Kim Jong Il Reported Dead

[Bill Mattocks]

Got it from the Lance Corporal Underground; now they're talking about it on TV. Interesting to see what happens now. If China backs his #3 son, Kim Jong Un (?), then there should be a transition. Otherwise, Hexagram 23 - Breaking Apart. Stay tuned.

 

[David43515]

I just saw on Yahoo news that the state-run media is rerunning alot of old footage of the old man and his son reviewing troops and live fire exercises together. Looks to me like they`re trying to bouy up the son`s legitimacy. I know lots of folks are curious how it`ll turn out.

 

[Omar B]

So whats the over/under on him showing up on South Park as Satan's newest homo-love in the next few weeks.

 

[MAist25]

hmmm, I didn't even know Kim Jong was Il.....

 

[Omar B]

hmmm, I didn't even know Kim Jong was Il.....

 

[billc]

I loved him in Team America.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Got it from the Lance Corporal Underground; now they're talking about it on TV. Interesting to see what happens now. If China backs his #3 son, Kim Jong Un (?), then there should be a transition. Otherwise, Hexagram 23 - Breaking Apart. Stay tuned.

From what I heard the PRC view is that the son is either a puppet or soon to fall to a general in the wings, basically they don't know...or don't want anyone to know they know.

Other than that the Chinese government has little control over what happens in Pyongyang these days and it has been that way for several years

 

[Bill Mattocks]

As North Korea is a supporter of terrorist activity, including being a supplier of nuclear technology and material, along with conventional weapons, I think we should tactically nuke their nuclear sites. Rubblize 'em. Move the Patriots up to stop any Scud-type missiles they try to lob into South Korea, but basically make it clear they can unify with South Korea or be pulverized, their choice. I suspect most of 'em want unification anyway; it's only the military leaders that want to keep their cushy jobs. Take their only big toys away and then 'negotiate'. If there was ever a time to nuke the crap out of them, this would be it.

 

[Xue Sheng]

As North Korea is a supporter of terrorist activity, including being a supplier of nuclear technology and material, along with conventional weapons, I think we should tactically nuke their nuclear sites. Rubblize 'em. Move the Patriots up to stop any Scud-type missiles they try to lob into South Korea, but basically make it clear they can unify with South Korea or be pulverized, their choice. I suspect most of 'em want unification anyway; it's only the military leaders that want to keep their cushy jobs. Take their only big toys away and then 'negotiate'. If there was ever a time to nuke the crap out of them, this would be it.

Problem is that that even though Pyongyang has not been listening to Beijing if you nuke anything in North Korea Beijing will be forces to respond, bigtime, and I am not sure I want to take the planet down that road.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Problem is that that even though Pyongyang has not been listening to Beijing if you nuke anything in North Korea Beijing will be forces to respond, bigtime, and I am not sure I want to take the planet down that road.

I think we can convince China to stand down and let it happen. They're not that happy with the bat-**** crazy dictator thing anymore either.

 

[Tez3]

Problem is that that even though Pyongyang has not been listening to Beijing if you nuke anything in North Korea Beijing will be forces to respond, bigtime, and I am not sure I want to take the planet down that road.

It would be hard to keep the nuclear fallout to North Korea, besides the North Korean people are suffering, should we destroy them as well?

 

[Bill Mattocks]

It would be hard to keep the nuclear fallout to North Korea, besides the North Korean people are suffering, should we destroy them as well?

Tactical low-yield nukes, not ICBM's. A B61 on an F-16 fighter should do the trick. Take out the nuclear facilities North Korea has; they're far from population centers.

Drop one right here: 39.781543, 125.753583

 

[Tez3]

Tactical low-yield nukes, not ICBM's. A B61 on an F-16 fighter should do the trick. Take out the nuclear facilities North Korea has; they're far from population centers.

Low yield as compared to what? People complain that the world expects America to be it's policeman but you seem awfully keen to interfere with other countries and bomb the hell out of them. How would you feel if a country said that America should be nuked? For all that Korea is a lousy place with a dictorship, it still isn't up to America to use gunboat diplomacy. What actually gives you the right to bomb North Korea or even want to for that matter?
Are you also going to bomb Pakistan, France, Isreal, the UK etc as we all also have a nuclear capacity? What happens if one day your government decides the UK is a threat because it doesn't like our government? Are you going to bomb us into submission?

 

[Xue Sheng]

It would be hard to keep the nuclear fallout to North Korea, besides the North Korean people are suffering, should we destroy them as well?

No we shouldn't destroy them or anyone else for that matter, I don't think a nuke is the answer. Actually I feel it would only make things worse, a WHOLE lot worse on a global scale and I don't want to go there

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Low yield as compared to what? People complain that the world expects America to be it's policeman but you seem awfully keen to interfere with other countries and bomb the hell out of them. How would you feel if a country said that America should be nuked? For all that Korea is a lousy place with a dictorship, it still isn't up to America to use gunboat diplomacy. What actually gives you the right to bomb North Korea or even want to for that matter?
Are you also going to bomb Pakistan, France, Isreal, the UK etc as we all also have a nuclear capacity? What happens if one day your government decides the UK is a threat because it doesn't like our government? Are you going to bomb us into submission?

North Korea is a threat to world peace because it was - until yesterday - headed by a completely insane madman who was transferring advanced weaponry to terrorist groups and transferring nuclear technology to rogue nations that would not be able to get it otherwise (Iran, for example). There was always a reason not to remove their nuclear capability while crazy-boy was in charge, and there may soon be a reason not to again once his crazy-boy son takes the reins. Now would be a good time to stabilize the region. It would not require ground troops on an invasion of any kind. There is nothing wrong with the average North Korean; except they're starving. Once their power to intimidate other nations is gone, the borders will fall. Korea will unify, the US can leave the demilitarized zone where we currently have more than 50,000 active-duty US troops at all times, and we can put a stop to terrorists and rogue nations like Iran buying their weaponry from North Korea. Everybody wins.

Try to remember; the Korean Police Action (aka, the Korean War) never ended. There is a truce in place, as it has been since the 1950's. Not a treaty, not a peace declaration, but a truce. We are at war with North Korea. Now is a good time to put the capper on that. An opportunity like this may not come again in our lifetimes. The time to strike is when the opportunity presents itself.

 

[Xue Sheng]

I think we can convince China to stand down and let it happen. They're not that happy with the bat-**** crazy dictator thing anymore either.

Yes they have had enough of North Korea but I seriously doubt wecould convince them to stand down and allow us to nuke North Korea. They werenot and still are not happy about us having a military presence that close tothem during the Korean War.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

No we shouldn't, I don't think a nuke is the answer. Actually I feel it would only make things worse, a WHOLE lot worse on a global scale and I don't want to go there

I don't want North Korea continuing to dispense ever-more-dangerous weaponry and nuclear technology to terrorists and rogue nations.

http://www.cfr.org/state-sponsors-of-terrorism/state-sponsors-north-korea/p9364

It has been reported that North Korea sold ballistic-missile technology to Iran and Syria, both of which are on the U.S. State department’s list of sponsors of terrorism, and Libya, which was removed from the list in 2006. North Korean missile technology has also been transferred to Pakistan and Yemen. The alleged missile sales represent a prime concern for the U.S.-led “war on terrorism,” expanding the range of receiving nations that could potentially deploy their own chemical, biological, or nuclear weapons. Yet the sales also generate much needed income for North Korea, allowing it to further its own military research and development. Following a September 2007 Israeli air strike in Syria, some analysts speculated that Pyongyang had sold nuclear material to Damascus, which Israel then discovered and destroyed.

Remove their fangs, do it now. Do it fast, do it hard, do not ask for permission, and then dictate terms for a peaceful reintegration with South Korea, which full cooperation with China, who only wants a buffer zone against the US, free trade inside North Korea, and a lack of distraction from it's military buildup. China is not ready to confront us militarily - but it will be soon. Strike now; dictate terms; achieve peace.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Yes they have had enough of North Korea but I seriously doubt wecould convince them to stand down and allow us to nuke North Korea. They werenot and still are not happy about us having a military presence that close tothem during the Korean War.

No more North Korea - no more Korean War. No more Korean War, no more US troops, per UN mandate. Simple.

 

[Xue Sheng]

No more North Korea - no more Korean War. No more Korean War, no more US troops, per UN mandate. Simple.

Bill... I can only read this as you are trying to start something or play devil’s advocate because I find it hard to believe you actually believe any of this...

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Bill... I can only read this as you are trying to start something or play devil’s advocate because I find it hard to believe you actually believe any of this...

I believe it quite seriously. I am a conservative and favor peace over war, but not peace at any cost. North Korea is a clear and present danger; far more than Iraq was when we invaded it.

Consider the alternatives...

Do nothing - North Korea implodes through internal military strife over succession, or at the very least becomes very unstable for a very long time. Nuclear weapons available, like Libya's arsenals are even now being looted by terrorists and those who would sell to them; difference is, NK has nukes, biological, and chemical weapons of mass destruction; demonstrated capability via their nuclear detonations. This is not make-um-up Iraq WMD, this is the real thing.

Do nothing - North Korea gets a new leader, and he continues building up their nukes because it is their only real bargaining chip. Military supports him because with this structure, they eat, they get paid, they live well, while the rest of the country (the 99%?) are literally and not figuratively starving to death.

Do nothing - North Korea gets a new leader who decides to negotiate in good faith for peaceful change, including real (this time, unlike 100's of times before) nuclear disarmament and inspection, open borders, free trade, and so on.

Can you think of any other alternatives? If the three above are the basic three possible outcomes to doing nothing, then I strongly advocate attack. First, WE ARE STILL AT WAR. We do not need Congressional approval, we do not need a UN declaration, nothing. We are at war. Second, NK has never honored one of it's agreements with the rest of the world; not one. They practice brinksmanship; that's their game. And it's worked for them. I have a hard time believing they are about to turn over a new leaf. They didn't when the fat dead guy took over from his fat dead guy dad. And third, if we do nothing and they continue to build nukes and sell nuclear technology and weapons to terrorists and rogue nations, one day the USA or the UK will be nuked by one of their bombs. Unacceptable, period. Nuke them now; remove the fangs. End the war. Bring the troops home. Open the borders so their starving millions can be fed. Time to put this nonsense behind us forever. I'm not up for another generation of bat*****crazy lunatics kidnapping movie directors to make personal Godzilla movies (yes, he did that) and selling nuclear technology to Iran. Screw that. End it today.