://www.twincities.com/localnews...rney-claims-vander-lee-prompted-confrontation

Which if true...IMO...still has issues. Why get physically involved in an off duty incident unless its ABSOLUTELY necessary? Some guy getting loud and obnoxious? Tell management...or leave.

For the martial arts crowd...a good example of how one punch can land you in deep ****. Don't use force unless absolutely necessary.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

 

[Wo Fat]

For the martial arts crowd...a good example of how one punch can land you in deep ****. Don't use force unless absolutely necessary.

I wondered if the officer has a MA background. From what I read, it was basically a one-punch incident.

 

[Tgace]

I wondered if the officer has a MA background. From what I read, it was basically a one-punch incident.

One punch...fell and hit his head. Happens more often than one would think

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

 

[jks9199]

The cops side of the story:

http://www.twincities.com/localnews...rney-claims-vander-lee-prompted-confrontation

Which if true...IMO...still has issues. Why get physically involved in an off duty incident unless its ABSOLUTELY necessary? Some guy getting loud and obnoxious? Tell management...or leave.

For the martial arts crowd...a good example of how one punch can land you in deep ****. Don't use force unless absolutely necessary.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

I didn't like how little information was in the first articles about what happened. There's still not a lot more, and I'm not justifying the off duty officer's actions, but it seems like it was more than simply walking up and decking a guy for talking on his cell phone. I do want to point out that the punch didn't do the damage, it seems, but that falling and hitting his head did the damage. Small difference, and Clifford is still responsible for his actions and the consequences -- but important to recognize as well. It's definitely a bit different than the headline reads. I also do want to point out that this wasn't an official action; Clifford was off the clock, on his own time. (Something the first articles kind of avoided mentioning, being more interested in the horrible story of a cop beating someone so badly that he needed 2 brain surgeries... would it be mentioned if Clifford was a mechanic, doctor, or lawyer?) I don't know what he may or may not have done or been like when he was working. I kind of suspect that alcohol was a factor on both sides here...

 

[Wo Fat]

I didn't like how little information was in the first articles about what happened. There's still not a lot more, and I'm not justifying the off duty officer's actions, but it seems like it was more than simply walking up and decking a guy for talking on his cell phone. I do want to point out that the punch didn't do the damage, it seems, but that falling and hitting his head did the damage. Small difference, and Clifford is still responsible for his actions and the consequences -- but important to recognize as well. It's definitely a bit different than the headline reads. I also do want to point out that this wasn't an official action; Clifford was off the clock, on his own time. (Something the first articles kind of avoided mentioning, being more interested in the horrible story of a cop beating someone so badly that he needed 2 brain surgeries... would it be mentioned if Clifford was a mechanic, doctor, or lawyer?) I don't know what he may or may not have done or been like when he was working. I kind of suspect that alcohol was a factor on both sides here...

I get what you're saying about information being minimal, and how that might "oversimplify" the facts and circumstances of what happened. But at what point does a cop--on duty or otherwise--have a higher standard of behavior? They're not paid to have a higher standard, and that's shameful. But they do have higher standards. Don't they?

 

[blindsage]

"Sommer said the real proof is on the bar's video footage.

He said it shows Clifford sitting at a table next to Brian Vander Lee and eventually getting up and walking over to Vander Lee, who was talking on his cellphone. Standing next to him, the footage shows Clifford lean over and say something in Vander Lee's ear, prompting Vander Lee to briefly turn and look at him before returning to his phone call, Sommer said.
"Then there is more confrontation on Clifford's part, and then you see (Vander Lee) start to stand up ... (Then) Clifford hits him and takes off running," Sommer said. "

If this is true, regardless of whatever else happened, isn't it pretty open and shut?

 

[mxav]

cop is in the wrong. Done.

 

[jks9199]

cop is in the wrong. Done.

Why? Would your opinion be different if it were to turn out that Clifford was the last of several people to ask Vander Lee to quiet down, and that Vander Lee's response to Clifford's request was "screw you, make me, and my buddies and I are going to kick your ***"?

Again, I'm not saying that Clifford was right -- but that there may have been some degree of justification or mitigation that has not been presented in the press to date.

And, again, the actions were NOT under color of authority. Clifford is responsible for his actions. It's Clifford's bad luck that one punch knocked Vander Lee down, and Vander Lee suffered increased injuries from that -- but he'll have to pay the piper for the punch.

 

[granfire]

Why? Would your opinion be different if it were to turn out that Clifford was the last of several people to ask Vander Lee to quiet down, and that Vander Lee's response to Clifford's request was "screw you, make me, and my buddies and I are going to kick your ***"?

Again, I'm not saying that Clifford was right -- but that there may have been some degree of justification or mitigation that has not been presented in the press to date.

And, again, the actions were NOT under color of authority. Clifford is responsible for his actions. It's Clifford's bad luck that one punch knocked Vander Lee down, and Vander Lee suffered increased injuries from that -- but he'll have to pay the piper for the punch.

I think you missed the sarcasm...at least I hope so....

 

[ballen0351]

Yet another reason I don't go to bars and stopped drinking along time ago.