"Mandatory" Events!!!

[11 Bravo Infantry]

So,

My question is....have any of you ever had the displeasure of being told that, you HAVE to attend events (eg., tournaments, camps, seminars, etc.), or risk being passed over for promotion?!

I've never understood this policy! When the organization head tells school owners/instructors to MAKE their students compete, or they won't be considered for testing, to ME...seems wrong.

Now, I realize that it is a business....But come on. Encouraging students to compete, or attend camps is one thing, but FORCING them?! This just leaves a bitter taste in my mouth, where organizations are concerned.

 

[girlbug2]

I practice a martial art other than Tang Soo Do, but yes the instructor has added requirements in the last year for students in my school to obtain their brown and black belts in Krav Maga. These requirements include successful completion of a certain number of seminars and courses outside the regular curriculum, including:

A certified firearms training course (a local instructor teaches it who happens to go to our school, but we have the option of getting certified with any instructor)
Carjacking seminar (taught by our instructor)
Third Party Gun Defense seminar (taught at our school by guest instructor)
Knife defense seminar, beginning and advanced (taught at our school by guest instructor)

There are a few others, but you get the idea.

The intent as I understand it, is to ensure that our martial art is fully explored, as it is not focused only on "open hand" techniques that we practice daily at school but also involves weapons. I can see the point of it, although it is inconvenient at times. OTOh we dont' have to participate in any kind of camp, competitions or tournaments. Personally I don't see the value in requiring that for students; that kind of thing should be something done for personal enjoyment IMO.

 

[poollshark]

So,

My question is....have any of you ever had the displeasure of being told that, you HAVE to attend events (eg., tournaments, camps, seminars, etc.), or risk being passed over for promotion?!

I've never understood this policy! When the organization head tells school owners/instructors to MAKE their students compete, or they won't be considered for testing, to ME...seems wrong.

Now, I realize that it is a business....But come on. Encouraging students to compete, or attend camps is one thing, but FORCING them?! This just leaves a bitter taste in my mouth, where organizations are concerned.

I don't think I'd be thrilled to be told that and it might cause me to reevaluate if the school and I are a proper match. Now possibly a required seminar or something of that nature for advanced students that has a particular purpose but isn't feasible for my regular classes might be reasonable.
I think it's something I'd address on a case by case basis.

George

 

[puunui]

I used to have a requirement that all students have to compete in one sparring tournament before they get promoted to 1st Dan. But I relaxed off that and don't require that anymore.

 

[11 Bravo Infantry]

I don't think I'd be thrilled to be told that and it might cause me to reevaluate if the school and I are a proper match. Now possibly a required seminar or something of that nature for advanced students that has a particular purpose but isn't feasible for my regular classes might be reasonable.
I think it's something I'd address on a case by case basis.

George

I completely agree. It just frustrates me, because, again, even though I KNOW it's a business...FORCING students to compete, or go to karate camp is just ridiculous!
Ugh!!

 

[DMcHenry]

One of the styles I trained in had that requirement. At certain levels, you also had to attend a summer camp too.

For a while, I began requiring my students to collect so many 'points' for promotion, which could be gotten from various things, including tournaments, seminars, etc.

I don't mind having to attend for a certain amount of experience (tournaments, seminars, etc) but I wouldn't want to be told that I "have" to attend any particular event.

 

[Manny]

I wasn't a competitor, in fact I think I compete in no more than 10 tournaments from green to black belt. TKD is a very competitive martial art, my fisrt tournament was as a green belt so I started not to early as you may see. I sparred in local and regional tournaments the most.

When I reached red belt status my sambonim told me to become a black belt I will HAVE to assit or teach a minimum of 100 hours and atenden 5 black belt tournaments as a minimum. As I wrote above I never been a competitor and sparr in 5 tournaments minimun in one year was a little harsh to me buy I'll have to so I did it.

In the actual dojang where I train and teach the students don't have to go tornaments to earn his black belt, offcourse it's desireable but no mandatory.

Manny

 

[miguksaram]

So,

My question is....have any of you ever had the displeasure of being told that, you HAVE to attend events (eg., tournaments, camps, seminars, etc.), or risk being passed over for promotion?!

I've never understood this policy! When the organization head tells school owners/instructors to MAKE their students compete, or they won't be considered for testing, to ME...seems wrong.

Now, I realize that it is a business....But come on. Encouraging students to compete, or attend camps is one thing, but FORCING them?! This just leaves a bitter taste in my mouth, where organizations are concerned.

Why is it wrong? If an instructor is upfront with a new student and says...hey you must attend these events if you are to considered for certain ranks...then what is the big deal? The student signs up knowing what is required of them.

Let's say they don't mention it. Ok..not a good policy, but none the less this is what is required. You don't agree with it..fine, you are more than welcome to leave and go to another school once you fulfill any contractual obligations.

 

[miguksaram]

I used to have a requirement that all students have to compete in one sparring tournament before they get promoted to 1st Dan. But I relaxed off that and don't require that anymore.

We are required to participate in at least two events per rank be it a inner school tournament or an outside school tournament. We have been let some students slide if tournaments were not available during their stint in a particular rank.

We have never had any complaints about this requirement.

 

[Nomad]

What's wrong with "compulsory fun"?

 

[11 Bravo Infantry]

Why is it wrong? If an instructor is upfront with a new student and says...hey you must attend these events if you are to considered for certain ranks...then what is the big deal? The student signs up knowing what is required of them.

Let's say they don't mention it. Ok..not a good policy, but none the less this is what is required. You don't agree with it..fine, you are more than welcome to leave and go to another school once you fulfill any contractual obligations.

Sorry if I struck a nerve. I love to compete. But I certainly don't want to be TOLD that I MUST compete, or be passed over for promotion. We all know what tournaments, camps and seminars are. I've seen students, who couldn't afford the aforementioned and barely could scrape up enough for tuition, who STILL were expected to shell out money for tourneys and camps. Or, again, NOT be considered for promotion!

And by the way, when I first started, years ago....I was never told of tournaments, camps and seminars being mandatory, or you wouldn't be considered for testing. If so, I would have walked. Like I said, encouraging students is one thing. But forcing them, is quite another entirely.

 

[miguksaram]

Sorry if I struck a nerve. I love to compete. But I certainly don't want to be TOLD that I MUST compete, or be passed over for promotion.

You did not strike a nerve, but if you don't like the policy...leave.

We all know what tournaments, camps and seminars are.

What are they?

I've seen students, who couldn't afford the aforementioned and barely could scrape up enough for tuition, who STILL were expected to shell out money for tourneys and camps. Or, again, NOT be considered for promotion!

Again, if this school was not upfront then yes..it is bad policy and people who do not want to follow the policy or can not afford the policy should have the option of being let out of any financial responsibilities to the school. HOWEVER....if in their contract it was so stated, then this falls into the buyer beware policy. Don't sign without reading.

And by the way, when I first started, years ago....I was never told of tournaments, camps and seminars being mandatory, or you wouldn't be considered for testing. If so, I would have walked. Like I said, encouraging students is one thing. But forcing them, is quite another entirely.

Now if requirements changed over the years during your stay there, the perhaps it is time to part ways if you do not agree with the policy change. If they are doing this for money then the best way to squash such a thing is leave and hit them where it hurts....their bottom line.

 

[Archangel M]

I fail to see what tournament competition has to offer vis a vis rank/experience other than advertising for the school or an ego boost for the instructor when tropheys are won.

I think that the "manditory" seminars about firearms, self-defense laws, etc as mentioned upthread have more value.

 

[puunui]

If an instructor is upfront with a new student and says...hey you must attend these events if you are to considered for certain ranks...then what is the big deal? The student signs up knowing what is required of them.

I remember in Judo everyone would compete at all of the tournaments, which were held pretty frequently. There wasn't any question about it, and we treated it like how players in any other sport treated games -- it was part of the experience. You naturally think that you will be suiting up and going to the game, and if you don't plan on going, you needed to tell the coach you are going to be absent.

 

[Bruno@MT]

What's wrong with "compulsory fun"?

The fact that it is compulsory.
What you think of as 'fun' may be something I really don't like.

 

[dancingalone]

I believe in judo you must compete to advance to dan rank. Apparently, there is precedent for the practice. I don't see a big deal myself so long as the requirements are revealed upfront. I can understand the OP getting a little chapped if this was added after he joined and had been training for a matter of years.

 

[sfs982000]

In my school they highly encourage competing in tournaments, which is fine, but not necessarily my cup of tea. I do know that I'll be limited as far as advancing higher than 2nd Dan by not competing, right or wrong I've accepted that. It was explained to my upfront and I do plan on crossing that bridge when I get to it. Right now I'm just enjoying the training I'm getting and making the most of it.
I would have to agree with the majority of the responses that if it wasn't explained up front that the individual would have a right to be upset, but if the instructors are honest up front the individuals only options are to keep shopping around for a school that fits what they're looking for or accept the terms.

 

[miguksaram]

I fail to see what tournament competition has to offer vis a vis rank/experience other than advertising for the school or an ego boost for the instructor when tropheys are won.

I think that the "manditory" seminars about firearms, self-defense laws, etc as mentioned upthread have more value.

So do you believe any type of competition is useless? Basketball, baseball, soccer, etc. Do you see all competition as just an outlet for those to boost their ego?

There are a lot more lessons to be learn in competition than just winning a piece of hard plastic. It is too bad you can't see that.

 

[miguksaram]

The fact that it is compulsory.
What you think of as 'fun' may be something I really don't like.

Then don't go to a school that has mandatory competition as a part of their belt requirements.

 

[miguksaram]

I believe in judo you must compete to advance to dan rank. Apparently, there is precedent for the practice. I don't see a big deal myself so long as the requirements are revealed upfront. I can understand the OP getting a little chapped if this was added after he joined and had been training for a matter of years.

Yes, I could see being upset as well. However, things change and if you disagree with those changes then leave. If enough students quit due to this change then the school owners may very well get the hint that they need to re-evaluate that part of their requirement.