I'm tired of styles.

[Kung Fu Wang]

Letting someone have a grip without disrupting something in their structure would be a good way to get yourself thrown in any grappling work. That grip isn’t there just so they can rest their tired arm.

For grip fight, the Chinese wrestling uses the following strategy:

1. Break your opponent's 1st grip.
2. Break his 2nd grip.
3. At this moment you have 1 grip on him, but he has no grip on you.
4. When he tries to obtain his 1st grip on you, you deflect his arm, move in, obtain your 2nd grip, and apply your throw.
5. If you fail, repeat the same process all over again.

Does Judo use similar strategy? I don't know. May be that's why "style does make difference".

 

[Gerry Seymour]

For grip fight, the Chinese wrestling uses the following strategy:

1. Break your opponent's 1st grip.
2. Break his 2nd grip.
3. At this moment you have 1 grip on him, but he has no grip on you.
4. When he tries to obtain his 1st grip on you, you deflect his arm, move in, obtain your 2nd grip, and apply your throw.
5. If you fail, repeat the same process all over again.

Does Judo use similar strategy? I don't know. May be that's why "style does make difference".

I don't see any reason that would conflict with the principles I know from Judo, but someone with deeper experience in it would be better equipped to respond. For me, if I can leave their grips attached and still break down their structure sufficiently (including by hitting them), I'd rather do that (can't get punched with any hand that is busy grabbing me, and arms are easy to catch when they are static relative to my body, and I have two reasonable attachment points already to use to move them). If I can't break down their structure, I'll release one of their grips and use that arm to break down their structure. If they manage to escape with that arm, I'll use the remaining attachment point against them. Of course, if they are skilled, they have opportunities to use similar principles along the way to disrupt my plans.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Does Judo use similar strategy? I don't know.

Yep. Fighting for grips is a huge part of Judo competition. I've got an instructional video I need to re-watch that's just about that topic and nothing else.

 

[JowGaWolf]

For me, if I can leave their grips attached and still break down their structure sufficiently (including by hitting them), I'd rather do that (can't get punched with any hand that is busy grabbing me, and arms are easy to catch when they are static relative to my body, and I have two reasonable attachment points already to use to move them).

CMA has techniques where if they grab you then they don't get that hand back. The techniques require that you make their hands stick to your body as you perform a counter.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Yep. Fighting for grips is a huge part of Judo competition. I've got an instructional video I need to re-watch that's just about that topic and nothing else.

Hmmm...sounds like stuff to play with. I need to get my hands on something like that - my students will hate it!

 

[Gerry Seymour]

CMA has techniques where if they grab you then they don't get that hand back. The techniques require that you make their hands stick to your body as you perform a counter.

We have a couple of those, too. I can think of variations of 5 techniques (okay, so technically, not "a couple" - sue me ) off the top of my head where we do this.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

CMA has techniques where if they grab you then they don't get that hand back. The techniques require that you make their hands stick to your body as you perform a counter.

Here is one example.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

We may have different experience here. I have not met/seen any Judo guy ever moves his shoulder back to "tear apart" my grip.

As far as I know, the

- cross lapel grip, and
- fist punch on the shoulder,

both are not allowed in Judo.

Do you have any clip for that?

Here you go.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Here you go.

I haven't followed rules changes in Judo. When I see videos like that, I realize I couldn't begin to compete in Judo without extensive retraining to the rules. All anyone would have to do is grip fight with me, and I'd give up sufficient penalty points for them to win.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Here you go.

Thanks for showing this clip.

IMO, just to pull your shoulder back may not be enough to break a strong break. If you "push punch" at your opponent's shoulder while pulling the other side shoulder back, you can generate much more power.

Does Judo allow this "push punch"?

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I haven't followed rules changes in Judo. When I see videos like that, I realize I couldn't begin to compete in Judo without extensive retraining to the rules. All anyone would have to do is grip fight with me, and I'd give up sufficient penalty points for them to win.

I had concentrated on the "grip fight" one time. Within 15 minutes, my opponent could not get any grip on me. In the striking art, if I can prevent my opponent from landing any punches on me for 5 minutes, I will be very happy.

To know the maximum ability of your own defensive skill is fun.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

IMO, just to pull your shoulder back may not be enough to break a strong break. If you "push punch" at your opponent's shoulder while pulling the other side shoulder back, you can generate much more power.

Does Judo allow this "push punch"?

I'm not sure whether current Judo rules would prohibit such a technique or not. My best guess is that it would depend on whether it was clearly a push rather than a strike.

In any case, the Judo version accomplishes much the same thing with the grip on the opponent's sleeve. By locking the opponent's arm in place with your grip on his sleeve, you can keep his hand from following you when you step back and pull your lapel out of his grip. I guess that's not an option in Shuai Jiao, since you wear short sleeves for competition.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I guess that's not an option in Shuai Jiao, since you wear short sleeves for competition.

After 1.30 in the following clip, the Judo girl put on SC jacket and asked the SC guy to put on Judo Gi.

Between 6,16 - 6.31, is the traditional SC initial circle running footwork.

 

[TheArtofDave]

The simplest explanation is to stick to one core martial art. Like Wing Chun or Shotokan for example. That way you could call yourself a purist